Tadej Pogacar and Mauro Giannetti

[GuntherL1]

gotta be motors surely

in athletics the world records for 1500m, Mile and 3000m plus most of the best times for 5k and 10k come from the golden era of EPO. noone's beating middle distances records by minutes.

I don't think so. If you want to see motor doping, look at Froome on the Ventoux. This reminds me of Armstrong.

 

[Blobs]

I don't think so. If you want to see motor doping, look at Froome on the Ventoux. This reminds me of Armstrong.

Froome with a motor would finish three minutes down. Somethings rotten in Denmark, Slovenia and a lot of other places right now.

 

[fenns]

I don't think so. If you want to see motor doping, look at Froome on the Ventoux. This reminds me of Armstrong.

the point I'm making is that if it was down to drugs surely the track guys would have them too - but the times of the 90s and 00s still dominate the middle distance records - noone is smashing these records by minutes. i do suspect it's motors

 

[QueenStagiaire]

I don't think so. If you want to see motor doping, look at Froome on the Ventoux. This reminds me of Armstrong.

Plateau de Beille under 40 minutes is cool, but can you attack through the shallowest corner of Ventoux in the small ring? Seriously, this makes no sense.

 

[Blobs]

This can't go on. It's a freak show at this point.

 

[Cookster15]

One thing I will say is Pog did announce he was changing to 165mm cranks. His super high cadence climbing is obvious.

 

[GuntherL1]

This can't go on. It's a freak show at this point.

Sure it can. The majority of followers still believe. Mainstream media remains silent.
Nine stage victories as a non-sprinter in less than two Grand Tours. The majority with a considerable time difference.
It's absurd for anyone with critical thinking skills.

 

[DoYouEvenRideBruh]

I wonder what the trend will be in the next few years. They can't suddenly dial it back, can they? It's not like they can pretend 26 yeard old Pogi is suddenly on the decline. It can stay the same, which would still be pretty absurd, or it can get worse after Visma escalates again.

Dire times to be a cycling fan. But hey, at least it makes for an entertaining watch.

 

[SantiBotero]

gotta be motors surely

in athletics the world records for 1500m, Mile and 3000m plus most of the best times for 5k and 10k come from the golden era of EPO. noone's beating middle distances records by minutes.

I tend to agree. Last year Jonas itt got me the same feeling. We are far above human limits. Watts numbers are absurd that avoids any type of discussion. And we do not see such progress in other similar sports. For more ridiculous than it looks, motors should have some sort of effect here.

 

[MortiroloForever]

I'm not sure, Visma literally destroyed Pogačar 2 years running including winning by over 7 minutes!! The fact Vingegaard is performing at his current level is unbelievable considering he was so injured.

The main problem for me is that both of them are increasing their level from one year to another in brutal margins and considering they were at a supertop level 2 years ago it's much to say.

3 years ago Carapaz was fighting for the podium and stage wins on the Pyrennes with this duo, and I accept he had bad luck in these last 2 years, but even considering that, where is Carapaz now? They are indestructible even after injuries. They come from a recovery and a not perfect approach for the Tour (2023 and 2024) and they are not only the best, they also increase the difference against the others (and many of them are also getting better numbers). In the specific case of Pogacar, he is on the way to spend all the year without having a single bad day, performing at historic level in terms of numbers and wats and doing solo breaks from 50 miles to the finish line as if it doesn't require any effort. We are in the "No limits era".

 

[ivanic]

Everyone disgusted, usual hundreds of posts on X with thousands of likes, and then? Then? Nothing.

Today we hit rock bottom, no, don't follow anymore this squalid show. Or you like free sodomy.

Yes, I'm starting to think about motordoping. Probably something magnetic in the rear wheel.

Today we hit rock bottom.

https://lanternerouge.com/2024/07/1...ateau-de-beille-tour-de-france-2024-stage-15/

https://twitter.com/x/status/1812510648720294082

View: https://x.com/festinaboy/status/1812510648720294082


At least Calmejane breaks the hypocrisy

https://twitter.com/x/status/1812565373356748998

View: https://x.com/L_Calmejane/status/1812565373356748998

 

[Stablo]

Hello there!

I have been reading this forum for years, thanks for all posters for great insight and discussion over the years. I have been a big fan of procycling since the late 90s. Today I had to register, because of these last couple of days and actually the whole season of Poggie-boys performances, its getting beyond ridicilous. I havent felt so frustrated with the state of things since Pharmastrong and the situation with Teddy&UAE is worse. I dont claim the others are clean or smth, but it is beyond doubt that theres smth special going on with this one. Vinge also, but this is not his thread and at least his not dominating all the aspects of the sport. This all has been said here many times before, but doesnt get old cause its true. The UAE-connection and the sudden rise from a good junior to a dominating force in all disclipenes of the sport(since PDBF 2020)and with the backround of the team is the most annoying. Thats why I welcomed even JV:s ET performances, cause at least we wouldnt have to follow a one sided sh*tshow for years again.

That all said, im from a non-cycling nation, Finland it is, but we have some passionate following here too 🙂 and I can admit that im a bit of a Remco fan 😅 since the first stories started to come around abt him, i was sold! That makes the current situation in the pro-peloton even more absurd to me. I am not Indicating Remco is clean either, I do hope thou that its the level humanly achievable against the mutants 😉

Talking about talent and sports this Poggie!&Vinge rise to dominate is like the Feeniks coming from the dust. Imagine that all the sudden Usain Bolt, Tom Brady, Lionel Messi, Connor McDavid, LeBron James Cheptegei etc. etc. would all the sudden be dominated by some "second tier" talents?

