Papp you are a damn Joke!

[pedaling squares]

This whole anti-"snitch" mentality was invented by bullies who want free rein to do whatever they want and criminals who want insurance. Screw that.

Yes it was. Well put.

 

[dolophonic]

Woah Swordsman, Floyd said that ? Deep.

 

[Anonymous]

I have nothing but praise for Jonathan Chodroff's decision to accept responsibility for his actions," said Papp. "He made a mistake - albeit a costly one - but unlike at least one of his colleagues in the US pro peloton, Jonathan stood up and took it like a man."

What a guy Joe. you sell this crap to athletes, line your pockets and now you crap on about the fact you have nothing but praise for their actions in admitting their mistakes??!!

"Took it like a man":?? if it weren't for people like you, guys like him would not be in the predicament that they are in via the drug dealing enterprises of you and others like you.
.
You criticize "his colleagues" yet it is low lifes like you that are the real villains here, not the riders.

Now you have the audacity to preach on the evils of drug taking, it makes me sick.

Omerta lovers everywhere adore your reasoning.

 

[drb716]

Of course his testimony is good for the sport - few would argue with that; but don't forget his motive. Dealing while suspended... one would think his primary rationale is to reduce or avoid the five-to-ten years he's facing.
A cynical view? Yes, but we'll most likely see LA, LL, and GH do the same. Who wouldn't give up names to avoid the rigors of prison? Clearly, few have Chodroff's sense of responsibility when not faced with a greater threat, or at least the chance of minimizing the consequences.

 

[Anonymous]

Err, I don't think anyone has ever condoned Joe's conduct in terms of supplying drugs. I'm quite sure everyone believes that Joe should take any punishment the legal system delivers him.

But again, I fail to see how that makes his position today somehow bad (worse than saying nothing?). It's mind boggling that certain people are against former cyclists speaking out about doping, it's almost as though they prefer the status quo.

+1

They either don't want to know who's involved or they are involved and don't want you to know. Just pathetic.

 

[Berzin]

It's mind boggling that certain people are against former cyclists speaking out about doping, it's almost as though they prefer the status quo.

Cycling is a very homogeneous sport in America. Think about it this way-the Americans that went to Europe to race in 1993-94, supposedly the vanguard of a new generation with Armstrong and Hincapie, all have dirt that either has been or will be uncovered.

Consider the list-Zabriskie, Van De Velde, Andreu, Hamilton, Landis, etc. There isn't an American rider who rode in Europe in the last 15 years who wasn't or isn't implicated in some type of doping scandal.

In other words, there isn't another American rider after Lemond who found any type of success in Europe clean. And now with the Joe Papp list out, it seems the local scene was and is just as putrid.

So who can American amateur cyclists and enthusiasts look up to in their sport? Who can they pass on their unrealistic athletic aspirations onto? Who can they look in the mirror and say "yes, he is just like me, only better"? Who can they desire their sons to grow up like?

The fanboy's desire to drag down those who are providing information are engaging in a cynical and pathetic attempt at reworking reality based on the dreams and desires they couldn't achieve themselves. They figure, if not me, then Armstrong. Because he looks like me and represents everything about America that made it great.

He is the yuppie superhero, the corporate Juggernaught who kicks *** and takes names. The Ari Gold of the cycling world.

He isn't just good, nor just great-he is transcendent. And our heroes must be bigger than life. We demand nothing less from them.

This pack of disillusioned fanboys who vicariously live through Armstrong have, in their impotent rage, only internet forums to vent their hostility. So they come here like yakking hyenas and spew their disingenuous bile, because here they find an audience that doesn't exist in the real world.

 

[Race Radio]

It appears we have more posters who are graduates of the Tony Soprano school of ethics.

Does anyone really think the if Joe just kept quite and took his 10 years in prison that would have changed anything? Does any rational person think that the Feds did not raid his house and seize his computer, billing and shipping info, etc.

Joe keeps quite and still a bunch of guys get busted so step down off the soapbox.

 

[forty four]

Indeed, and I'm sure Joe is treating everyone the same, and how he would like to be treated as a former doper and supplier of dope. If Lance Armstrong came out tomorrow and admitted, gave up everything, and helped reveal those corrupt in the sport then we would all have to respect that move no matter how much he is despised for his past.

why would we have to respect that? who raised you people my god.
you can come out and come clean about your own actions i have no issue with that and can respect that. coming out and ratting on the people you worked together with to get to where you got is pathetic on the highest level and is done to lesson the penalties for the rat. dont forget landis came out only after blackmail attempts to get in the toc failed he is a scumbag whos only concern is self interest same as the one you hate no difference.

 

[forty four]

its also funny how honest people get in the court room. like if they had not been busted they would still be singing like birds and talking morality rofl. some people on here are naive like children no common sense like devote religious people same thing.

 

[mastersracer]

it's not Papp's plea-bargaining; it's his NPD that's so disturbing to people:

narcissistic personality disorder (NPD) they must meet five or more of the following symptoms:

Has a grandiose sense of self-importance (e.g., exaggerates achievements and talents, expects to be recognized as superior without commensurate achievements)
Is preoccupied with fantasies of unlimited success, power, brilliance, beauty, or ideal love
Believes that he or she is "special" and unique and can only be understood by, or should associate with, other special or high-status people (or institutions).
Rarely acknowledges mistakes and/or imperfections
Requires excessive admiration
Has a sense of entitlement, i.e., unreasonable expectations of especially favorable treatment or automatic compliance with his or her expectations
Is interpersonally exploitative, i.e., takes advantage of others to achieve his or her own ends
Lacks empathy: is unwilling or unable to recognize or identify with the feelings and needs of others.
Is often envious of others or believes that others are envious of him or her
Shows arrogant, haughty behaviors or attitude.

