Official thread: Should descents be a factor in GC/ are Tour's descents too dangerous

[hrotha]

Can't believe this is even an issue. Why, because Andy said it? Why aren't all the living cycling legends putting him to shame?

 

[biokemguy]

Mtn Bikers don't seem to mind

No they're not too dangerous...the skilled riders did just fine.
The two riders who dominated today's descent(Evans and Hesjedal) are both ex Mtn bikers.
Maybe those who can't descend well should train on a different kind of bike in the off season.

 

[Scansorial]

One could have made an argument that the Crostis was too dangerous, but what was especially dangerous about Stage 16's descent? Sure it was technical and the road was wet, but that's bike racing.

 

[jobiwan]

Answer to Poll is NO.

Descents are part of cycling, an exciting part at that.

 

[roundabout]

Yes.

No.

No in the poll.

 

[iridedaily]

Race to the conditions

Descents and crosswinds, they are danger signs. As a coach you always instruct the athletes to race to the conditions at hand. These are the best professional cyclist's in the world and should be capable of making the right decision at any moment. Andy Schleck raced yesterday with the only confidence he has in his ability. Perhaps he needs to review the route more closely and work on the skills he is worst at that are likely to have a significant impact on his performance.

 

[autologous]

Both Andy Schleck and Alberto Contador are concerned about the descent of the Pra Martino in Wednesday's stage. After Andy Schleck's poor descent today lost him 1:06 on Contador we offer up this topic for discussion.

Unbelievable.
Instead of offering it up for discussion, cyclingnews should be writing an editorial ridiculing the notion that descents shouldn't be a factor in a bicycle race.

 

[red_flanders]

but that was 21 seconds in what, 3km? and he lost a further 40 seconds over 11km of the descent.

On that basis his losses on the climbs were worse than on the descent. Another 11km of climbing and he could theoretically lost a further 1m20 seconds on top, so 1m40 all together.

I agree, it would appear he's going to get annihilated on stage 18.

 

[Parrulo]

I didn't see anything in the article to suggest Contador's concerned about the descent. The quote was "If you are not ready you can lose the Tour there" - he was obviously talking about Schleck (choose either one)!

^^that as well. . .

 

[Trofinios]

Thank god Andy isn't a sprinter, he would have called for a ban on sprint stages: they are way too dangerous in the final...

 

[Ragerod]

Providing the roads are well maintained and don't have bumps or pot holes that put the cyclists in unnecessary danger then the inclusion of any descent is fine. Descending is a skill and deserves to be there as the GC winner should prove he is capable in any situation. If Andy Schleck finds it difficult then he should include the descents in his reconnaissance trips before the tour so he knows what to expect.

Although I would like to see more use of signs, as witnessed on the descent to Grindelwald in the Tour de Suisse. It should be feasible and would allow riders to see how sharp blind corners are.

 

[UpTheRoad]

Can't believe this is even an issue. Why, because Andy said it? Why aren't all the living cycling legends putting him to shame?

Just great. AS said it, and now the Three Stooges will be on the bandwagon to get descents out of the Tour. Bobke will be even more inane than ever and Paul will grate like never before. Phil will be a bit more tempered.

 

[red_flanders]

I was watching the descent of the Aubisque the other day, and that's a pretty gnarly descent. Near the top, in several places, if you miss a turn or have a mechanical coming 'round a corner you are dead. Period.

No one complains about that because it's been in the Tour for a century.

 

[Dead Star]

I was watching the descent of the Aubisque the other day, and that's a pretty gnarly descent. Near the top, in several places, if you miss a turn or have a mechanical coming 'round a corner you are dead. Period.

No one complains about that because it's been in the Tour for a century.

Indeed. Crucial factor also being AS wasn't dropped and subsequently terrified to take risks on the wet roads that await him.

 

[Arnout]

I was watching the descent of the Aubisque the other day, and that's a pretty gnarly descent. Near the top, in several places, if you miss a turn or have a mechanical coming 'round a corner you are dead. Period.

No one complains about that because it's been in the Tour for a century.

And no-one dies.

Cars riding there every day.

Come on its just a decent. If you don't brake, you crash. Brake in time, problem solved.

 

[avantage]

Every descent is dangerous.
I did a number of big descents in the Dolomites, where a large number of cyclist passed me, probably lost 15minutes in total going downhill.
You should not go faster than what you're comfortable with.

Of course Andy & Frank don't want to loose time, but why deny other's chances to gain time on time?

 

[Libertine Seguros]

Can't believe this is even an issue. Why, because Andy said it? Why aren't all the living cycling legends putting him to shame?

Or even ignoring the legends, how about:

David Arroyo Durán
Ivan Basso
Levi Leipheimer
Damiano Cunego
Laurens Ten Dam
Lars Ytting Bak
Jens Voigt
Daniel Navarro
Andrey Zeits
Simon Gerrans
Sylwester Szmyd
Andriy Hryvko
Paolo Tiralongo
Arnold Jeannesson
Pavel Brutt
Addy Engels
Alessandro Vanotti
Manuel Quinziato
Ben Swift
Alessandro Petacchi
Tom Danielson
Fabian Cancellara
Matteo Bono
David Millar
Steve Morabito
Mark Cavendish
Maarten Tjallingii
Sébastien Hinault
Anthony Charteau
Philippe Gilbert
Tyler Farrar
Thomas Voeckler
Mikhail Ignatiev
Edvald Boasson Hagen
Jelle Vanendert
Matthew Harley Goss
Danny Pate
Dries Devenyns
Yohann Gène
Julian Dean
Mark Renshaw



- all of them finished the 2009 Giro stage which featured the very same descent.

