Stage 16: Ponte Di Legno-Val Martello/Martelltal (139 km)

[Cimber]

"A replay of the race radio message reveals that officials indicated a motorcycle would be placed in front of each group after passing the Stelvio summit, and that riders should remain in their respective group without attacking, until the red flag is removed. The officials never said the entire Stelvio descent would be neutralized."
(Read more at http://velonews.competitor.com/2014...-throws-giro-chaos_329760#YrC8JUoM0A7f34If.99 )

So it wasnt neutralized, BUT you were not allowed to attack or leave your group while red flag was up, but what is this then?:

and

Marco Velo driver of Safety moto"my red flag was up,quintana pass me"!

 

[Eshnar]

Marco Velo driver of Safety moto"my red flag was up,quintana pass me"!

This should have been sanctioned. No questions. Once again the Giro organization covers itself in glory

That said, I still have to watch the stage. But I had fun anyway yesterday

 

[ILovecycling]

I think we should discuss those heroic efforts from tomorrow not bs with neutralising.So I will just add my opinions on riders yesterday performances.

Quintana - its obvious,great ride with balls,lot of time on wind,still had incredible climbing power to make 2 minutes to everybody else except Pierre (1 minut better) and Hesjedal which is impressive,on the other hand I think his legs will even improve and we will see even better Nairo at Zoncolan

Hesjedal - for me Ride of the day,his dropping and chasing back was incredible.I know for this riders its not a new feature but still - heroic ride.Even if he was wheelsucking almost for 50km (with few exceptions) its understandable,and Im not taking away any credit for it.Incredible ride,Bravo Ryder!

Rolland - as for me,almost as strong as Ryder.I think he would have finished about 20-30 seconds down if he wasnt waisting energy.He did almost all descent on front and then on flat part he did massive pulls with Sicard.Bravo Pierre my favourite rider I wish you a podium!

Uran - Rigo is really inteligent racer,but today he too much relied on his team and DS,which was a mistake.He did his pace for last 6k orso,but nothing more cuz he didnt have legs I suppose.On the other hand I think he broke mentally even before that climb,and this dissapointed me (I know it was a difficult situation but a champ should cope with that).

Aru - Seemed to struggle but for my surprise he can measure his strenght!And that very impressive for any young stage race cyclist.He had a bit in tank for last 2 km and it was a good decision.Great tactics with not as good day.Bravo.

Majka - He was in serious trouble in descents but still recuperated well for Martello altough he finished only a few seconds before colombian duo.His climbing is not as impressive how I expected,but there is still lot to come and Grappa will be crucial for him,imo he needs to make time here cuz he can lose a podium at Zoncolan imo.

part 1/2

 

[Cimber]

Also this is a good write on the whole thing:

http://www.sbs.com.au/cyclingcentra...-t-fooling-anyone-over-neutralisation-debacle

 

[Cimber]

Daniel Friebe‏@friebos·8 mins
Amadio (Cannondale boss): 'It's shameful - & I can say that without any real vested interest. Give Quintana the win but cancel time gaps.'

Thats not possible now though, after you have given him the jersey already

 

[Eshnar]

Daniel Friebe‏@friebos·8 mins
Amadio (Cannondale boss): 'It's shameful - & I can say that without any real vested interest. Give Quintana the win but cancel time gaps.'

Thats not possible now though, after you have given him the jersey already

Lol why cancel time gaps. At most they should cancel the time he made on the descent.
Or dsq him right away, together with whoever overtook the red flag.

 

[Jagartrott]

Also this is a good write on the whole thing:

http://www.sbs.com.au/cyclingcentra...-t-fooling-anyone-over-neutralisation-debacle

Agreed. The behaviour of the race director is shameful, assigning blame to everyone but himself.

 

[RedheadDane]

Actually, the thing that scared me the most about the stage wasn't the road surface (it did seem that they didn't need to go very far down before it was fine), but the fact that I several time found myself thinking:

"That whiteness to the side of the road, is that snow, or a big drop into nothing?"

