Power Data Estimates for the climbing stages

[roundabout]

68kg according to this

http://teamsky.cyclingnews.com/tech...-analysis-chris-froome’s-vuelta-breakthrough/

 

[DarkWarrior]

68kg according to this

http://teamsky.cyclingnews.com/tech...-analysis-chris-froome’s-vuelta-breakthrough/

Thanks for the link. That's very, very interesting.

His 20 minute best then was around 420 watts which makes the 455 watts seem high (68kg*6.7w/kg), but I suppose that could have included the roll into the bottom of the climb if he set his 20 minute personal best that day. I would've imagined that the Angliru would've been where he set his 20 minute best, but then I remembered he and Wiggins were overgeared that day.

 

[Tyler'sTwin]

Ok, so answer the 20 min effort vs 40+ minute effort question, I only have limited information from elite athletes, so this isn't a University study....

That said: CVV can produce about 5.9 watts per kg in peak form for 40+ minute climbs, Wiggo is a bit more at 6.1 w/kg for this length of effort.
From the pre-Tour tests both riders have done up Rocacorba (a 33 minute climb) I know that Wiggo was at 6.1w/kg and CVV was 5.7 w/kg (He was off form a bit in June). However, Wiggo did a local 10 mile TT in GB about 2 weeks before the Tour, or 5 days before the Rocacorba test. He posted a time of 18mins flat (and was disqualified for using a 1080 wheel...funny rules over there). Anyhow, his power was 482 watts, so using his Tour weight of 72 kgs, so 6.7 w/kg. So, anecdotally, there's about a 9% decrease in power when going from a 20 min effort to a 40+ min effort. At 6.7 w/kg you certainly can climb at a VAM of 1750, but at 6.1 you wont even hit 1700 (again, anecdotal based on experience).
The last TT in the Tour Wiggo averaged 434 watts, consistent with his previous tests of 40+ minutes and just about 6.1 w/kg. I dont have any data for Wiggo up climbs in the Tour, as he didnt use a PowerTap.

JV

10 characters

 

[thehog]

I'm useless with data but Jani B has posted his online:

http://www.trainingpeaks.com/av/IVQUZ5KRRBXN63DAJZH55EVNZU

Looks like they were smokin' thus everyone got dropped!

 

[roundabout]

5.8 is not mindbogglingly fast for a 17 minute climb. Froome probably did 6.3 or so at the most.

 

[halamala]

Asked if he was surprised that none of his rivals had attacked, Wiggins said: "I was little bit. I knew I was dictating the pace and that I wanted to keep it high threshold and not go too much into the red and I knew that if someone wanted to attack off that pace they’d have to be going quite a bit more, which I know is not really sustainable if we’re riding at 470 to 480 Watts. Someone is going to have to go a lot harder to sustain that. As long as we gauge it like that I knew we’d be alright."

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/wiggins-and-sky-surprised-at-stage-7-damage

Nice, I have 1855 m/h for Froome

Foot : 4'33" (lead group)
Top : 20'58"
Peloton was about 9" behind the lead group, so time : 16'16"
Vertical : 503 meters

Bradley Wiggins

Tour de France 2012, Stage 7, Final Climb La Planche des Belles Filles

Elevation / Höhenmeter [m] : 503 m
Distance / Streckenlänge [Km] : 5.9 Km
Time in seconds / Fahrzeit in Sekunden [sec] : 978 = 16 min 18 sec = 16:18
Weight rider / Gewicht Fahrer [kg] : 69 kg [TeamSky.com]
Weight bicycle, clothes etc. / Gewicht Fahrrad [kg] : 8 kg

Grade / mittlere Seigung : 8.5 %
Average speed / mittlere Geschwindigkeit : 21.7 Km/h
Total weight / Gesamtgewicht : 77.0 kg

Power : 465.3 Watt
Power / kg : 6.7 Watt / kg

Source: [ http://www.rst.mp-all.de/bergauf.htm ]

 

[Race Radio]

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/wiggins-and-sky-surprised-at-stage-7-damage