 

[VeloGirl]

Dim said 93% of forum members agreed on something. Had to come check it out for myself.

I voted No - but that is a general No. There are some descents where the road is so slim and over the cliff could mean death.

Every time the riders descend some sketchy stretch, I immediately think John Lee Augustyn riding off the side of Col de la Bonette-Restefond

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v6ukTXr0CjA

 

[Winterfold]

Closed roads, resurfaced roads, a professional peloton, the guys whining should come and ride/race with the rest of us.

Descending is a skill and it is important that it has an influence in races else it is just about genetics and fitness. We might as well watch a marathon in that case.

I really dont want to moan about Schlecket and add to the general flak the guy is getting, but he needs to man up. The 'second best stage racer in the world' (who has never won a stage race) has to realise you go down hills once youve gone up them.

I was a ****e descender in my category and relative to my peers, so I got an MTB, did some skills coaching, went down some steep descents and now I am schorchio (in my cat and relative to my peers).

A lot of Schlecklet's whining would be resolved if the dude raced more often.

He needs to do the Paris-Roubaix with Wiggo and MTFU.

 

[brianf7]

What goes up has to eventualy come down if you got vertigo then take it easy otherwise go for it.

Its no use to anyone including your self if you are the best climber if you cant decend.

they have all year to practice practice !!

 

[Arnout]

It's funny, when I am riding in the mountains I tend to find the road uphill more difficult than downhill

 

[roundabout]

Or even ignoring the legends, how about:

David Arroyo Durán
Ivan Basso
Levi Leipheimer
Damiano Cunego
Laurens Ten Dam
Lars Ytting Bak
Jens Voigt
Daniel Navarro
Andrey Zeits
Simon Gerrans
Sylwester Szmyd
Andriy Hryvko
Paolo Tiralongo
Arnold Jeannesson
Pavel Brutt
Addy Engels
Alessandro Vanotti
Manuel Quinziato
Ben Swift
Alessandro Petacchi
Tom Danielson
Fabian Cancellara
Matteo Bono
David Millar
Steve Morabito
Mark Cavendish
Maarten Tjallingii
Sébastien Hinault
Anthony Charteau
Philippe Gilbert
Tyler Farrar
Thomas Voeckler
Mikhail Ignatiev
Edvald Boasson Hagen
Jelle Vanendert
Matthew Harley Goss
Danny Pate
Dries Devenyns
Yohann Gène
Julian Dean
Mark Renshaw



- all of them finished the 2009 Giro stage which featured the very same descent.

That's a fair point however my guess would be that most of them went down at a speed Schleck could manage because they had nothing to race for.

Also I haven't watched that stage but people like Menchov and Sastre finished pretty high up so it can't be that bad.

 

[Dead Star]

Dim said 93% of forum members agreed on something. Had to come check it out for myself.

I voted No - but that is a general No. There are some descents where the road is so slim and over the cliff could mean death.

Every time the riders descend some sketchy stretch, I immediately think John Lee Augustyn riding off the side of Col de la Bonette-Restefond

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v6ukTXr0CjA

You reminded me of Frank's crash in the 2008 TdS (Can't believe it was that long ago! Time flies)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0O5d94P6JGo

Frank was very lucky, but he just got on with it.

 

[davestoller]

Andy saying the race shouldnt be decided on the descents is such poor sportsmanship.

Everyone knows it is a critical component of riding grand tours.
Salvoldelli? The Giro anyone?

No, the problem is he is a head case and ANNOUNCED he was afraid of the descent in an interview on the rest day.

FAIL
FAIL
FAIL
FAIL

And its NOT about being tall.
Sean Yates was he greatest descender and he's like 6'10" or something and rides a 67 inch frame.
I didnt see Ryder Hesjedal complaining, isnt he like 6'6" or something.

I am so glad they cracked.

You cracked Andy, admit it. After cracking on a climb and going over the top, it ALWAYS makes descending harder because your breathing is all messed up--and as anyone who has ever done wicked descents on bikes and skiis knows--its all about the breathing and not locking up--in addition to bike handling, balance, vision etc

 

[fuggles]

No.

Ok, it's official: I hate AS.

Its part of cycling, deal with it. Everyone has their weak points as a rider. He is no different in that respect. The difference is we all don't go around complaining about how unfair it is - we train to get better at it. I don't lobby my local legislature to get chair lifts installed on the local hills.

The thing that really ****es me off is this guy is 26 and a top athlete in his sport. All things considered he has it damn good. And hes going around complaining about an integral part of his sport.

I don't recall who said it, but a short time ago a rider said something to the effect of: "cycling is starting to be filled with little girls". Here's more evidence of that.