Teams & Riders Tadej Pogačar discussion thread

[KZD]

Yes, someday it will happen, maybe it will be somebody from the same team like uijdtbroeks, but i think vingegaard, pogacar, remco and roglic will still be the best GC riders at least in the next 2 years.

The level of Bernal wasn't that high, so naturally appeared somebody better, it's not the case at the moment.

I wouldn't sleep on Ayuso, he lost a bit of hype last year after missing the Vuelta podium that he had gotten the year before but I don't think his numbers were any worse and he was still the best non-Jumbo despite spending a few months injured.

He is my fifth favourite for this year's Tour and it wouldn't surprise me if he finishes on the podium. I actually think his ceiling as a Grand Tour rider is a bit higher than Remco's.

 

[Froome]

I wouldn't sleep on Ayuso, he lost a bit of hype last year after missing the Vuelta podium that he had gotten the year before but I don't think his numbers were any worse and he was still the best non-Jumbo despite spending a few months injured.

He is my fifth favourite for this year's Tour and it wouldn't surprise me if he finishes on the podium. I actually think his ceiling as a Grand Tour rider is a bit higher than Remco's.

I agree with ayuso. Personally i think uijdtbroeks and ayuso are the most young promising GT riders for the future.

 

[The Clogger]

All Pogacar needs to hit the history books as the best rider of his generation is to have about more three or four seasons like the past three he had.

Yes, he will be the best allrounder. Not the best climber, not the best stage racer and certainly not the best GT rider. If he can't beat Vingegaard in the biggest race of the year it should be obvious.

 

[Miss Violet Smith]

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Making the car go faster.

 

[Elos Anjos]

Yes, he will be the best allrounder. Not the best climber, not the best stage racer and certainly not the best GT rider. If he can't beat Vingegaard in the biggest race of the year it should be obvious.

Predictions about the future like yours are just another kind of astrology. A lot of forum users write like they are standing in the cloud number 9 of cycling.

 

[kn0s]

I agree with ayuso. Personally i think uijdtbroeks and ayuso are the most young promising GT riders for the future.

You think he will ever get a ITT good enough? I have my doubts.

 

[Froome]

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Making the car go faster.

He needs to eat better breakfasts to get more energy in stages like la loze.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1751197943829246366

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[tobydawq]

In top form and without incident, I'd bet on him.

Brave.

 

[Froome]

You think he will ever get a ITT good enough? I have my doubts.

He has room for a lot of improvement, but it will be concerning for uijdtbroeks ff he doesn't improve anything this year in the ITT.

 

[Red Rick]

I honestly can't think of the last time someone was a bigger favorite to win a GT.

 

[Netserk]

I honestly can't think of the last time someone was a bigger favorite to win a GT.

Contador in 2011.

 

[tobydawq]

Contador in 2011.

Bigger? Definitely he was also a big favourite back then but I have a hard time seeing why he would have been bigger than Pogi (pending clenbuterol case notwithstanding).

 

[Netserk]

Contador hadn't lost the Tour the past two years. Will Pogi crack again?

 

[Froome]

Contador hadn't lost the Tour the past two years. Will Pogi crack again?

Pogi is a better rider than what contador was, even in Grand Tours. I don't know how contador would not lose in the past two years.

 

[VayaVayaVaya]

Pogi is a better rider than what contador was, even in Grand Tours. I don't know how contador would not lose in the past two years.

2009 Contador was a monster

 

[SHAD0W93]

I don't think Contador was a bigger favorite than Pogacar is now. Contador was the undisputed king at that point, but his edge over the rest of the field wasn't perceived to be what Pogacars is minus Vingegaard.

Also, the field of the 2011 Giro looked quite strong for that period, whereas the competition for Pogacar looks very tame to me.

It is looking back but at the time it wasn’t for that Giro. All the others listed as favorites, Contador had beat substantially in the previous Grand Tours not to mention that he’d won 5/5 of his previous GT starts.

Looking at some of the betting odds, Pogacar has an advantage from two sites at 1.33 and 1.33 while Contador was 1.6 and 1.73. Second favorite odds for both were rated at 6 while third favorite is advantage to Contador. So it’s similar favoritism for the two according to the bettors.

Not to mention Contador walked away with 2 stages and the points classification when he could have won another 2-4 more plus the mountains classification. It was total domination and what most of us are expecting Pogacar to do as well.

Contador is bookies' favourite for Giro

Bookmakers rank Alberto Contador as outright favourite to take 2011 Giro d'Italia win

www.cyclingweekly.com

Tour of Italy odds – Get the Best Odds at Giro d'Italia | Nicer Odds

Odds comparisons at Tour of Italy (Giro d'Italia) 2024.

m.nicerodds.co.uk

 

[Cookster15]

Contador hadn't lost the Tour the past two years. Will Pogi crack again?

Maybe. More likely fade than crack spectacularly as we saw on stage 17. But likely Pog won’t have the crash and injury interruption he did in 2023. But then this year he is doing the Giro. I am guessing he would need to ride as passively as possible in the Giro to give himself any chance of rivalling Vingegaard at the TdF. Very difficult when you are aiming to win it.

In 2011 Contador was the overwhelming favourite to pull off the double. Everyone is wise in hindsight.

 

[Netserk]

Pogi is a better rider than what contador was, even in Grand Tours. I don't know how contador would not lose in the past two years.

