Rafa Nadal

[khardung la]

If he takes PEDs his goal is surely to run those hundreds of sprints faster, with less fatigue and with the ability to smash the ball stronger. If his goal would be to have a big arm he´d be better off pumping in the gym, which I am sure he also does. I do not see the relationship between PEDs and a photo, but I could see the relationships with endurance and performance.

 

[hrotha]

Has tennis had any whistleblowers? I know some players have talked out against doping, but it's always those who are or want us to believe they're clean. I also know others like Agassi have admitted PED use but I don't think there's been anything like a Jaksche or a Landis?

If he takes PEDs his goal is surely to run those hundreds of sprints faster, with less fatigue and with the ability to smash the ball stronger. If his goal would be to have a big arm he´d be better off pumping in the gym, which I am sure he also does. I do not see the relationship between PEDs and a photo, but I could see the relationships with endurance and performance.

Hello, steroids. Also, didn't someone quote Nadal saying he didn't really do any gym work?

 

[sniper]

Has tennis had any whistleblowers? I know some players have talked out against doping, but it's always those who are or want us to believe they're clean. I also know others like Agassi have admitted PED use but I don't think there's been anything like a Jaksche or a Landis?

Medvedev apparently made some juicy statements about Becker recently (an interview with him was posted in this thread a few days ago).
But apart from that: no, no whistleblowers a la Jaksche/Landis.
Makes sense, cuz no one is getting caught, really.

As for Agassi, I believe he only admitted to cocaine, right? Do correct me if I'm wrong.

 

[moi123]

Rafa Nadal? Brilliant win today, he showed his amazing mental skills against someone like Federer again. He was in total control of the match after he fought back in the first set. Federer hadn't got any answer to his power and smart play. It's his 6th French Open title equaling Bjorn Borg. He's still the king of clay.

 

[peloton]

As for Agassi, I believe he only admitted to cocaine, right? Do correct me if I'm wrong.

Crystal meth

http://edition.cnn.com/2009/SPORT/10/28/tennis.agassi.crystal.meth/index.html

 

[sniper]

Crystal meth

http://edition.cnn.com/2009/SPORT/10/28/tennis.agassi.crystal.meth/index.html

yeah, true. thanks.
so that's what I meant. He has never admitted to using PEDs but only to using recreational drugs.

 

[icefire]

Rafa Nadal? Brilliant win today, he showed his amazing mental skills against someone like Federer again. He was in total control of the match after he fought back in the first set. Federer hadn't got any answer to his power and smart play. It's his 6th French Open title equaling Bjorn Borg. He's still the king of clay.

Poor game from both of them, if you ask me. Only the end of the 3rd set and the beginning of the 4th set were worth watching. Roger looked scared of winning and played his best only when he was down in the score. Rafa just made less mistakes. Bring me back 1984's final with Lendl and McEnroe.

 

[Andynonomous]

Where's your proof.

Has tennis had any whistleblowers? I know some players have talked out against doping, but it's always those who are or want us to believe they're clean. I also know others like Agassi have admitted PED use but I don't think there's been anything like a Jaksche or a Landis?

There have been quite a few. Christophe Rochus, Natalie Tauziat, Jim Courier, Medvedev, and others have said that they suspect that it is going on, but the ITF just responds "prove it".

It's the same thing as the UCI saying "prove there is doping in cycling". Of course the UCI is believed to give advanced warning to some cyclists, cover up positives, give some riders time to come up with a bogus excuse,...

The ITF is even worse (almost no out of competition tests, VERY late at introducing new tests, coverups, ...).

 

[moi123]

Poor game from both of them, if you ask me. Only the end of the 3rd set and the beginning of the 4th set were worth watching. Roger looked scared of winning and played his best only when he was down in the score. Rafa just made less mistakes. Bring me back 1984's final with Lendl and McEnroe.

Your last sentence says it all! It was a more than entertaining match with top tennis from both men.

 

[Andynonomous]

Do you know how steroids work ?

If he takes PEDs his goal is surely to run those hundreds of sprints faster, with less fatigue and with the ability to smash the ball stronger. If his goal would be to have a big arm he´d be better off pumping in the gym, which I am sure he also does. I do not see the relationship between PEDs and a photo, but I could see the relationships with endurance and performance.

His goal isn't a big arm, it's strength. Steroids + exercise = strength. The muscles just come with the added strength. The left arm muscles grow because he exercises that more than any other muscles in his body when he practices or plays tennis (hits his serve and forehand with his left arm only).

It is normal for all human beings to accumulate fatigue with vigorous exercise. Nadal NEVER tires, no matter how hard he is pushed. That's how I knew he was doping right from the first time I ever saw him. He reminded me of Armstrong. Both can just keep going, and going, without any signs of accumulated fatigue. That's not normal.

