Tadej Pogacar and Mauro Giannetti

[Gianetti_Is_The_Goat]

I actually kind of believe that Visma's up and down performances kind of look more natural to me. Same for plenty other riders. Pogacar is the clear outliers in every aspect. So is his team often.

I don't think Adam Yates, Narvaez were suddenly great now, it was more that Jorgenson, Yates and Kuss were not good. But that all doesn't matter. Pogacar always says the same boring things in interviews post race. Always saying how great his team was blablabla. Really if his team did nothing he would have still some today's performance.

Also there's just no critics left in cycling and the media... They all are numb and choose to bow. I think time will tell, a year or 10 or so?

But I also think that when Pogacar is ending his career he will leave into the unknown, I don't see him taking up some public role in cycling.

I don't think it will ever come out unless some disgruntled team member starts talking. Then again, I don't even know who's fully aware in the team.

 

[fenns]

Has anyone read/watched/heard a critical comment in the press about Pogacars performance today?

All sports journalists have got their noses in the trough. Even when dopers like Jack Sinner get caught they end up being the heroes.

 

[Lorzenz08]

True, he had an estimated 6.75 W/kg over 35 minutes, numbers that were last achieved (prior to 2020) in the EPO era and most of us are like "meh, he underperformed" We are becoming anesthetized to it.

This is with 60kg. Pogi is not 60. He is around 64

 

[Stablo]

Nope no chance of that happening

Not from the traditional press, but the socialmedia has more and more critical comments. Off course it's not nearly enough, but at least more people have had enough and are starting to realise that maybe there's something terribly wrong in this picture.

 

[Forever The Best]

When is the last time he had a bad day? 2023 Worlds TT? Or if you think that does not matter, Courchevel 2023?
I think he has been on the podium of every race he has done since 2023 Lombardia with the exception of 2024 Quebec.
And he races from February/March to October. On all kinds of races.

 

[JosefK]

The funniest aspect of all this is that Pog maintains peak form all year round. After he wins the Vuelta later this year (after winning the TDF by at least 5 minutes, using the final week for training), UAE will probably analyze the media reaction ... and if it's deemed safe to proceed, then Pog will win all three grand tours in 2026 (barring illness or injury).

 

[Gianetti_Is_The_Goat]

The saddest thing is that we now know that a cycling 'phenomenon' can be manufactured, because pre-UAE Pogacar was far from great.

 

[kingjr]

The saddest thing is that we now know that a cycling 'phenomenon' can be manufactured, because pre-UAE Pogacar was far from great.

From a 2018 article shared on the first page of his thread in the other part of the forum:

"one of the most talented U23s in the world, possessing an ability to both climb and time trial, as well as being able to sprint really quickly at the end of hard stages. This makes him a very hard cyclist to drop and it is scary to think he hasn’t even turned 20 yet. He seems destined for the pros in 2019, and the sky really is the limit for him. To be honest, it is a privilege to interview such a talented rider before he truly “makes” it. Remember the name, as he seems destined for stage race, Monument and possibly even Grand Tour success over the next fifteen years."

 

[Stablo]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1945949777683681503

View: https://x.com/LUMA21m/status/1945949777683681503?s=19

Look at the innocent young rider on the right. He could have been pog vol 1.0, but honest Mauro was still practicing, didn't have the unlimited financial resources and apparent Lance like protection from the UCI. I still remember watching in disbelief Riccos attacks, the same way I watched poggies PDBF TT. The stories took a very different path and this current one has gone more absurd year after year.

 

[Gianetti_Is_The_Goat]

From a 2018 article shared on the first page of his thread in the other part of the forum:

"one of the most talented U23s in the world, possessing an ability to both climb and time trial, as well as being able to sprint really quickly at the end of hard stages. This makes him a very hard cyclist to drop and it is scary to think he hasn’t even turned 20 yet. He seems destined for the pros in 2019, and the sky really is the limit for him. To be honest, it is a privilege to interview such a talented rider before he truly “makes” it. Remember the name, as he seems destined for stage race, Monument and possibly even Grand Tour success over the next fifteen years."

I have this tendency to check facts. He won one stage that entire season. I'm not that impressed.

 

[kingjr]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1945949777683681503

View: https://x.com/LUMA21m/status/1945949777683681503?s=19

Look at the innocent young rider on the right. He could have been pog vol 1.0, but honest Mauro was still practicing, didn't have the unlimited financial resources and apparent Lance like protection from the UCI. I still remember watching in disbelief Riccos attacks, the same way I watched poggies PDBF TT. The stories took a very different path and this current one has gone more absurd year after year.

Fun fact: '96 Piepoli was around 90 seconds faster than in '08

 

[kingjr]

I have this tendency to check facts. He won one stage that entire season. I'm not that impressed.

