Teams & Riders Tadej Pogačar discussion thread

[Cycling111]

believe me part of that is due to equipment, plus I wouldn't worry about the other UAE riders, maybe they took it easy, the problem is that pog's performance today was quite bad, let's wait the climbs, imo he will be better there, not great but much better than today

I don't think Sivakov took it any more calmly than Kuss.
It was just a bad performance.

 

[Tim Cahill]

Welcome to the Dauphine, where real top riders have their worst race of the season, because the Tour is next month, and to quote the greatest chess player of all time

"Chat, I literally don't care".

Did everyone seriously forget the Slovenian nationals ITT in 2021?

By usual annual patterns for everyone else yeah, though this is the first time Pogacar has looked a bit second hand in 22 months.

I think he's trained heavily earlier in the season for multiple classics style 2-5 minute repeated efforts and is now having to pivot to GT style training, I thought that was part of the issue in 2023 along with the injury. Even for the best it takes time. That and their tt setup doesn't look too good.

 

[fenns]

If he loses the Dauphine to Remco and/or Jonas by a minute he's not turning that around for the Tour. There just isn't time.

 

[Cycling111]

If he loses the Dauphine to Remco and/or Jonas by a minute he's not turning that around for the Tour. There just isn't time.

In 2020, he was far from winning. There have been several Tour winners who have had a modest Dauphine before winning the Tour.
Last year Remco performed worse at Dauphiné than Carlos Rodriguez and in the Tour he was far superior to him.

In any case, Lipowitz finished just 8 seconds behind today. Does that mean Pogacar will be closer to Lipowitz than to the other two in the Tour? Evidently not.
Today's performance was particularly bad. So bad that it's precisely for this reason that it shouldn't be a reflection of what the Tour will be like

 

[Lorzenz08]

If he loses the Dauphine to Remco and/or Jonas by a minute he's not turning that around for the Tour. There just isn't time.

Let see Pogi just started a bit more than a month ago his GC preparation, might just be that he is in the middle of it..

 

[Krzysztof_O]

Either he's sandbagging which I don't believe or he is so bad now that they will crush him on Saturday.

No sandbagging, he was simply bad today. Maybe it was just a bad day and he can improve for the weekend but from what we've seen so far it will be hard to drop Vingo and win this race. The opposite seems more likely actually but let's not overdramatize: "crush" is a strong word.

 

[Red Rick]

No sandbagging, he was simply bad today. Maybe it was just a bad day and he can improve for the weekend but from what we've seen so far it will be hard to drop Vingo and win this race. The opposite seems more likely actually but let's not overdramatize: "crush" is a strong word.

May explain him not attacking yesterday. Wasn't feeling so hot.

 

[Rou]

If his level continues to be so below his standards for the remaining stages I think a valid reason could be a planned long peak for a Tour-Vuelta double.

 

[Izzyeviel]

Pogover.

 

[Cycling111]

If his level continues to be so below his standards for the remaining stages I think a valid reason could be a planned long peak for a Tour-Vuelta double.

If that were the case, he would have gone to Switzerland and not to the Dauphiné to los.
Pogacar doesn't go into a race knowing he's not in shape to win.

It's clear something went wrong in his preparation or calculations. I don't at all believe it was planned to do a time trial at the level of Lipowitz and worse than Jorgenson.

 

[CatchyH]

Pogacar himself said multiple times in this race that he doesn't expect much and that he's already satisfied with his one stage win. You guys never listen to the rider and then you're shocked when they're actually telling the truth.

 

[Didinho]

Could be just a bad day. Maybe getting sick. Or just trained too much to be fresh here. This was definitely not his level today. We’ll have to wait for the next days to have a better view.

A bad Dauphiné doesn’t equal a bad Tour. I’m expecting him to be okay in the mountains.

 

[Rechtschreibfehler]

Pogacar himself said multiple times in this race that he doesn't expect much and that he's already satisfied with his one stage win. You guys never listen to the rider and then you're shocked when they're actually telling the truth.

True, but sometimes it time to run around in circles, while screaming. Try it sometime, it can be fun and cathartic!

On a serious note:
didn't they just come from altitude, expecting to adapt like around the weekend? And didn't the entire team underperform which would make that sound a more likely explanation?

But I am distracting myself, back to screaming and running!

 

[Cycling111]

Pogacar himself said multiple times in this race that he doesn't expect much and that he's already satisfied with his one stage win. You guys never listen to the rider and then you're shocked when they're actually telling the truth.

When did he say that?
I'm surprised he said he'd settle for one stage.
I remember him saying it wasn't important to lead on the first day; he hoped to be on Sunday.

 

[CatchyH]

When did he say that?
I'm surprised he said he'd settle for one stage.
I remember him saying it wasn't important to lead on the first day; he hoped to be on Sunday.

Sunday in Paris is what he said, not on this Sunday.

 

[Rechtschreibfehler]

When did he say that?
I'm surprised he said he'd settle for one stage.
I remember him saying it wasn't important to lead on the first day; he hoped to be on Sunday.

