Stage 16: Ponte Di Legno-Val Martello/Martelltal (139 km)

[hrotha]

I still don't understand why Velo didn't immediatly tell the commissaries about Quintana's behavior... and if he did, why on earth didn't they take action... ?

Because the punishment for doing that according to the rules is being kicked out of the race. Imagine the outrage.

 

[icefire]

Velo actually says that Quintana made signs various times for him to accelerate, and then passed him. Doesn't really look like Hesjedal was leading, from those declarations.

It's obvious that the helmet of the man at the front in that picture is not Quintana's. And it is questionable that those two men had overtaken the moto long enough before the pic was taken so that the man at the front had overtaken both the moto and Quintana. Quintana and Hesjedal were no faster than Cataldo. But it seems that all of them know how to ride their bikes better than the moto man.

 

[Cimber]

It's obvious that the helmet of the man at the front in that picture is not Quintana's. And it is questionable that those two men had overtaken the moto long enough before the pic was taken so that the man at the front had overtaken both the moto and Quintana. Quintana and Hesjedal were no faster than Cataldo. But it seems that all of them know how to ride their bikes better than the moto man.

It really doesnt matter whether or not they were faster than Cataldo. He clearly ignored any red flag too, or he wasnt shown one. What matters is that they (quintana, ryder and Rolland) ignored the red falg and passed the moto (and it doesnt matter much who was in the lead - they all did it).

 

[kareeem]

It's obvious that the helmet of the man at the front in that picture is not Quintana's. And it is questionable that those two men had overtaken the moto long enough before the pic was taken so that the man at the front had overtaken both the moto and Quintana. Quintana and Hesjedal were no faster than Cataldo. But it seems that all of them know how to ride their bikes better than the moto man.

Quintana said that the two europcar riders were leading them down the descent.

And Movistar thinks red flag was only to signal the danger

Unzue defend his race strategy when approached by Cyclingnews in the car park.

"There was a lot of confusion," Unzue told Cyclingnews. "The race organisers and the UCI judges are in charge of the race. Quintana only did what other riders did. The Europcar riders took the descent pretty fast but the race wasn't neutralized. They didn’t say the race was neutralized, they said the motor bikes would signal the dangers by waving a red flag."

 

[Eshnar]

Because the punishment for doing that according to the rules is being kicked out of the race. Imagine the outrage.

C'mon, the most obvious thing to do was just to make them stop and wait for the peloton immediatly. There was no need to dsq them, whatever the rules say, they could have just claimed there was a misunderstanding.

 

[SafeBet]

Quintana was asked if he'd seen a Moto with a red flag raised while descending, to which he replied: "it was raining a lot and we couldn't see much. They told us there would be a Moto in front of us to signal the dangerous bends and we knew they were dangerous".

 

[ILovecycling]

I still don't understand why Velo didn't immediatly tell the commissaries about Quintana's behavior... and if he did, why on earth didn't they take action... ?

Because he is not sure at all imo.It was a total chaos,nothing from these articles and interviews cant be considered as outright facts.

 

[webvan]

It does look like Quintana (build, glasses) and Rolland behind, but yes the question is where was this taken? At the beginning or the end if the "6 hairpins" section?

 

[Wallenquist]

It's Dupont ahead of Pantano at that photo. And it was taken seconds before the red flag was lowered. And later on i had never seen the red flag anymore during the race and for sure there were no moto in front of Cataldo. Confusing for sure!

 

[Eshnar]

Because he is not sure at all imo.It was a total chaos,nothing from these articles and interviews cant be considered as outright facts.

nope, Velo is sure. There's no "maybe" in its words. Either he's putting up stuff or it happened as he says.

 

[Arnout]

Because the punishment for doing that according to the rules is being kicked out of the race. Imagine the outrage.

So why did Velo not warn Quintana? I mean everything was super-chaotic, it isn't a stretch to assume Quintana didn't have information. We know other riders didn't know what's going on (Pozzovivo). Why didn't Velo simply call back Quintana instead of letting him ride and not reacting on it till hours after the race So much trouble could've been avoided if he'd simply done his job.