Bradley Wiggins

Tour de France 2012, Stage 7, Final Climb La Planche des Belles Filles

Elevation / Höhenmeter [m] : 503 m
Distance / Streckenlänge [Km] : 5.9 Km
Time in seconds / Fahrzeit in Sekunden [sec] : 978 = 16 min 18 sec = 16:18
Weight rider / Gewicht Fahrer [kg] : 69 kg [TeamSky.com]
Weight bicycle, clothes etc. / Gewicht Fahrrad [kg] : 8 kg

Grade / mittlere Seigung : 8.5 %
Average speed / mittlere Geschwindigkeit : 21.7 Km/h
Total weight / Gesamtgewicht : 77.0 kg

Power : 472.5 Watt
Power / kg : 6.7 Watt / kg

Source: [ http://www.rst.mp-all.de/bergauf.htm ]

I don't get this. Jani was 351 for the final climb (17 min) how is Wiggins 472 when he was only 48 sec ahead of Jani? Even factoring marginal weight differences it seems like a huge difference. Also Wiggins sat on the entire climb while Jani rode mostly by himself. Not a huge difference at 22kmh but it does save a few watts

 

[halamala]

I don't get this. Jani was 351 for the final climb (17 min) how is Wiggins 472 when he was only 48 sec ahead of Jani? Even factoring marginal weight differences it seems like a huge difference. Also Wiggins sat on the entire climb while Jani rode mostly by himself. Not a huge difference at 22kmh but it does save a few watts

Brajkovic - 351 Watt? Weird. Err, it's only 5.4 W/kg (according to Wikipedia he is 65 kg). And I have to correct my mistake. Wiggins' power output isn't 472.5 Watt. It's 465.3 Watt.

 

[Race Radio]

Brajkovic - 351 Watt? Weird. Err, it's only 5.4 W/kg (according to Wikipedia he is 65 kg). And I have to correct my mistake. Wiggins' power output isn't 472.5 Watt. It's 465.3 Watt.

We have exact numbers from Jani powerfile. I think he is around 63kg and Brad is @ 68. Brad also sat on. I can't see Brad much higher then 400.

 

[mb2612]

We have exact numbers from Jani powerfile. I think he is around 63kg and Brad is @ 68. Brad also sat on. I can't see Brad much higher then 400.

I would say Jani is less than 60kg looking at him.

 

[Eyeballs Out]

I've seen Brajkovic's weight quoted as <60 kg in the past - I remember commenting on it when he won the Dauphine. The Astana website lists him at 60kg currently but a lot of their riders seem to be a kg or two heavier than previously so I'm guessing they are early season figures

 

[Ferminal]

Brajkovic looks like he's put on a bit since The Hog's harsh regime.

 

[zigmeister]

I'm useless with data but Jani B has posted his online:

http://www.trainingpeaks.com/av/IVQUZ5KRRBXN63DAJZH55EVNZU

Looks like they were smokin' thus everyone got dropped!

Based on the comments in the trainng peaks, and that some TT guys did 525 watts for 13-15 in the prologue, this is expected power.

Leipheimer said the run in was brutal and he almost felt completely tapped before the climb even started.

Then they just hammered it up that thing for 15 minutes with a nasty pace.

 

[function]

510 Watts?

Finally, someone bested Indurain's 508 watts*

Must be improvements in training and nutrition.

Dave.

*Yes, that was over an hour. But, still, 510 watts from a stick figure?

There is no comparison, 500W for 4 minutes is a function of vo2max and not "muscle bulk"

 

[thehog]

Based on the comments in the trainng peaks, and that some TT guys did 525 watts for 13-15 in the prologue, this is expected power.

Leipheimer said the run in was brutal and he almost felt completely tapped before the climb even started.

Then they just hammered it up that thing for 15 minutes with a nasty pace.

In fact every team made the same comments on the pace:

http://www.velonation.com/News/ID/1...ctions-Nibali-Sagan-Menchov-and-Scarponi.aspx

http://www.velonation.com/News/ID/1...ention-as-Team-Sky-goes-on-the-offensive.aspx

Give it two more stages like this and the whispers will start....

 

[thehog]

More comments on the speed:


Robert Gesink (Rabobank) came in behind his teammate Mollema and although Laurens Ten Dam was there to pace him, he conceded 2:53 at the finish.

