Quintana??

[del1962]

I think that being from altitude will help when racing at altitude, such as high alpine passes, I wonder if any study has been done on the differences versus the competion of Colombians on higher by altitude MTFs versus competion against lower MTFs.

 

[hiero2]

No, as in he has said himself that it didn't mean what you think he did. He does not think he is clean.

Really? Where did Vayer say that? I'm afraid I missed that one. Where did you see it?

 

[hiero2]

3 weeks!!!!!!

Mark L

I could be mistaken, but I'm pretty sure I recall some years ago reading that people RAISED at altitude had permanent cardio-vascular adaptation. If I recall, you get 80-90% of the same changes by training at altitude, but that is the bit that goes away within 3 weeks.

But that is what I recall - so it leaves the question open - sfaic.

 

[hiero2]

Maybe a politician in spe

I wouldn't be surprised if it turned out that way. Behind his aplomb and quiet confidence also seems to be a good intelligence. Unlike some other stars, who when they speak, you realize it may be a good thing they are good at being bicycle racers, as there may be a limited market for any other of their abilities.

 

[Escarabajo]

His gifts are more genetic than being born and raised in the Andes at high altitude. We can see now and from the 80's than in general the small built and the redblood cell count helps in the climbing but by no means is the main reason why Lucho Herrera or Nairo Quintana are some of the best talent in the mountains. IMHO.

 

[offbyone]

3 weeks!!!!!!

Mark L

Wow I didn't realize it lasted so long.

 

[hfer07]

His gifts are more genetic than being born and raised in the Andes at high altitude. We can see now and from the 80's than in general the small built and the redblood cell count helps in the climbing but by no means is the main reason why Lucho Herrera or Nairo Quintana are some of the best talent in the mountains. IMHO.

Escarabajo published an interview of him on the Professional forum from "El Tiempo" newspaper, which reveals the results of the tests done by Movistar where he claims he achieved 7 watts per kilo. The test was repeated twice because they thought the machine wasn't properly calibrated, and when he repeated the same results, they literally Locked him in to sign a contract at the spot.

 

[Maaaaaaaarten]

Born, raised, developed etc has pretty much zero impact on your genetic makeup for one generation. Humans just don't evolve that quickly.

I don't know **** about biology, but wikipedia disagrees with you.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High-altitude_adaptation_in_humans

 

[lemoogle]

Born, raised, developed etc has pretty much zero impact on your genetic makeup for one generation. Humans just don't evolve that quickly.

It has EVEN less impact on your children. Your genetic code doesn't change based on how much you train, and that's pretty much all you pass to your children (especially as a male ). It's an often misunderstood concept about evolution.

Of course there are possibly impacts based on the mother's health status/fitness/lifestyle during conception and pregnancy ( and even possibly on the men's healthetc on conception ) but that won't actually change your genetic code.

Edit: of course this is based on darwinian evolution, which is most likely not 100% fully accurate, but it's most likely pretty damn close to the real thing

 

[noddy69]

On Quintana:

We know he was born, raised, & developed physiologically at 2820 mts a.s.l.
We know when he was a child he used to go to school by bicycle climbing a cat 3 "every single day of his scholar calender.
We know his prior record before turning professional
We Know he was touted by many experts to become "the next big time"
We know his performances are "within human capacity"

those facts are "irrefutable" & proof of a "clean rider"

However......

The only aspect alone that I could have slight doubts on Quintana is that he rides for Unzue's team,- but then I ask- how come Valverde has not become a multiple GT winner under his guidance- if the dope was the answer??

bottom line- he could well be doping- as part of being Pro-cyclists. Does he rely on dope to succeed? don't think so. Perhaps the dope gets the very edge of his abilities, but never "transforms his skills" into an "alien"- per say....

having stated that-I will be the first one to call Quintana out on this thread if I ever watch him doing this sort of performance: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=52xv2Hg2fkI&sns=em

Really...How come Valverde has not become a multiple winner ? Eh cause others were more doped and he got caught.
Some people are talking about his figures being possible etc etc. He gets better as the tours go on and faster up the high mountains and hits those figures at the end with relative ease when he should be getting gradually worse after a number of hard stages. Doping a certainty in my eyes.
Why...well because non dopers do not beat dopers and even if the sport has cleaned up a bit, and it may have with some of the new generation who do have off days....it hasnt gone fully and most of the top riders have been done for doping...Its usually the simple solutions that give you the answers .Its actually proving guilt that's harder no matter how easy it is to see its true.

 

[roundabout]

Escarabajo published an interview of him on the Professional forum from "El Tiempo" newspaper, which reveals the results of the tests done by Movistar where he claims he achieved 7 watts per kilo. The test was repeated twice because they thought the machine wasn't properly calibrated, and when he repeated the same results, they literally Locked him in to sign a contract at the spot.

I am sure that he also catches the biggest fish

 

[movingtarget]

Quintana gives the impression he's not trying. If he isn't the 2015 Tour could be interesting especially if he starts riding away from Froome on every mountain. Kenyan runners always had an advantage re altitude so the experts said. But how much is debatable and how much does altitude training do for the athletes not brought up in that environment ? I suppose it does not have to be much of a margin to make a noticeable difference. Armstrong's heart was supposed to be bigger than normal which is kinda ironic.

