Merckx is not the all time great period , i could not tell you why here because it involved in doping but he is not the all time great , the best is Coppi
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I can tell you that any of Coppi, Merckx and other classic greats would have a much smaller palmares if they were racing today.nairoman said:
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he is not stopping people from racing,he just says they are reckless (which they are) - people on this very forum always complain about the likes of bouhanni and how dangerous he is...but god forbid when an actuall rider complains about dangerous riding? cmon man
King Boonen said:
he is not stopping people from racing,he just says they are reckless (which they are) - people on this very forum always complain about the likes of bouhanni and how dangerous he is...but god forbid when an actuall rider complains about dangerous riding? cmon man
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Hes complaining about too many sprint trains and it appears he thinks that people should just hang back and let the big names duke it out. Tough luck Sagan, deal with it.
saganftw said:
Hes complaining about too many sprint trains and it appears he thinks that people should just hang back and let the big names duke it out. Tough luck Sagan, deal with it.
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thats what many argue as well - that teams like SKY should fck off the front of the peloton in last KMs of a sprint finish,there are just too many people wanting to be on the front including all the sprint trains ...not just sprinters but sprint trains
just look at stage 1 we already had a crash in sprint finish,its not like he is making this up - its happening and it will happen in this stage you are watching right now...hopefully noone crashes this time
and btw he is the last person who should be concerned by this,considering he barely crashes...so him speaking about it is not just for his own benefit
King Boonen said:
thats what many argue as well - that teams like SKY should fck off the front of the peloton in last KMs of a sprint finish,there are just too many people wanting to be on the front including all the sprint trains ...not just sprinters but sprint trains
just look at stage 1 we already had a crash in sprint finish,its not like he is making this up - its happening and it will happen in this stage you are watching right now...hopefully noone crashes this time
and btw he is the last person who should be concerned by this,considering he barely crashes...so him speaking about it is not just for his own benefit
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Last year (I think) I proposed that there should be a 3km early finish line for GC times, which would remove a good number of riders from the road and leave only the sprinters and their lead-outs, The inner ring just proposed the same thing. I'm all for cutting down the number of riders at the front, especially the GC riders who don't want to be there but have to be, the 3km rule needs to be pro-active, not reactive.
My main problem is Sagan doesn't seem to be thinking like that. He seems to be suggesting that only the likes of himself, Cavendish, Kittel, Greipel, Kristoff etc. should be allowed to contest the sprints and everyone else should just move out of their way. It's that which I fundamentally disagree with.
saganftw said:
Last year (I think) I proposed that there should be a 3km early finish line for GC times, which would remove a good number of riders from the road and leave only the sprinters and their lead-outs, The inner ring just proposed the same thing. I'm all for cutting down the number of riders at the front, especially the GC riders who don't want to be there but have to be, the 3km rule needs to be pro-active, not reactive.
My main problem is Sagan doesn't seem to be thinking like that. He seems to be suggesting that only the likes of himself, Cavendish, Kittel, Greipel, Kristoff etc. should be allowed to contest the sprints and everyone else should just move out of their way. It's that which I fundamentally disagree with.
you are missinterpreting his words,all i got from this is that the sprinter teams are reckless and they want to be on the front at all costs - which is kinda true - not that only selected few should be fighting for stage...in other words there can be as many sprinters as there is room for,just a bit more concern for a guy next to you
We'll have to disagree on that then. Eisel has spoken out but he seems to come from a similar position to me, its the GC teams causing the issue, although he talks about yesterday which is not a stage I would have an issue with.
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Eddie would have been even better with all the different scientific and technological support available to riders today. I suggest EM had something within his make-up that most riders then and now simply don't have.jmdirt said:My guess is that he would be similar to PS. No way he would win a GT. But comparing generations is difficult at best. Who knows how EM would develop himself in the 2000s.saunaking said:Tonton said:Competitive at what? ITT for starters. He didn't prepare for months for his attempt, a la Wiggo, just showed up, and on a conventional bike, he's still with the best. Doing this in the fall after one of the greatest years ever recorded. Descending. He was every bit as good as the best descenders ever. I could go on and on.MacBAir said:
I couldn't help but notice that you bring doping to the discussion. It's a no-no. Be aware.
There were many greats during Merckx tenure, legends of the monuments like Van Springel and De Vlaeminck, great GT riders, Poulidor of course, Gimondi, Van Impe, Zoetemelk, Agostinho, Ocana, Thevenet, et caetera.
And at the time, there were a lot of clubs, cycling was much more popular than it is today. The best athletes would not choose bogus sports like they do today, or sports that at the time were expensive like tennis for example. It was not as "pro", but the guys were much tougher. No weather protocol, no 3 km rule, when you see the whiners of today, how many of today's pros would have survived having to race 120 days per year, in all weather, not have Dave on the earpiece, therefore have to be smart, on roads that were nowhere in the shape they are today, on an 11 kg bike with no STI and only five cogs. If you compare eras, try to imagine today's guys back then. Interesting proposition. But pointless.
You don't know about those times, so why try to make a point, defend a position that's not holding water? Sorry but comparing Sagan to Merckx is a bit tough to swallow for those here who actually know about the sport
It doesn't take away the fact that Sagan has won two big races in his life and a lot of smaller ones. And his career is far from over. I'm a fan of his. He'll win more.
Just curious. If Merckx was born in say 1993 or so do you think he would be a better version of Sagan or a freak winning classics and GTs every year?
Did you notice the hit Sagan got from one of the Giant guys at 6km to go? No wonder he isn't too happy about riding in the finale of stages. At around 3:26 time http://www.steephill.tv/players/720...3&dashboard=tour-de-france&id=x4jlzwf&yr=2016
Why do you need sprint trains - Best to be on Sagan's wheel on sprint finishes as he is always well placed for the final.
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Hard to tell there, it's quite possible that the Giant rider also got a push and there was nothing he could do about it.
Kwibus said:
Hard to tell there, it's quite possible that the Giant rider also got a push and there was nothing he could do about it.
haha, brailsford feels some of these recent comments "about crazy guys at the front" are targeting SKYwards, so the empire strikes back
http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/brailsford-fighting-for-position-goes-with-the-territory/
funny, as it came after that Eisel's interview
http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/tour-de-france-fight-for-position-just-getting-ridiculous-says-eisel/
where he basically confirms that if there was a 3km neutralized zone (for the GC), they would sit happily at the back and would not bother to mess with the sprinters
http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/brailsford-fighting-for-position-goes-with-the-territory/
funny, as it came after that Eisel's interview
http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/tour-de-france-fight-for-position-just-getting-ridiculous-says-eisel/
where he basically confirms that if there was a 3km neutralized zone (for the GC), they would sit happily at the back and would not bother to mess with the sprinters
Sagan tremendously strong today. He would have probably finished in the Froome group if the peloton had stayed within striking distance of the breakaway.
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