 

[hrotha]

There have been quite a few. Christophe Rochus, Natalie Tauziat, Jim Courier, Medvedev, and others have said that they suspect that it is going on, but the ITF just responds "prove it".

It's the same thing as the UCI saying "prove there is doping in cycling". Of course the UCI is believed to give advanced warning to some cyclists, cover up positives, give some riders time to come up with a bogus excuse,...

The ITF is even worse (almost no out of competition tests, VERY late at introducing new tests, coverups, ...).

Thanks. So nothing comparable to a Landis or Jaksche, i.e. no one who came out and said "I doped, this is how I did it, this is how it worked".

I stand corrected about Agassi.

 

[Andynonomous]

Thanks. So nothing comparable to a Landis or Jaksche, i.e. no one who came out and said "I doped, this is how I did it, this is how it worked".

I stand corrected about Agassi.

Tennis is farther from dealing with doping than is cycling. It will take a big name getting caught by someone outside of tennis (ie. customs agents as in the case of Odesnik), before tennis will acknowledge the problem.

 

[Lanark]

If he takes PEDs his goal is surely to run those hundreds of sprints faster, with less fatigue and with the ability to smash the ball stronger. If his goal would be to have a big arm he´d be better off pumping in the gym, which I am sure he also does. I do not see the relationship between PEDs and a photo, but I could see the relationships with endurance and performance.

He doesn't:

Q: Hi Rafa, Massive fan from Ireland. Can you infrom us all of your diet, are you on any shakes etc fior extra protein? Just how did you get that left gun so big?? (Conor Daly, Ireland)
RN: Nope, no diet at all, just the normal things of a pro player. Lots of carbohydrates, proteins, meat, fish, salads, .... I think you mean by guns the arms? Believe me that is from playing tennis, no gym at all.


Could almost be considered a de facto admission of steroid use

 

[c&cfan]

"I can't describe what I'm having in detail, because this is something very private and professional," Djokovic, who faces a tricky draw in Paris with Juan Martin del Potro and Richard Gasquet lurking in his path, said.

what is the goal of this pic? my post will sound gay, but i don't care.

did you watch the movie 300? those abdominals had lots of effects, even "the king", a muscular man, isn't like that in real life. he never was. it is pretty ease to make a regular man look ripped.

for example, beckham. he is skinny, no muscular. put "beckham" in google and you see that the black and white beckham from the armani campain, has more 10kg of pure muscle than the true beckham. still some brainless girls and gays live in that ilusion.. there's a reason for him to being married to victoria and not to beyonce. lol

but those pics about nadal, well... you are right.

 

[Tyler'sTwin]

That pic is from 2009 when Nadal was really struggling and always losing to top 10 players. Many experts said he had lost weight.

John McEnroe mentioned that he looks thinner, and Pat suggested maybe he intentionally lost weight to help his knees.

Mark "the scud" Philippoussis said Nadal lost 15 lbs of muscle that year because of the knees.

Fellow player Robert Lindstedt was amazed by how "small" Nadal had become.

Arias and Shiras also had some things to say:

* he is much lighter
* he is not as muscled
* he is not as fast on court
* he is not getting depth that he once did
* he is not getting pace that he once did

Mats Wilander chimed in: "He's not playing any different to the way he used to, but he might not be quite as strong. He's lost some weight because of his knees maybe."

Fast forward one year to the 2010 USO.

Wilander again: "To lose only six sets in winning those three titles? That has to be one of the greatest feats ever." Wilander shook his head. "He's just turned himself into this incredible athlete and you know the scary thing? There is room for improvement. He could still flatten out the forehand on occasion, still get in to volley a bit more — and already the guys seem incapable of winning sets off him. What's happening?"

And McEnroe was saying he looks bigger & stronger than ever.

Of course, Nadal always denied that he had lost weight, but it's safe to say that this scrawny dude was not the normal Rafael Nadal.

Who are ya gonna believe? Your lying eyes or an alleged Fuentes client?

 

[Andynonomous]

2009 was the year tennis introduced the "WADA code". The players thought that this meant a vigorous out of competition testing regime. A few players complained (Nadal, Murray, Williams).

Of course the testing WASN'T more vigorous after implementing the WADA code, and the players figured this out (only 1 OOC test per year on average) by the end of 2009.

Then in 2010, the same guy who couldn't win a tournament for months in 2009 won almost every major tournament for the year.

Coincidence that Nadal's size, and performance dropped dramatically when he thought the testing would be more rigorous , then jumped back up when the testing proved to be ineffective ?

 

[patswana]

Coincidence that Nadal's size, and performance dropped dramatically when he thought the testing would be more rigorous , then jumped back up when the testing proved to be ineffective ?