Also, a lot of riders assumed neutralization meant they could do what they want. Neutralization means maintain the time gap and controlled descent. It doesn't mean you're entitled to stop and assume you have the right to be able to return without problems.

 

[Ryo Hazuki]

Urán himself doesn't seem to complain much:
http://www.biciciclismo.com/cas/site/noticias-ficha.asp?id=72062

words of a truely great man. doesn't surprise me one bit as uran never complains unlike all the anglophones and lefevere. in colombia when the leader has a flat tire teams attack (ask duarte) this is real racing and they are used to it

 

[RedheadDane]

Re overtaking the moto:

Just a thought; but what if the people who overtook that moto did so because they were afraid of slamming into it?
We simply cannot know, we can never know exactly what went on out there.

 

[Netserk]

They overtook a moto with a red flag out despite being instructed on the radio that that was not allowed.

Check the footage around that moment.

 

[ILovecycling]

Quintana was asked if he'd seen a Moto with a red flag raised while descending, to which he replied: "it was raining a lot and we couldn't see much. They told us there would be a Moto in front of us to signal the dangerous bends and we knew they were dangerous".

This.
Im not even sure that overtaking the moto was strictly forbidden

 

[Eshnar]

Re overtaking the moto:

Just a thought; but what if the people who overtook that moto did so because they were afraid of slamming into it?

If that's so, why not just slow down and get back behind it afterwards?

 

[The Hitch]

Has there ever happened something remotely close to this before? I remember riders ignoring safety signs for an approaching train in PR, they got disqualified. I think there should at least be some sort of penalty.

It's not that Quintana had 1.30 at the start of the climb, he also had no tactical worries cause he was clear of his rivals. If he's in the MR group he might wait till 7/8 km from the finish and only gain 1/1,5 minute

Very different but it's 30 years since the helicopters, and this could remain in the memory just as long.

 

[Arnout]

If that's so, why not just slow down and get back behind it afterwards?

If so, why did the moto not react? I hate Marco Velo now. If he is so sure it happened, he should've either called back Quintana or relayed this info to the jury to decide on it right away. But this idiotic statement after the race just makes me angry.

 

[luckyboy]

This is an AG2R rider and a Colombia rider so two from Dupont/Vuillermoz and Chalapud/Pantano.

On the coverage it cuts away for a few seconds and then suddenly after a hairpin corner this moto is behind them. Also at this point they have already been through quite a few hairpins.

 

[Cimber]

Re overtaking the moto:

Just a thought; but what if the people who overtook that moto did so because they were afraid of slamming into it?
We simply cannot know, we can never know exactly what went on out there.

Fair enough if they did that, but then they wait for it afterwards, since it was said that while the flag is up you must not pass

 

[Cimber]

This is an AG2R rider and a Colombia rider so two from Dupont/Vuillermoz and Chalapud/Pantano.

On the coverage it cuts away for a few seconds and then suddenly after a hairpin corner this moto is behind them. Also at this point they have already been through quite a few hairpins.

Still Marco Velo says Quintana passed him while the red flag was up

 

[webvan]

Get your facts straight.
http://www.tinkoffsaxo.com/news/heres-happened-stelvio/

They're not whining like BMC, the DS is just coming up with excuses trying to pretend he and the team did the best they could so that Tinkoff doesn't come after them, hehe...that's obvious with the "2 minute lead at the end of the descent" when only 6 hairpins were concerned by the pacing.

 

[hrotha]

If so, why did the moto not react? I hate Marco Velo now. If he is so sure it happened, he should've either called back Quintana or relayed this info to the jury to decide on it right away. But this idiotic statement after the race just makes me angry.

How do we know Marco Velo didn't do exactly that? Relayed the info to the jury, I mean.

 

[Netserk]

The red flag was there to warn of the dangerous corners. It wasn't a flag of neutralization.

 

[Eshnar]

If so, why did the moto not react? I hate Marco Velo now. If he is so sure it happened, he should've either called back Quintana or relayed this info to the jury to decide on it right away. But this idiotic statement after the race just makes me angry.

totally agree