Retrospective testing..when boy when!

[cnc-it]

Yes I agree because even if a rider is caught from a retrospective test he still gets to keep all his prize money and wages..he might even be invited with open arms to commentate on cycling and do tv adds like Mr Virenque..so being caught isn't so bad after all.... But seriously I agree with mrhender..unless retrospective testing is enforced properly riders will just call its bluff.. wages should be taken back from a rider found guilty of doping and his prize money given to the next clean rider in the results (after all the guilty rider has stolen the prize money off the clean rider when he cheated to beat him)...that's the only way it will work properly.

Sitting in front of a room full of journalists and tearfully admitting to past wrong doings is one thing but how can it have any substance if all those ill gotten gains are not returned to their rightfull owner ie. Bradley Wiggins (only kidding there btw )

 

[blackcat]

retrospective testing will never occur. how about just normal testing, like the 2007 Tour, the Saunier Duval Piepoli Ricco busts, where there were supposedly >30 positive for myocera? why did not they bust them? I wanna know who they were, and how many Slipstream riders were on it, when Millar and Vandevelde getting target tested in the first week. Supposedly 7 CSC riders were positive.

So if they sweep the positives under the carpet, how on earth can one expect them to go back 3 or 5 years later to bust them?

 

[burning]

I still want to hear some concrete rumors about 2008 Tour regarding 400 positives.

For the topic, I am pretty sure that retroactive testing won't become a thing in near future.

 

[cnc-it]

I think if retrospective testing was to become mandatory for every rider who entered the pro circuit and it was implemented properly, not half heart-idly like other testing procedures have been in the past then it would change cycling for ever and if it was followed through to other sports the same effect would happen there too.

 

[Fearless Greg Lemond]

Still waiting for those 2008 Giro re - tests, or were only Sella and the other scarpegoats using CERA?

And that my friends was a rethoric question.

UCI just says ''dope but keep believable''.

 

[doperhopper]

Re: Re:

Yes - on the track. Maybe Riis was a herring fishing world champion, but it still doesn't mean much on the road.

If you don't want a thread to take a particular direction, don't bring up certain people in a seemingly controversial way.

phenomenal post. early candidate for post of the year

#POY

not impossible - from zero to biggest fish in the pond (and let's not forget Bjarne has plenty of time now)

http://www.fieldandstream.com/blogs/honest-angler/2013/02/doping-ice-fishing-us-anti-doping-agency-says-it-could-happen

 

[mrhender]

Just a little reminder on the previous UCI policy here:

Pat:

“From the UCI’s point of view, we prefer to look forward rather than look backward. To randomly say ‘OK, let’s take all the samples from 2007 from the Tour de France and put them all through testing processes’ … it’s futile, it’s expensive and it’s not going to serve the purpose in the anti-doping fight of today.”

“If we’re going to start rejigging the podium of every major international race over the past two or three years, by finding new tests for new products, and going back to the organizer and saying ‘you’ve got to rejig your podium’ .. it makes a complete mockery of sport.”

The reason I said it would make a mockery of the sport is that if a new product comes on the market, and because of that you decide to do all the tests you did last year and the year before. If you find some positives you are suddenly going back to the organiser and telling them that they better re-jig their podium…. …At some point in time you have got to take a pragmatic decision. That is why the UCI’s view is that we want to look forward, we want to progress. The scientists that are working on the biological passport tell me that this is the way forward and this will greatly assist us in the fight against doping. That is more important than retesting all of the samples of last year’s Tour de France for a product which, to the best of my knowledge and going by all the information we have on the field, wasn’t even available last year”

http://inrng.com/2012/12/uci-retro-testing-rejection/


CIRC was of this opinion:

"Retrospective sample testing is perhaps as great a disincentive to riders as today’s testing is, even more so for the more successful riders. A sample given by a rider should have a mandatory re-testing programme attached to it," the CIRC wrote.

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/circ-recommends-retroactive-testing-survey-of-doping


In Brian Cookson's statement after CIRC he did not even mention (edit: yes, but vaugely) retrospective testing so I wouldn't bet on it being a piority for him...
http://www.uci.ch/pressreleases/the-uci-announces-further-anti-doping-measures-following-circ-report-and-recommendations/

 

[neineinei]

He does mention it, almost at the bottom of the list:

Work with the CADF to build a more robust and comprehensive storage and re-testing strategy;

"A more robust and comprehensive storage and re-testing strategy", what does that mean? In some interview he admitted there'd been preciuos little retesting last year (in other words; zip, zilch, nada). More robust re-testing strategy than none at all, he doesn't promise all that much. According to CIRC there actually are samples stored from earlier years.

 

[mrhender]

Re:

He does mention it, almost at the bottom of the list:

Work with the CADF to build a more robust and comprehensive storage and re-testing strategy;

"A more robust and comprehensive storage and re-testing strategy", what does that mean? In some interview he admitted there'd been preciuos little retesting last year (in other words; zip, zilch, nada). More robust re-testing strategy than none at all, he doesn't promise all that much. According to CIRC there actually are samples stored from earlier years.