The other time that Nadal's performance went off was in late 2006 just after Operacion Puerto broke. He was named by Fuentes but then the ATP, like FIFA, killed the story very quickly.

While Fuentes was out of action after that, Nadal won very little. When the OP investigation died about 10 or 11 months later (mid 2007) and Fuentes went back to work, Nadal started winning again.

Last year, 11 Spanish male tennis players won ATP tournaments. Did any of them ever look tired? No. Did their game deteriorate in the 4th & 5th sets like most other players? No.

 

[hrotha]

I don't think he was named by Fuentes. He was linked to Fuentes, and Manzano hinted at having seen him at Fuentes' clinic (he talked about a very famous tennis player being there), but unfortunately it never went beyond the rumour phase.

 

[Mambo95]

I don't think he was named by Fuentes. He was linked to Fuentes, and Manzano hinted at having seen him at Fuentes' clinic (he talked about a very famous tennis player being there), but unfortunately it never went beyond the rumour phase.

Although Manzano's revelations relate to 2003 at the latest, when Nadal was 16/17 and known only to hardcore tennis fans. Spain had more far famous tennis players at the time, including a World No.1

 

[python]

.........
And McEnroe was saying he looks bigger & stronger than ever.........

that this scrawny dude .......
....:

scrawny no more

 

[lancaster]

with regards to fuentes, my understanding was "a very famous tennis player" was rafa, princpally because he was spanish. really it could've been anyone. fuentes did treat non spanish cyclists (basso, schleck, hamilton, ullrich......).



the reason that the agassi story is so damning is that he was the player representative on the anti doping panel throughout his drug use.

possibly because of this (or worse, maybe just because he was a big name) when he failed a test, they believed his story and he got off.

tennis has not approached taking doping seriously. it's not alone in this respect. they don't have proper testing.
and fans seem to believe that it is too skillful a game to be aided by peds (in my experience).

if rafa is doped he's been doped from a very young age. he's been the best athlete on the tour from the age of about 18.

at the turn of the millennium lleyton hewitt was the top player, mainly because he was the best athlete.

since then everyone has become a better athlete. either tennis came late to professionalism and fitness coaching or they cottoned on to something else.

 

[patswana]

I don't think he was named by Fuentes. He was linked to Fuentes, and Manzano hinted at having seen him at Fuentes' clinic (he talked about a very famous tennis player being there), but unfortunately it never went beyond the rumour phase.

Nadal's name was reported as being that client in July 2006 in one sporting website but the article went down after a few days never to return.

 

[Andynonomous]

if rafa is doped he's been doped from a very young age. he's been the best athlete on the tour from the age of about 18.

at the turn of the millennium lleyton hewitt was the top player, mainly because he was the best athlete.

since then everyone has become a better athlete. either tennis came late to professionalism and fitness coaching or they cottoned on to something else.

Nadal's body "exploded" between his 16th and 17th birthdays according to uncle Toni.

"And Rafa ... he was always strong. At 16, his body just exploded. But
he has been very little in the gym. Just some resistance work with
rubber bands for injury prevention."
http://www.sporttaco.com/rec.sport.tennis/Nadal_doesnt_actually_lift_weights_much_3964.html

The only "fitness training" Nadal does is some minor resistence training with rubber bands, and practicing on-court according to uncle Toni in the article above.

Ever since he has been playing professional tennis he has had super-human (Lance-like) endurance however. It's just not normal to never show any signs of fatigue, no matter how hard you are pushed, unless you are using something. I suspect Nadal has been on a stamina improving regime (likely autologous blood doping) since his early teens(14 or 15), and strength enhancing PEDs from the age of 16. Remember, he had an uncle who played for Barcelona (Miguel Angel?) and there are persistent rumours that Barcelona has doping doctors to prepare the players for competition. Rafael may have had a connection to these doping doctors from a young age.

In my opinion, tennis players are becoming better "athletes" because they see other people cheat (like Agassi), and get away with it, not because of improved "training and nutrition". All of the circumstantial evidence points to PEDS ("super" fitness beyond what exercise, and nutrition could explain - major body shape changes - complaining about testing - weak testing regime - coverups by the authorities like with Agassi - alternating large changes in performance in a short period of time).

 

[Tyler'sTwin]

I don't think he was named by Fuentes. He was linked to Fuentes, and Manzano hinted at having seen him at Fuentes' clinic (he talked about a very famous tennis player being there), but unfortunately it never went beyond the rumour phase.

Do you have a link to that interview?

 

[indurain666]

Silly me expecting an interesting discussion in the clinic, nothing but garbage in this thread. Lots of hate and biased hearsay.

BTW: Rafa just won Roland Garros

Vamos Rafa!!!!