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Remco Evenepoel

What? This 18 year old kid is already a full blown alien.

He has won pretty much everything he entered this year and has just won the Junior ITT by a huge margin.

He is already going to Quickstep next year- as we know a very dirty team where he will probably produce some nuclear performances.

Anyone else highly suspicious?
 
Jun 30, 2014
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He looks like a huge talent, reminds me a bit of the stories that you hear about Frank VdB as a kid, and while his performances are a bit crazy there isn't a lot to say about him right now.
The Belgian cycling federation doesn't even know how to spell anti-doping (Besides the Femke motor thing, who was the last guy that got caught by them for actual doping?) but that's a topic for another debate...
 
Robert5091 said:
What are you implying? Patrick Evenepoel was most probably clean and was robbed by EPO dopers like so many Belgian riders at that time. As an amateur rider he could drop Bartoli or Bugno. As a pro he had to retire after three years due to heart problems (advised by Pr. Brugada who also advised Vansummeren to stop) and his greatest win remains the GP Wallonia in 1993.
 
It exists, for example the sad case of the Rumsas brothers. Or with the Gabriel Evans affair it was kind of apparent that doping at the juniors level is 'normalised'

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/othersports/cycling/12044175/Teenage-cyclist-Gabriel-Evans-admits-to-doping-because-culture-had-been-normalised-and-justified.html

One thing that could be said in his favor is, that he was very articulate and forthright about why he did it. Well-spoken doper and kind of matter-of-fact.
So now, if there is a new star who is not only champion, but an even more extreme performance outlier, then of course there are going to be doubters who start grumbling about it. While baseless in fact, as if the performance speaks for itself

Evenepoel going straight to Quickstep shows that he doesn't have any compunction about doping in pro cycling, so that aspect doesn't help. But same could be said of many 'neo-pros' because they know what kind of territory they are headed into
 
Red Rick said:
MartinGT said:
So whenever a new talent wins a race now we're going to have a new thread?
He's a ridiculous outlier. If we can't be suspicious of outliers then we might as well stop pretending we care.
Is he? I don't follow junior riding at all but I wouldn't be surprised to see other junior riders at least coming close to his level, the distribution at that age is more likely to be larger.
 
King Boonen said:
Red Rick said:
MartinGT said:
So whenever a new talent wins a race now we're going to have a new thread?
He's a ridiculous outlier. If we can't be suspicious of outliers then we might as well stop pretending we care.
Is he? I don't follow junior riding at all but I wouldn't be surprised to see other junior riders at least coming close to his level, the distribution at that age is more likely to be larger.
The difference between him and nr. 2 was bigger than that between nr. 2 and nr.13, while he eased off in the final straight. He won the european chamionships with a solo from the 3rd of 11 laps and won with almost 10 minutes. In addition to that he has about 30 other victories, often with minutes in front. That's what I call an outlier.

But, there was an interesting article with Thomas de Gendt yesterday in a Belgian newspaper, who said that he won 20 times a year in the novices category, often with minutes, but he didn't turn into the next Merckx (although he has his day from time to time). Of course novices ain't juniors, but juniors ain't pros either.
For now, I'm in doubt.
 
rghysens said:
King Boonen said:
Red Rick said:
MartinGT said:
So whenever a new talent wins a race now we're going to have a new thread?
He's a ridiculous outlier. If we can't be suspicious of outliers then we might as well stop pretending we care.
Is he? I don't follow junior riding at all but I wouldn't be surprised to see other junior riders at least coming close to his level, the distribution at that age is more likely to be larger.
The difference between him and nr. 2 was bigger than that between nr. 2 and nr.13, while he eased off in the final straight. He won the european chamionships with a solo from the 3rd of 11 laps and won with almost 10 minutes. In addition to that he has about 30 other victories, often with minutes in front. That's what I call an outlier.

But, there was an interesting article with Thomas de Gendt yesterday in a Belgian newspaper, who said that he won 20 times a year in the novices category, often with minutes, but he didn't turn into the next Merckx (although he has his day from time to time). Of course novices ain't juniors, but juniors ain't pros either.
For now, I'm in doubt.
Your second paragraph was what I was getting at. I'm not interested in if he is an outlier among his current peers, I want to know if other riders have shown the same success in the junior ranks.
 
To put this into perspective, Rohan Dennis destroyed the pro mens' field by roughly the same margin as did Evanepoel, including a sound thumping of Dumoulin by well over a minute. Granted it was a longer distance but seen in that context what Evanepoel was either not abnormal, or completely normal, depending on your degree of cynicism.

For the record, as of right now, I don't think it's quite fair to cast suspicion on RE. At his age level, there are huge differences in physical maturity. 5-10 years from now, we'll know more about where he stands. But at least we'll be able to say that he was good from the beginning!
 
rghysens said:
King Boonen said:
Red Rick said:
MartinGT said:
So whenever a new talent wins a race now we're going to have a new thread?
He's a ridiculous outlier. If we can't be suspicious of outliers then we might as well stop pretending we care.
Is he? I don't follow junior riding at all but I wouldn't be surprised to see other junior riders at least coming close to his level, the distribution at that age is more likely to be larger.
The difference between him and nr. 2 was bigger than that between nr. 2 and nr.13, while he eased off in the final straight. He won the european chamionships with a solo from the 3rd of 11 laps and won with almost 10 minutes. In addition to that he has about 30 other victories, often with minutes in front. That's what I call an outlier.

But, there was an interesting article with Thomas de Gendt yesterday in a Belgian newspaper, who said that he won 20 times a year in the novices category, often with minutes, but he didn't turn into the next Merckx (although he has his day from time to time). Of course novices ain't juniors, but juniors ain't pros either.
For now, I'm in doubt.
Except rider no 2 is one year younger than Evenepoel.
 
Re:

Bolder said:
To put this into perspective, Rohan Dennis destroyed the pro mens' field by roughly the same margin as did Evanepoel, including a sound thumping of Dumoulin by well over a minute. Granted it was a longer distance but seen in that context what Evanepoel was either not abnormal, or completely normal, depending on your degree of cynicism.

For the record, as of right now, I don't think it's quite fair to cast suspicion on RE. At his age level, there are huge differences in physical maturity. 5-10 years from now, we'll know more about where he stands. But at least we'll be able to say that he was good from the beginning!
I wouldn't question him if he hadn't won almost every race he entered.

Also r.e. Dennis- insane performance and I'm surprised there isn't a thread on him.
 
why would there be a thread about Dennis? He beat a clearly sub-par Dumoulin who did 2 full on GT's as leader and still managed 2nd with bad legs. Ofcourse a well prepared champion like Dennis crushed him.
The question is why didn't the rest of the field
 
Need to wait until he's 23-35 in my opinion because that's when your brain and body physiology stops developing and plateaus. He might just be a bit of a freak in that he has little more development still to happen and others will catch up over next few years. It's like at school, when there's always the 6 foot 13 year old with stubble kind of thing.
 

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