Ahh.. Thanks... Somehow missed that even when looking

But yes, that quote is not very promising...

 

[staubsauger]

Giro 2008 samples tested in 3 , 2 , 1 .... 2023!

 

[the sceptic]

retesting samples is always bad for buisness. You never know what might show up.

Better to just avoid that whole mess and say some vauge things about new generations and moving forward.

 

[Tonton]

Re:

To be fair to Wiggins though he did win more than one race in 2012 and since then he's been carrying two stone of extra body weight..not the best prep for climbing in the Alps

Armstrong was only carrying one stone, that's why he was such a great climber

 

[cnc-it]

Pat covering his ass..nothing new there then!

 

[staubsauger]

Re:

Still waiting for those 2008 Giro re - tests, or were only Sella and the other scarpegoats using CERA?

And that my friends was a rethoric question.

UCI just says ''dope but keep believable''.

They actually nailed everyone who likely was CERA positive that Giro, afterwards.

Well except Bruseghin. Very strange act it was.

 

[May0maniac]

Re:

Yes - on the track. Maybe Riis was a herring fishing world champion, but it still doesn't mean much on the road.

If you don't want a thread to take a particular direction, don't bring up certain people in a seemingly controversial way.

Hering fishing world champion lol, that would explain why he's still such a big deal in Denmark.

 

[neineinei]

IOC disqualified Ukrainian open water swimmer Olga Beresnyeva from the 2012 Olympics (6th at the Women’s 10 km open water marathon) after a sample from a pre Games IOC doping control from 28 July 2012 in Kiev was retested in March 2015 and found positive for EPO. (IOC can only DQ, further sanction is up to FINA.)
http://www.olympic.org/Documents/Commissions_PDFfiles/Disciplinary_commission/lrt_001_dc_decision.pdf

The IOC decided to perform further analyses on samples collected during the London Olympic Games. These additional analyses were performed with improved analytical methods in order to detect prohibited substances which could not be identified with the analyses performed at that time.

This shows that there have been improvements in analytical methods for EPO testing recently, just like the retesting cases from biathlon during the winter indicated. Beresnyeva's sample was retested at the Cologne lab, just like Serguei Sednev's. (http://www3.biathlonworld.com/media/pdf/presse/2015-04-24_d679d81c1b66cc3.pdf)

Another golden opportunity for UCI to do some retesting for EPO?

 

[TourOfSardinia]

Re:

To be fair to Wiggins though he did win more than one race in 2012 and since then he's been carrying two stone of extra body weight..not the best prep for climbing in the Alps

He also won Tour of California in 2014.

 

[TourOfSardinia]

Re:

Still waiting for those 2008 Giro re - tests, or were only Sella and the other scarpegoats using CERA?

And still Sella has those Giro mountain stages on his Palmares

 

[cnc-it]

So it's quite feasible that Kreuziger's blood samples might be re tested at a later date..he's not out of the woods yet then!

 

[hrotha]

It's possible and legal, but not probable.

 

[neineinei]

If CADF/UCI worked in a rational manner they would retest samples they had stored from a rider with a suspicious blood profile before they started going down the long, expensive and exhausting road to a bio passport sanction. Not after.

 

[cnc-it]

I think it's important to stress though that it's not just the Bio Passport that is a slow process..riders themselves are using lawyers to slow the appeal process down.

 

[cnc-it]

So the fear of having your blood samples re tested every year would be the most powerful tool ever in the fight against doping I think..but sadly it seems only to be at the bottom of a long list of priorities for the UCI..things such as the use of camper vans instead of hotels seem to be a much more important subject to them!!!!

 

[Dr.Guess]

What about re- testing without re- resulting? So if they re- test a riders blood and some *** shows up, then instead of stripping him (or her) of the result then just ban them for a long time from the day the re- test was taken. (To avoid those Contador moments of serving a ban while riding). Perhaps it the ban could be as long going forward as it took for the re- test be done and shown up. So for example, a riders test get re- tested with new methods after three years and the rider gets busted, then he will serve a three year ban. Perhaps the implications of such a method will be good (i.e clean) or it will tell the riders to dope as much as possible while you can. For me it would serve the purpose of knowing they're trying to cathc the cheaters and that people like Armstrong will get their justice served and the (stupid) public finally will know. It also is good for the racing, as it's not that part of the doping issue that I'm concerned about.

 

[ray j willings]

Dr. ugs qoute "So if they re- test a riders blood and some **** shows up, then instead of stripping him (or her) of the result then just ban them for a long time from the day the re- test was taken"


And if they have retired what purpose does it serve?

"Yeah I doped, yeah I won stuff now I'm retired and the drugs worked and I got away with it, ban me, IM RETIRED "

"So you caught me , big deal ,everyone is doping"

You cannot stop athletes looking for legal or illegal ways to go faster /stronger etc