Don't know about during the race, but right before it started, he said in an interview that he doesn't have his GT legs yet, that he basically just started training for it like a month ago and has to tell himself it's not always important to win and relax about the GC in the Dauphiné.

 

[Rou]

When did he say that?
I'm surprised he said he'd settle for one stage.
I remember him saying it wasn't important to lead on the first day; he hoped to be on Sunday.

He said ''Sunday in Paris'' which I thought was a joke but we'll see. If he is average on the climbs (similar level to Remco) but slightly behind Vingegaard I would believe the Tour-Vuelta is on his schedule. If he is really bad in the weekend (on the level of the humans) then UAE should be worried.

 

[fenns]

In 2020, he was far from winning. There have been several Tour winners who have had a modest Dauphine before winning the Tour.

yeah but have they lost to their main Tour rivals by a minute plus? Usually the guy who wins the Dauphin by 60secs+ wins the Tour.

 

[Rou]

Remember when you are watching the climbs in the last 3 stages to pay attention to Pog's cadence. Last year he was doing am Armstrong cadence while this year he is grinding. I saw this on Jebel Hafeet and again today.

 

[rafa92]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1932828244685811902

View: https://x.com/Eurosport_FR/status/1932828244685811902


I posted before saying that UAE has a clear problem in his TT set up, especially when there is a tt like this one (with a very steep hill, with gradients higher than 10%, even if not for long) and that their TT bike is notoriously heavy, and that is obsolete (the bike was released almost 4 years ago and it was obsolete, at least in terms of weight, already in 2023) and in this video you can see Pog clearly knows all of this, he goes there to weigh the TT bike of vingegaard and he's clearly disappointed

 

[pelotonIQ]

Welcome to the Dauphine, where real top riders have their worst race of the season, because the Tour is next month, and to quote the greatest chess player of all time

"Chat, I literally don't care".

Did everyone seriously forget the Slovenian nationals ITT in 2021?

I'm more of a ''The chess cycling speaks for itself'' fan.

 

[rafa92]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1932828244685811902

View: https://x.com/Eurosport_FR/status/1932828244685811902


I posted before saying that UAE has a clear problem in his TT set up, especially when there is a tt like this one (with a very steep hill, with gradients higher than 10%, even if not for long) and that their TT bike is notoriously heavy, and that is obsolete (the bike was released almost 4 years ago and it was obsolete, at least in terms of weight, already in 2023) and in this video you can see Pog clearly knows all of this, he goes there to weigh the TT bike of vingegaard and he's clearly disappointed

btw those who follow all things related to bikes and materials also know that UAE road bike ( the v4 version) was arguably the slowest in the peloton (when taking into account aero capabilities and weight). It remains to be seen if with the newest version (v5) they have at least closed the gap (I can't find sources that made independent and reliable tests on the bike)

 

[CatchyH]

I thought about it a little more and i think this is a clear sign that Pogacar is done. Don't think he'll ever win a bike race again.

 

[Cycling111]

yeah but have they lost to their main Tour rivals by a minute plus? Usually the guy who wins the Dauphin by 60secs+ wins the Tour.

Remco was third in the Tour, far superior to them.

I'm not saying Vingegaard will be worse in the Tour, but Pogacar was so bad today that his Tour will be better than today's. Pogacar won't be 8 seconds behind Lipowitz in the Tour, and worse than Jorgenson, unless he gets sick or crashes.
If Pogacar had lost today to Remco and Vingegaard in third, it would be worrying. But when, on top of that, he's been worse than Jorgenson and at the level of Lipowitz, who was in the breakaway yesterday, it means Pogacar has been at an unusually poor level for him. Just like Remco's unusually poor level in the Dauphiné a year ago. That means that in a less unusual state, he'll improve. I'm not saying he'll win the Tour, but Pogacar's level today is poor and proportionally unrealistic againts several riders.

If Remco had performed worse than Roglic in the Dauphiné, it would have been worrying for him. But performing worse than Derek Gee or De Plus indicated he was unusually poor. And in a less unusual performances, his performance compared to Dauphiné improved proportionally more than that of Pogacar and Vingegaard compared to their previous races, although these were better than Remco in the Tour but the difference between Remco's performance in Dauphiné vs Remco in the 2024 Tour was much higher.
That's what I'm talking about.

1	1	-	ROGLIČ Primož	BORA - hansgrohe	500	250	26″	25:35:40
2	2	-	JORGENSON Matteo	Team Visma | Lease a Bike	400	190	16″	0:08
3	3	-	GEE Derek	Israel - Premier Tech	325	160	14″	0:36
4	5	▲1	RODRÍGUEZ Carlos	INEOS Grenadiers	275	140	10″	1:00
5	7	▲2	DE PLUS Laurens	INEOS Grenadiers	225	120		2:04
6	4	▼2	VLASOV Aleksandr	BORA - hansgrohe	175	110	4″	2:06
7	6	▼1	EVENEPOEL Remco	Soudal Quick-Step	150	100		2:25

 

[Miss Violet Smith]

On the positive side, I haven't had to hear about how Pogačar is ruining cycling today.