Someone was. That statement was made at the time, and not with the benefit of hindsight.

 

[Stablo]

The saddest thing is that we now know that a cycling 'phenomenon' can be manufactured, because pre-UAE Pogacar was far from great.

Even thought it's super sad and annoying, we have to give Mauro&UAE respect how they build this story. This innocent and positive guy from a small nation with some talent, could all the sudden be sold as some sort of generational talent/world beater and with carefull media management&lot of money not enough people were asking questions. I actually don't see a lot of difference compared to the case of Il Cobra, except he got busted fast, when the crazy too good to be true performances started to happen.

 

[ashhutch1997]

I'm 🤏 close to giving up on watching this sport.

 

[peterfin]

“I imagine that if he didn’t crash, he would have won by four minutes,” Wellens said, tongue-in-cheek, but definitely not tongue-in-cheek.

So now we know why Pogacar's effort was only marginally super-human today.

 

[ashhutch1997]

This sport is dead.

This unfortunately is true, how ridiculous will it get before something is done?

 

[Red Rick]

“I imagine that if he didn’t crash, he would have won by four minutes,” Wellens said, tongue-in-cheek, but definitely not tongue-in-cheek.

So now we know why Pogacar's effort was only marginally super-human today.

@Pozzovivo least arrogant team

 

[Pozzovivo]

@Pozzovivo least arrogant team

Well, this fits very well with my comment earlier actually. Many of the riders are very arrogant. Pog is super arrogant, Politt etc etc. But the team management is not in general like Visma.

Never said Pog and the emirate-boys are not arrogant. They are - but not like Visma-Lab. Arrogant individuals in the team (riders) but the management is always very humble and fair actually. While I don't like Matxin or Gianetti or Haupman or Sola, they never go out and say that "Teams should look up to us and do what we do - learn from us!" That's exactly the Jumbo-Visma-vibe for 5 years now.

 

[burning]

Has anyone read/watched/heard a critical comment in the press about Pogacars performance today?

Well, the "press" or journalists in general matters a lot less in general compared to 10 years ago, and a lot less compared to the Lance era. Does anyone care if some journalists talk about this, which will be forgotten in 3 days, and you will get insulted in twitter.

The only thing that can stop this, or any top-level team, has been a police raid like Festina or Puerto, which has not happened since Puerto or 2008 Tour if I recall correctly.

 

[burning]

Someone was. That statement was made at the time, and not with the benefit of hindsight.

Yes, this is not a Froome situation where Sky had to flood the zone with BS like Badzilla to explain Froome's performance. Pogacar was already climbing with WT-level guys on a team from Slovenia

 

[Saint Unix]

"Can I get a G and an S, Pat?"

 

[b0ydman]

I'm 🤏 close to giving up on watching this sport.

It's lost me

Another era dominated by the newest GOATs who can ride back to back tours, I've been here 4 times before.

We know how it ends, as it will eventually for Wiggins and Froome

One day I just stopped watching it, I wake up see the result - same people same herculean performances same hunchback blowing off everyone else huffing out of their saddles. I found I just didn't miss it

When I tune in before I go to bed (Australia) its now in the hope that there is a big breakaway with a chance for the lesser knowns to grab a crumb.I look at flags hoping for cross winds.

Yeah we get it, they need more than bread and water to entertain us for 21 days we understand that. But not this.

 

[Saint Unix]

Yeah we get it, they need more than bread and water to entertain us for 21 days we understand that. But not this.

Yeah, it might be hypocritical of someone who wants a totally clean sport to turn a blind eye to everyone spreading a bit of extra butter on their toast, but at the moment it seems like half the peloton is scraping on just enough butter that they feel they can safely get away with saying it's just plain old bread, while most of the other half have come to realise they can keep smearing as many giant blobs of the stuff on as they can afford to and most people will just glance at it and see a normal and unproblematic sandwich. Then there's a select few that are sprinking a couple of breadcrumbs on top of a stick of dynamite and insisting that the abomination you're looking at is still just a totally normal slice of toast.

 

[Cagalitroso]

hahahhahahahahahahahah

https://twitter.com/x/status/1945900812460233014

View: https://x.com/itvcycling/status/1945900812460233014

 

[Cookster15]

Indurain made everything on TTs. He didn't demolish others on climbs

With the best TT ever seen in cycling Indurain didn't have to demolish his rivals on climbs - but he certainly could if he wanted to. Ironically one time he did was Hautacam - 1993. On that occasion Indurain demolished his main rival Tony Rominger by over 2 minutes - similar to Vingegaard's time loss today. Also unable to keep up with Big Mig that day was non other than Marco Pantani.