 

[Dear Wiggo]

...
Armstrong's heart was supposed to be bigger than normal which is kinda ironic.

The heart size thing would be true for most elite athletes, however. So a moot point, and not a differentiator within the peloton.

 

[Libertine Seguros]

Quintana gives the impression he's not trying. If he isn't the 2015 Tour could be interesting especially if he starts riding away from Froome on every mountain. Kenyan runners always had an advantage re altitude so the experts said. But how much is debatable and how much does altitude training do for the athletes not brought up in that environment ? I suppose it does not have to be much of a margin to make a noticeable difference. Armstrong's heart was supposed to be bigger than normal which is kinda ironic.

How much of that could just be his awesome pokerface though? It could be just his straightforward riding face. Similarly, Denis Menchov looked like Ironman because he'd be suffering a thousand deaths with a totally blank look on his face, and Chris Anker S

 

[Libertine Seguros]

Quintana gives the impression he's not trying. If he isn't the 2015 Tour could be interesting especially if he starts riding away from Froome on every mountain. Kenyan runners always had an advantage re altitude so the experts said. But how much is debatable and how much does altitude training do for the athletes not brought up in that environment ? I suppose it does not have to be much of a margin to make a noticeable difference. Armstrong's heart was supposed to be bigger than normal which is kinda ironic.

How much of that could just be his awesome pokerface though? It could be just his straightforward riding face. Similarly, Denis Menchov looked like Ironman because he'd be suffering a thousand deaths with a totally blank look on his face, and Chris Anker Sorensen would look like he was on the rivet in a group ride because of his epic pain face.

 

[Netserk]

Really? Where did Vayer say that? I'm afraid I missed that one. Where did you see it?

https://twitter.com/festinaboy/status/471593236675715072

 

[happychappy]

Really...How come Valverde has not become a multiple winner ? Eh cause others were more doped and he got caught.

Nobody is more doped than Piti.

 

[hiero2]

Antione Vayer and Portoleau seem to think he is clean. Vayer went to Twitter to announce it.

http://t.co/kVIJeiIUPe

You replied "no" - because of this tweet:

https://twitter.com/festinaboy/status/471593236675715072

Ok, that adds something to the convo.

Let's take a look at Vayer's twitters.

Look at my friend Portoleau's image. Better time, no ? Even Rolland can follow. OK, It's not Rolland de Ronceveau pic.twitter.com/kVIJeiIUPe

@JordanIstace @lapreuvepar21 @cv14 pas clean, mais cela veut dire que des coureurs clean peuvent le faire.

Which Google translates as "not clean, but it does mean that clean riders can do."

Roland is a French heroic legend who dies in the battle of Ronceveau pass. Fighting impossible odds, heroically, that sort of thing. We know who Rolland, is and Vayer being French, and the French generally thinking their French riders are riding cleaner than others - well - it all fits together.

I don't think Vayer would actually say ANYONE was clean. What he seems to be saying is they are performing in a range of power outputs that is possible when the riders are clean. This is a typical scientific manner of statement. And as close to saying "they are clean" as Vayer would ever get. I would still say he is holding this performance up as one that is not doped, or is less likely to be doped.

 

[Gung Ho Gun]

Nobody is more doped than Piti.

Valverde on his 2003-2005 programma would've won multiple GT's by now

 

[movingtarget]

How much of that could just be his awesome pokerface though? It could be just his straightforward riding face. Similarly, Denis Menchov looked like Ironman because he'd be suffering a thousand deaths with a totally blank look on his face, and Chris Anker Sorensen would look like he was on the rivet in a group ride because of his epic pain face.

True of course although I think Menchov showed more than Quintana which is a scary thing to say about a silent assassin !

 

[IndianCyclist]

I am sceptically of a 24 year old already a GT winner?? You must be super talented and I don't get that with Quintana. By that way dunno why but he looks 30 to me....

Better a 24 yr GT winner than a 42 yr old. at least easier to accept.

 

[AICA ribonucleotide]

Fastest ever up the Toussuire.
http://www.climbing-records.com/2015/07/new-record-on-la-toussuire-for-quintana.html

Apparently he wasnt 100%.

 

[DFA123]

Re:

Fastest ever up the Toussuire.
http://www.climbing-records.com/2015/07/new-record-on-la-toussuire-for-quintana.html

Apparently he wasnt 100%.

I think Nibali's time may be even more impressive/suspect, at least Quintana was drafting in a fairly big train during the first 11km.

 

[Saint Unix]

Luckily they only started riding Toussuire in 2006. You know... the year after doping ended with the retirement of Lance. Beating Mayo and Rasmussen at the tail end of a Tour during the hardest stage of the lot. Totally cleans.

But as far as cheats go, I'd much rather watch Quintana climb fast in a bike race than Froome. At least I don't have dig my eyes out with a spoon when Quintana rockets up the climbs.

 

[SeriousSam]

So Froome did the same time today he did back in 2012.