The three areas that seem to be of most concern to fans are power meters, radios and smaller teams. My guess is you can definitely get one of these three proposals through the UCI - And it will probably be power meters.
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Re:
Unsure if this is a deliberate Andy Schleck jibe or not.
Either way Ill take it as such
Amnes2015 said:
Unsure if this is a deliberate Andy Schleck jibe or not.
Either way Ill take it as such
He is right.
The debate is why is Quintana asking for this.
As one of the ultimate examples of rigid, calculative, over-controlled modern cycling, it is particularly surprising for him to be asking this type of things.
I would have expected this from someone like Sagan or De Gendt for example.
The debate is why is Quintana asking for this.
As one of the ultimate examples of rigid, calculative, over-controlled modern cycling, it is particularly surprising for him to be asking this type of things.
I would have expected this from someone like Sagan or De Gendt for example.
Making things less predictable and certain would improve the spectacle and is a worthy goal, but surely there are better ways of accomplishing it than by rejecting analytics.
If there are regulations on bike weight, dimensions, shape and geometry I don't see what kind of problems there are in taking out the power meters. Its not like we're going back to the Middle Ages.
Although it may be impopular with Garmin et al. But who cares.
Although it may be impopular with Garmin et al. But who cares.
Re:
not rejecting analytics in absolute, but cut the ombilical cord between the rider and those analytics in race : Keep the data hidden during the race, they can review the data all they want in the evening after the race or in training, but in race you want the rider to be alone with other riders : his ennemies and his teammates. Not hooked on the radio or watching his data "damn I am can only achieve so many watts when going at 175bpm, this is not good"....
SeriousSam said:
not rejecting analytics in absolute, but cut the ombilical cord between the rider and those analytics in race : Keep the data hidden during the race, they can review the data all they want in the evening after the race or in training, but in race you want the rider to be alone with other riders : his ennemies and his teammates. Not hooked on the radio or watching his data "damn I am can only achieve so many watts when going at 175bpm, this is not good"....
Re:
I don't think anyone is suggesting to ban them for training. That keeps Garmin et al happy as they can still promote their products' use by the pros. But as you say, too bad regardless. Well done to Quintana for speaking up. Part of road racing is the subjectivity of feeling your legs. Power meters take away that subjectivity. Heart monitors are more than enough.
KyoGrey said:
I don't think anyone is suggesting to ban them for training. That keeps Garmin et al happy as they can still promote their products' use by the pros. But as you say, too bad regardless. Well done to Quintana for speaking up. Part of road racing is the subjectivity of feeling your legs. Power meters take away that subjectivity. Heart monitors are more than enough.
Re: Power meters: is Quintana right that they should be bann
Totally agree on banning powermeters during racing.
Absolutely irrelevant the reason why Quintana brought that up. It could well be because he was abducted by aliens for what I care. What matters is that he is 100% right. Take the powermeters away during a race, and you'll see dramatic changes in the outcome.
Clearly no problem in keeping them for training purposes. It wouldn't make sense otherwise.
And in any case it would be impossible to enforce a ban outside races.
A few have suggested that the Powermeters could be kept on the bikes while racing, hiding data from the riders and allowing a later analysis. Perfect solution ideally. But how do you guarantee that the data are kept hidden? Each rider would have his bike fitted with a computer anyway. How can we make sure that that computer is not gonna show any data while racing? Do the race organizers have to provide special computers?
Totally agree on banning powermeters during racing.
Absolutely irrelevant the reason why Quintana brought that up. It could well be because he was abducted by aliens for what I care. What matters is that he is 100% right. Take the powermeters away during a race, and you'll see dramatic changes in the outcome.
Clearly no problem in keeping them for training purposes. It wouldn't make sense otherwise.
And in any case it would be impossible to enforce a ban outside races.
A few have suggested that the Powermeters could be kept on the bikes while racing, hiding data from the riders and allowing a later analysis. Perfect solution ideally. But how do you guarantee that the data are kept hidden? Each rider would have his bike fitted with a computer anyway. How can we make sure that that computer is not gonna show any data while racing? Do the race organizers have to provide special computers?
just because quintana brought it up,it doesnt make his opinion invalid
there is waaaaaay too much technology involved in racing,to the point where the DS tells you what to do and powermeter tells you if you can do it...why is there even cyclist involved?
there is waaaaaay too much technology involved in racing,to the point where the DS tells you what to do and powermeter tells you if you can do it...why is there even cyclist involved?