That wasn't the question. Contador was in 2011 a more sure bet to beat his opponents in that Giro than Pogi will be in May. Not because Pogi is likely to fail, but because Contador was even more assured to sail through.

 

[Froome]

That wasn't the question. Contador was in 2011 a more sure bet to beat his opponents in that Giro than Pogi will be in May. Not because Pogi is likely to fail, but because Contador was even more assured to sail through.

I don't know, i think is a sure bet in a similar level.

The most stronger opponent Pog will face, is a former Tour de france winner, but the difference between the two is high, just like contador against scarponi or nibali.

 

[Eddy Evenepoel]

2009 Contador was a monster

He was, but he still got smashed in Dauphine and got beaten in both Paris-Nice (what happened on that stage where he lost almost 3 minutes on LLS, I can’t remember??) and Castilla y Leon that season.

Looking at Pogacar, he hasn’t been beaten in a one week stage races since Itulzia 2021 and has won 8 of 9 of these races in his last 3 seasons. He’s also a monster, even if he’s been spanked two times by Vingegaard in the Tour. Including the tour he’s won 10 of 13 GC starting with the Tour 2020. Damn impressive.

——
when it comes to who was the bigger favorite, I’d say that it’s in my eyes is pretty similar situations, Pogacar this Giro and Contador 2011 Giro.

 

[Froome]

He was, but he still got smashed in Dauphine and got beaten in both Paris-Nice (what happened on that stage where he lost almost 3 minutes on LLS, I can’t remember??) and Castilla y Leon that season.

Looking at Pogacar, he hasn’t been beaten in a one week stage races since Itulzia 2021 and has won 8 of 9 of these races in his last 3 seasons. He’s also a monster, even if he’s been spanked two times by Vingegaard in the Tour. Including the tour he’s won 10 of 13 GC starting with the Tour 2020. Damn impressive.

——
when it comes to who was the bigger favorite, I’d say that it’s in my eyes is pretty similar situations, Pogacar this Giro and Contador 2011 Giro.

It's also fair to say that Contador never faced opponents so strongest than the opponents pogacar faced.

In 2009 he faced a young andy schleck who was also really bad in TT(actually he always was).

Verbier performance gives an incredible aura to contador, he never did the mythical "7 w/kg" that was talked for a long time (it was 6.7 w/kg in a unipuerto stage). It was a very famous and good performance but overrated.

 

[DNP-Old]

It's also fair to say that Contador never faced opponents so strongest than the opponents pogacar faced.

In 2009 he faced a young andy schleck who was also really bad in TT(actually he always was).

Verbier performance gives an incredible aura to contador, he never did the mythical "7 w/kg" that was talked for a long time (it was 6.7 w/kg in a unipuerto stage). It was a very famous and good performance but overrated.

Mate, Contador raced in an era that is completely ancient compared to now. Back when you could win Sanremo on three gels and a banana.

 

[Cookster15]

It's also fair to say that Contador never faced opponents so strongest than the opponents pogacar faced.

In 2009 he faced a young andy schleck who was also really bad in TT(actually he always was).

Verbier performance gives an incredible aura to contador, he never did the mythical "7 w/kg" that was talked for a long time (it was 6.7 w/kg in a unipuerto stage). It was a very famous and good performance but overrated.

No. In 2009 Contador had to beat his own team and Lance. Vingegaard has always had the strongest team to support him, that was very obvious in 2022 but still the case in 2023.

On Verbier, Greg Lemond estimated it would require a VO2 max of 100 to do what Contador did that day. So I guess close to your boy 😉.

It will take a few more years before anyone can claim Vingegaard to be a better stage racer than Contador. For starters Vibgegaard needs to actually win a Giro or Vuelta. Perhaps the reason he hasn’t tried the Giro yet is he has doubts and fears of Pogacar?

Please note I still think Vingegaard is the overwhelming favourite for the TdF, especially with Pog now doing the Giro. But it is a softer looking Giro, both in terms of climbing and possible competition so who really knows how he might recover by July?

 

[Cookster15]

Mate, Contador raced in an era that is completely ancient compared to now. Back when you could win Sanremo on three gels and a banana.

When you could win the Giro after sitting on a beach (2008). At least according to Alberto.

 

[Froome]

No. In 2009 Contador had to beat his own team and Lance. Vingegaard has always had the strongest team to support him, that was very obvious in 2022 but still the case in 2023.

On Verbier, Greg Lemond estimated it would require a VO2 max of 100 to do what Contador did that day. So I guess close to your boy 😉.

It will take a few more years before anyone can claim Vingegaard to be a better stage racer than Contador. For starters Vibgegaard needs to actually win a Giro or Vuelta. Perhaps the reason he hasn’t tried the Giro yet is he has doubts and fears of Pogacar?

Please note I still think Vingegaard is the overwhelming favourite for the TdF, especially with Pog now doing the Giro. But it is a softer looking Giro, both in terms of climbing and possible competition so who really knows how he might recover by July?

Greg lemond estimated that VO2 max because they were talking about him doing 7 or 7.2 w/kg on that day. It's impossible, because on that case, bradley wiggins who finished 1 minute behind, did an unbeliavable performance of 6.8/6.9 w/kg.

Ammattipyoraily calculated 6.7 w/kg.

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