Only good thing abt today is that also in socialmedia people are starting to question the state of affairs, but theres still a lot of braindead fanjerking going around 🫠

P.S. I would have hoped that my first msg to this forum would have been on the other side😁, but what can you do with the current affairs.

P.P.S. On an otherwise great forum I find it funny that you cant adress clinic-issues on the normal side, but maybe thats good considering the history of our beloved sport 😍😎

edit I forgot to mention that our loved Teddy-boy Poggie only started his rise to stars after signing with UAE, the money and Gianetti...think about that

 

[gregrowlerson]

The riders upon seeing their numbers:

Remco: "I'm probably going to win the Tour De France!"
Jonas: "I'm definitely going to win the Tour De France!"

Remco & Jonas in unison: "What are Pog and Mou smiling about?"

Lance: "If this circus is allowed to continue then I really ought to get my seven tours back."
Alberto: "The second place is actually now very good."
Primoz: "Why not just crash out, eh?"

 

[magliaroz]

I wonder... Will Pogi go thermonuclear again in the final ITT or will he pretend to be human and leave the stage win to his new BFF Remco?

 

[SHAD0W93]

I wonder... Will Pogi go thermonuclear again in the final ITT or will he pretend to be human and leave the stage win to his new BFF Remco?

I think he wants another stage win but won’t mind if Adam/Almeida or Evenepoel win.

 

[42x16ss]

The main problem for me is that both of them are increasing their level from one year to another in brutal margins and considering they were at a supertop level 2 years ago it's much to say.

3 years ago Carapaz was fighting for the podium and stage wins on the Pyrennes with this duo, and I accept he had bad luck in these last 2 years, but even considering that, where is Carapaz now? They are indestructible even after injuries. They come from a recovery and a not perfect approach for the Tour (2023 and 2024) and they are not only the best, they also increase the difference against the others (and many of them are also getting better numbers). In the specific case of Pogacar, he is on the way to spend all the year without having a single bad day, performing at historic level in terms of numbers and wats and doing solo breaks from 50 miles to the finish line as if it doesn't require any effort. We are in the "No limits era".

It's a time warp back to the mid 90s

 

[houtdffan]

I wonder... Will Pogi go thermonuclear again in the final ITT or will he pretend to be human and leave the stage win to his new BFF Remco?

Pog's beyond thermonuclear. He and Vingo are throwing around anti matter bombs.

Need Remco to break out the star destroyers

 

[Jumbo Visma Fan :)]

I don’t know man, I missed out on the Combloux ITT but seeing this performance on the Beille just sickened me. I don’t know when the point of no return for Pogi is, but I think he’s crossed it today.

 

[Amazinmets87]

I think LA likes to act dumb on his podcast, but in his day he was miles ahead of everyone in terms of training, preparation and nutrition ect, regardless of doping, he was ahead of his time.

Wasn't that due to Ferrari? You don't have to be too bright to adhere to a doping regime.

 

[Andon]

At this point there's no turning back and we need to see this circus all the way through with Pog winning la Vuelta

 

[Rackham]

Wasn't that due to Ferrari? You don't have to be too bright to adhere to a doping regime.

Indeed. Ferrari was earning millions selling his knowledge. Good business.

Evidently nothing has changed, except the doctors aren't freelancers anymore, i.e. they'll be imbedded within the teams like before the Festina affair.

For me there's so much wrong with what we just watched, i.e. like how come Pog & Vinge have increased their level so much they'd demolish their former selves from last year on Joux Plane or Puy de Dôme? I remember cute conversations on this forum a year ago in which dozens of users argued about how Vingegaard was a better climber on longer climbs than Pog, i.e. like there was some sort of logic in anything we're watching. It's all bullsh*t.

I also reject claims Vingegaard isn't at his best... because I refuse to accept his performances as he is. I mean if his best yesterday would have been to follow Pog or god forbid actually drop him, then what the f*ck are we even watching?

These two guys aren't practising the same sport as the rest. Evenepoel is going to have a spend a lifetime playing catch-up. The media are acting dumb on purpose as well, i.e. a long time ago on Eurosport the French commentators laughed at the absurdity of Rasmussen sprinting versus Contador on Peyresourde back in 2007. Now? Total radio silence.

They hide behind stuff like "no proof, no reason to suspect" but that never stopped them prying & asking questions 20 years ago. Now they're simply profiteering along with the rest (Netflix included).

 

[Salvarani]

So, how does tailwinds, better diets, better bikes, marginal gains etc, explain this level of unprecedented performance, with the times of the kings of EPO and blood doping being obliterated:

New Top 100 Plateau de Beille: The takeover

1. 2024: 39:50 Tadej Pogacar 23.95 km/h 2. 2024: 40:58 Jonas Vingegaard 23.29 km/h 3. 2024: 42:41 Remco Evenepoel 22.35 km/h 4. 1998...

www.climbing-records.com

All that + The Goat

 

[fenns]

i understand that yesterday JV was at his best ever. It's a fact.

 

[gregrowlerson]

Landa missed it by a handful of seconds

I can still see Mikel's halo.

 

[ashhutch1997]

Sure it can. The majority of followers still believe. Mainstream media remains silent.
Nine stage victories as a non-sprinter in less than two Grand Tours. The majority with a considerable time difference.
It's absurd for anyone with critical thinking skills.

It's 2024, critical thinking skills don't exist! You can't go against mainstream narrative about any subject without being accused of anything.