I have always said: GET RID OF THE RADIOS AND REDUCE THE TEAMS DOWN TO 7 MEN- once those two are fixed, power meters would mean nothing...
Just remember how great was the Olympics RR
Just remember how great was the Olympics RR
Re: Re:
you said banning them wouldn't change anything , so if they're useless why would anyone oppose banning something that accomplishes nothing ?
Richeypen said:
you said banning them wouldn't change anything , so if they're useless why would anyone oppose banning something that accomplishes nothing ?
I don't think that the impact would be huge, most pros would be able to ride by their feeling pretty well, but it's a step in the right direction.
They could do the same thing that they do in track cycling, you can have a powermeter on your bike to get the data, but you can't have it on your stem or somewere else were you can read it while riding.
It wouldn't be bad, but team size and team radios (a neutral race radio is ok) are IMO a bigger problem, they are the real game changers that have a much bigger impact.
They could do the same thing that they do in track cycling, you can have a powermeter on your bike to get the data, but you can't have it on your stem or somewere else were you can read it while riding.
It wouldn't be bad, but team size and team radios (a neutral race radio is ok) are IMO a bigger problem, they are the real game changers that have a much bigger impact.
I read what you said and if you believe banning them would have the least chance of changing anything (of the 3 options given) then i'll repeat ,why would anyone have a problem banning something that's of little to no use ?
Re:
The impact would be massive, no doubts.
Riding reading your actual wattage and only by feeling makes a huge difference.
You say a pro rider knows himself pretty well. True. But in pro riding, among top riders, from small differences pretty different outcome can result. And as said it's not only about the feeling. It will add uncertainty in the decisions to be taken.
Mayomaniac said:
The impact would be massive, no doubts.
Riding reading your actual wattage and only by feeling makes a huge difference.
You say a pro rider knows himself pretty well. True. But in pro riding, among top riders, from small differences pretty different outcome can result. And as said it's not only about the feeling. It will add uncertainty in the decisions to be taken.
Re:
I disagree. The best evidence for me was the 2012 TdF, the most predictable and boring GT since I have been following the sport. Who can forget Michael Roger's arrogant scoffing at any suggestion of attacks against Sky - he said something like "at 420 watts it was not possible". If no rider in the team is sure what power they are making then it becomes subjective and the opportunity for attacking and unpredictable racing is greater - isn't that what makes the sport enjoyable to follow and even compete in?
While pros are obviously better than most at knowing their limits it is still subjective when you are doing stage races, fatigue etc comes into the equation - pros are human not robots. Power Meters take away all that subjectivity. Heart monitors are more than enough.
Predictably we get claims Quintana is only speaking out selfishly. That may be true but he is still spot on IMO. Ban them for racing.
Mayomaniac said:
I disagree. The best evidence for me was the 2012 TdF, the most predictable and boring GT since I have been following the sport. Who can forget Michael Roger's arrogant scoffing at any suggestion of attacks against Sky - he said something like "at 420 watts it was not possible". If no rider in the team is sure what power they are making then it becomes subjective and the opportunity for attacking and unpredictable racing is greater - isn't that what makes the sport enjoyable to follow and even compete in?
While pros are obviously better than most at knowing their limits it is still subjective when you are doing stage races, fatigue etc comes into the equation - pros are human not robots. Power Meters take away all that subjectivity. Heart monitors are more than enough.
Predictably we get claims Quintana is only speaking out selfishly. That may be true but he is still spot on IMO. Ban them for racing.
Re:
Sky is unethical but Tinkoff is?
lol
you are the one that posted somewhere that Froome yo-yo yesterday is clear evidence of a motor.
welcome to the ignore list
El Pistolero said:
Sky is unethical but Tinkoff is?
lol
you are the one that posted somewhere that Froome yo-yo yesterday is clear evidence of a motor.
welcome to the ignore list
But why not ban the HR monitor as well?
Ban computers that show anything apart from "current speed", "distance", "race time". That's it.
What other info does a rider need during a race?
As said before. all the other data can be recorded for a later analysis, but not visible during the race.
Ban computers that show anything apart from "current speed", "distance", "race time". That's it.
What other info does a rider need during a race?
As said before. all the other data can be recorded for a later analysis, but not visible during the race.
Re: Re:
Good luck banning a team that stops next year, smart-ass.
And yes, Rupert Murdoch is ten times worse than Tinkoff. He makes Mr. Burns look like a saint.
Amnes2015 said:
Good luck banning a team that stops next year, smart-ass.
And yes, Rupert Murdoch is ten times worse than Tinkoff. He makes Mr. Burns look like a saint.
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