"The GC is shattered. I can’t say much more about it. It was a difficult day and the speed was high. Luis León [Sánchez] kept up really well. I myself rode at the utmost speed and it wasn’t enough. We all know how I was before this, how good I was in California and Suisse. You don’t lose that just like that. But you know, yesterday I landed on the tarmac. You’re not supposed to do that, but it happened. Today didn’t turn out as I had expected."
*

 

[D-Queued]

There is no comparison, 500W for 4 minutes is a function of vo2max and not "muscle bulk"

Just a thought, but don't you need both?

Watts ~ Horsepower. No horse, no horsepower.

Dave.

 

[Maxiton]

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/wiggins-and-sky-surprised-at-stage-7-damage



Bradley Wiggins

Tour de France 2012, Stage 7, Final Climb La Planche des Belles Filles

Elevation / Höhenmeter [m] : 503 m
Distance / Streckenlänge [Km] : 5.9 Km
Time in seconds / Fahrzeit in Sekunden [sec] : 978 = 16 min 18 sec = 16:18
Weight rider / Gewicht Fahrer [kg] : 69 kg [TeamSky.com]
Weight bicycle, clothes etc. / Gewicht Fahrrad [kg] : 8 kg

Grade / mittlere Seigung : 8.5 %
Average speed / mittlere Geschwindigkeit : 21.7 Km/h
Total weight / Gesamtgewicht : 77.0 kg

Power : 465.3 Watt
Power / kg : 6.7 Watt / kg

Source: [ http://www.rst.mp-all.de/bergauf.htm ]

interesting. Back in the day, when reporters would ask Johan and LA what it took for a rider to have a chance of winning the Tour, their answer woe always come back as, "It takes one thing: to be able to hit and sustain 6.7 w/kg. if you can do that, you can win the Tour. If you can't produce that number, you've got no chance."

 

[Parrot23]

Yes, albeit for a 45 minute climb they meant. Big, big difference.

 

[malizec]

stage 7 srm date

If anyone is interested

data for the final climb of Stage 7 from Jani Brajkovic's SRM power meter, some data may be missing
He posted the link to TP file on his twitter He was able to keep the pace of the first group almost to the end of the climb, I think he slowed down about 1-1.5km before the finish.

Online version shows slightly higher power output than in wko+
353W online compared to ~ 345W in WKO+

353W is 5.9W/kg according to the online version, which is really high, it would suggest that Jani only weighs 60kg at the moment, not very likely

 

[Don't be late Pedro]

Is someone able to put these numbers into layman's terms? I understand the gist of what the numbers represent but have no idea what is considered 'normal' (read clean).

 

[Cavalier]

Is someone able to put these numbers into layman's terms? I understand the gist of what the numbers represent but have no idea what is considered 'normal' (read clean).

In terms of VAM, the speed of Froome's climb exceeds everything ever done before in the tour with the exception of Contador climbing Verbier. It beats Pantani, Armstrong, Ullrich, and Indurain.

 

[BoxCoppi]

In terms of VAM, the speed of Froome's climb exceeds everything ever done before in the tour with the exception of Contador climbing Verbier. It beats Pantani, Armstrong, Ullrich, and Indurain.

That's hardly an objective comment as steepness and shortness of the climb favours high VAM. If we don't consider this we might as well calculate the VAM for Sagans ascent on stage 3...

Rather look at the w/kg where the calculated 6.7 is incredible high, but for a climb lasting 16 minutes not enough to have all the bells ringing. Also, the calculations seem to be questioned maybe indicating a w/kg closer to 6.

I believe the highest (considered clean) performance was 6.4 w/kg over an hour? However, around 6 seem to be a more conservative threshold for clean performances.

This is certainly not my field of science, so do correct me if (where) I'm wrong.

 

[Cavalier]

Comparing a Cat 1 climb, is a little different to comparing a Cat 3 or 4 though. That's simply splitting hairs.

Reality was, when you look at who did it, VAM and calculated wattage are enough to set alarm bells ringing.

 

[Poursuivant]

You cant really compare that climb to armstrong/pantani days because it was so short, I think 5.9km. Also, Froome had someone working for him for the majority of the climb, he done about 2.5k on his own, it is tough to compare that to a Sestriere for example.