 

[42x16ss]

I'm kinda thinking a few just raced over the top. They didn't stop.

That seems exactly what happened. Instead of stopping for a costume change/potty break/hand holding session with the DS, Quintana and co. kept rolling. It's not like they smashed it down the descent Savoldelli style, they simply followed the lead moto. There's even pictures showing this.

Uran and co had stack of time to react and get the time back too. They only have themselves to blame for thinking that neutralising a section means everyone gets to stop and hold hands for a few minutes.

 

[ILovecycling]

Part 2/2

Pozzovivo - I think he should have attacked earlier on Martello as few other.On the other hand he was in serious trouble in descent from Gavia so it cost him a power.He is in the best position for podium placing (even 2nd imo) as Zoncolan will be his strenght.

Sebastian Henao - Impressive ride by this young man,I was glad he led Rigo to the line it was a mental boost for him of course.We have to hope Sky won't kill him in training as he can be another colombian superstar.Very good ride

Evans - Expected and clear he is not a conteder for podium anymore imn the other hand he fights like always (Tommie style) so Top 5 should be his goal.He measured his legs good in this stage,but like I said,the age of 37...

Mickey Rogers - This guy is a freak,17 race days this year and he dragged MR group for like half of the Martello.Bravo,bravo,bravo impressive - Rigo should pay him some cash imo cuz if they started to attack earlier he would have lost more time.Im looking forward to Tour,I hope he won't be tired!

Cataldo- Wow,this guy has balls!He almost saved Sky's giro.Great solo attack on Stelvio and Cima Coppi.Maybe with some hesitating from MR group (if Q and Rolland were there) he would have win.It reminded me his great effor from Cuitu Negru!

Kelderman - my last man for valuation or rather appreciaton in this case!Incredible ride this Giro.For me maybe the biggest surprise,great dutch talent now maybe with consistency.His problem will be a Zoncolan but he can make top5!

Finished.
Great stage indeed!

 

[Cimber]

That seems exactly what happened. Instead of stopping for a costume change/potty break/hand holding session with the DS, Quintana and co. kept rolling. It's not like they smashed it down the descent Savoldelli style, they simply followed the lead moto. There's even pictures showing this.

Uran and co had stack of time to react and get the time back too. They only have themselves to blame for thinking that neutralising a section means everyone gets to stop and hold hands for a few minutes.

They overtook a moto with a red flag out despite being instructed on the radio that that was not allowed.

 

[classicomano]

So Quintana is full of ****. This leaves a very bad taste in my mouth.

 

[ILovecycling]

They overtook a moto with a red flag out despite being instructed on the radio that that was not allowed.

If they overtook it (Rolland,Nairo and Hesjedal) and it wasnt clearly! allowed,they should remove their time 'bonus' from that descent.
It won't matter still cuz Nairo sould be still 3 seconds in Maglia Rosa.
2.35 on climb + 10 secs bonus on Rigo

I think from GC point of view its pointless cuz he will win it anyway,but anything can happen and because they should respect rules.It would be significant for Ryder and Rolland tho.

 

[boringboy]

It's a bike race is it not? The hungry one's were at the front. Did they pass the red flag, or not - that's my question. If they passed the red flag(?)s, it's a whole different question. If the Race Organizer wants to take over the race then follow (them), as close as possible. That's Racing.

It is not really that simple, you can choose not to see the flag and pretend you did not hear the DS saying it is neutralized.

 

[icefire]

This should have been sanctioned. No questions. Once again the Giro organization covers itself in glory

That said, I still have to watch the stage. But I had fun anyway yesterday

The man at the front in that picture looks like Hesjedal, not Quintana. Quintana's group did not take time on Cataldo in the descent. The men in the moto should be fired for naming only one rider, who was just following the wheel of another rider, and for descending slower than Cataldo.