 

[Anonymous]

why would we have to respect that? who raised you people my god.
you can come out and come clean about your own actions i have no issue with that and can respect that. coming out and ratting on the people you worked together with to get to where you got is pathetic on the highest level and is done to lesson the penalties for the rat. dont forget landis came out only after blackmail attempts to get in the toc failed he is a scumbag whos only concern is self interest same as the one you hate no difference.

Yes. You just have to hate those that would want to stop future generations from being forced to make the same terrible decisions that Joe and Floyd made. Those guys are rats.

 

[forty four]

So the fact that he's helping uncover his own drug ring makes him the bad guy? Calling someone a snitch for turning over his list of clients that are breaking the rules is ridiculous, he's helping to clean up the sport! Granted, he helped create the problem in the first place, but at least he's trying to help fix his own (and others') mess now that he has seen the error of his ways. As far as I'm concerned, he's no worse than an undercover cop who "rats out" the crooks he's been investigating. Sure, they think he's a snitch and hate him for it, but those of us who have always raced clean should be applauding him for being the one "rat" who has the balls to name names and point fingers. Even if he's only doing it to get a lighter sentence it's worth it if he uncovers a bunch of cheaters.

dont even know where to begin on posts like these wow.

 

[Ferminal]

dont even know where to begin on posts like these wow.

English is usually best read left to right, top to bottom.

 

[Moose McKnuckles]

The closer we get to actually doing something about doping in cycling, the more shrill the monkeys become.

I too have to wonder about all of the resistance...

Exactly. This investigation is turning over lot of stones and the worms are not happy.

 

[Greyhound Velo]

dont even know where to begin on posts like these wow.

Please do, I'd love to hear your rationalization of Papp being the bad guy for helping the police and/or USADA bust a bunch of dopers. The only logical reason for attitudes like yours are that you or your teammates are on Joe's list of customers, otherwise you're just another apologist for dopers everywhere.

 

[Master50]

Blaming the dealer for the customer's action is just a deflection of responsibility. Everybody here is an adult and therefore capable of taking responsibility for their own actions. No one is saying joe came over to my house every couple of days and stuck a needle in my **** then took a bunch of money from my wallet.
Looks like a consenting relationship to me. Those athlete sought joe out and got what they bargained for. Equally culpable and any "he is the greater villain" is just an attempt to make the customer appear a victim.

 

[mitchman]

My big problem with guys like Joe Papp isn’t with his working with the feds…..It’s his willingness to seek out more attention for himself…..It’s the “Frank Burns” syndrome.

 

[veloracer]

Joe Papp dealt drugs. Knew exactly what he was doing. Cashed payment checks all the way to the bank... and now to prison.

 

[khardung la]

My big problem with guys like Joe Papp isn’t with his working with the feds…..It’s his willingness to seek out more attention for himself…..It’s the “Frank Burns” syndrome.

I feel a bit like that also. I am happy the guy is cooperating, but that is THE LEAST he could do. Incidentally, he is probably not doing it voluntarily but because of the pressure from the feds. IMHO he is just doing what he is forced to do after willingly being involved in criminal activity. I am not impressed by that. Anyway I wish him luck in the future and I am happy his actions are helping to clean the sport (now)

That is probably why I never liked St. Paul: from worst enemy to egocentric biggest defender, no middle term

 

[Mach Schnell]

Y'know, the best scenario for cycling would for the Powers That Be to pull a Khmer Rouge/year zero sort of thing. From this date forward, zero tolerance. Forget the past. Its done, over. Its wasting a lot of time and money. If LA goes down because of all of this, while making a lot of people happy, it would not be a good thing for cycling in general.

 

[Mellow Velo]

The Omerta boys aren't really concerned with what motivates Joe to turn whistleblower, just what he has to say.
This is cycling, not the mafia.
Following the Cosa Nostra code can only appeal to those who fear
what may be revealed.

 

[Animal]

If LA goes down because of all of this ... it would not be a good thing for cycling in general.

Why?

He's one rider. It would make absolutely zero difference to anyone but ball polishers.

 

[sublimit]

Joe Papp dealt drugs. Knew exactly what he was doing. Cashed payment checks all the way to the bank... and now to prison.

Maybe he can get to share a cell with the fat Irish imbecile Mcquaid.

Joe sounds OK, but a lot of people are getting on his case for god knows what. the fact world is full of **** is the only answer.

 

[Moose McKnuckles]

Y'know, the best scenario for cycling would for the Powers That Be to pull a Khmer Rouge/year zero sort of thing. From this date forward, zero tolerance. Forget the past. Its done, over. Its wasting a lot of time and money. If LA goes down because of all of this, while making a lot of people happy, it would not be a good thing for cycling in general.

No. That's a bad idea. It's not good for cycling. Should we also do the same thing with pedophile priests? Banks that are "too big to fail" and made stupid decisions? It's moral hazard issue. Riders will know that they've been bailed out once, and they'll be bailed out again.

 

[theswordsman]

Y'know, the best scenario for cycling would for the Powers That Be to pull a Khmer Rouge/year zero sort of thing. From this date forward, zero tolerance. Forget the past. Its done, over. Its wasting a lot of time and money. If LA goes down because of all of this, while making a lot of people happy, it would not be a good thing for cycling in general.

Nope. Nope. Nope. This is way bigger than Armstrong, and all of the international investigations need to run their course. Good things are happening in mainstream media and by agencies outside of cycling. They tried to tell us a few years ago to forget the old times, because the new riders were clean. Then bang, Ricco, Schumacher, Kohl, Sella, and we knew it was all BS. The Biological Passport is a joke. The sport gets cleaned up by police, European doping agencies, Interpol, and the court system. The pressure is on, the right things are happening, and it's definitely not the time to say "never mind".