 

[Cimber]

It's a bike race is it not? The hungry one's were at the front. Did they pass the red flag, or not - that's my question. If they passed the red flag(?)s, it's a whole different question. If the Race Organizer wants to take over the race then follow (them), as close as possible. That's Racing.

They did pass the red flag:

"A replay of the race radio message reveals that officials indicated a motorcycle would be placed in front of each group after passing the Stelvio summit, and that riders should remain in their respective group without attacking, until the red flag is removed. The officials never said the entire Stelvio descent would be neutralized."
(Read more at http://velonews.competitor.com/2014...-throws-giro-chaos_329760#YrC8JUoM0A7f34If.99 )

So it wasnt neutralized, BUT you were not allowed to attack or leave your group while red flag was up, but what is this then?:

and

Marco Velo driver of Safety moto"my red flag was up,quintana pass me"!

 

[webvan]

We don't know where that picture was taken though, was it at the beginning or the end if the "6 hairpins section"?

It's understandable there was some confusion given the dreadful conditions (snow, clouds, cold and being at 2700+ friggin' meters) but the fact that Uran says he wasn't aware Quintana was not there until there was a 40 seconds gap takes the cake!

QS, BMC, Astana, etc...had miles and miles to catch the three guys but just took it easy, treating this as an attack from too far away that would be reeled in, their call. Interestingly the only teams that did some work to that end, AG2R and Saxo are not whining...BMC do have some nerve, because of the other day and because Evans is basically a non-factor at this point anyway with what remains.

 

[Cimber]

The man at the front in that picture looks like Hesjedal, not Quintana. Quintana's group did not take time on Cataldo in the descent. The man in the moto should be fired for naming only one rider, who was just following the wheel of another rider, and for descending slower than Cataldo.

No matter if he just followed Ryder, he shouldnt pass the moto while the red flag was up, but ofcourse Ryder seems to be the bigger sinner

 

[hrotha]

Well well, Marco Velo's testimony does change everything in my opinion.

 

[Jagartrott]

QS, BMC, Astana, etc...had miles and miles to catch the three guys but just took it easy, treating this as an attack from too far away that would be reeled in, their call. Interestingly the only teams that did some work to that end, AG2R and Saxo are not whining...BMC do have some nerve, because of the other day and because Evans is basically a non-factor at this point anyway with what remains.

Get your facts straight.
http://www.tinkoffsaxo.com/news/heres-happened-stelvio/

 

[Eshnar]

The man at the front in that picture looks like Hesjedal, not Quintana. Quintana's group did not take time on Cataldo in the descent. The men in the moto should be fired for naming only one rider, who was just following the wheel of another rider, and for descending slower than Cataldo.

Velo actually says that Quintana made signs various times for him to accelerate, and then passed him. Doesn't really look like Hesjedal was leading, from those declarations.

 

[icefire]

No matter if he just followed Ryder, he shouldnt pass the moto while the red flag was up, but ofcourse Ryder seems to be the bigger sinner

Again, reread the text you just posted. What was the gap between Cataldo and Quintana at the summit and at the end of the descent? Why the moto in front of the main group was slower than Cataldo?

 

[Eshnar]

I still don't understand why Velo didn't immediatly tell the commissaries about Quintana's behavior... and if he did, why on earth didn't they take action... ?

 

[Red Rick]

Has there ever happened something remotely close to this before? I remember riders ignoring safety signs for an approaching train in PR, they got disqualified. I think there should at least be some sort of penalty.

It's not that Quintana had 1.30 at the start of the climb, he also had no tactical worries cause he was clear of his rivals. If he's in the MR group he might wait till 7/8 km from the finish and only gain 1/1,5 minute

 

[Cimber]

Again, reread the text you just posted. What was the gap between Cataldo and Quintana at the summit and at the end of the descent? Why the moto in front of the main group was slower than Cataldo?

cos obviously Cataldo went full ahead. But that doesnt change anything regarding what Ryder and Quintana did