Tadej Pogacar and Mauro Giannetti

[AttaqueDeRolland]

By the way, I love how some people are trying to argue that he's looking more human this year, when he is, in fact, winning at a higher frequency than ever before.

Average individual racedays (excluding TTTs) per individual win & overall GC-win:

• 2019: 7,50
• 2020: 4,78
• 2021: 4,69
• 2022: 3,38
• 2023: 2,82
• 2024: 2,32
• 2025: 2,17

Don't kid yourselves, just because he didn't win Sanremo, Roubaix, and Amstel. Pogi is better than he's ever been.

 

[Tricycle Rider]

Damn, he looks like Dracula in this photo. Or one of the vampires in Skyrim.

I think you're onto something.

 

[Barkintheeye]

Oh yeah it was completely natural, i see it now. So nothing to see here in this part of the forum. All can go to the fanboy conversation to praise Poggie-boy and his otherwordly natural boundaries breaking talent. Geez. It was a gear change afterall. That explains the past few seasons of effortless around year wins/attacks.
P.S. That attack had nothing to do with an natural looking one, if the irony didn't open. Vroom vroom.

The bike / motor doping just seems so incomprehensibly risky and unlikely to escape controls. Further, albeit all cheating should be treated equally, motor doping is just so completely shameful and with enough motor even we could win GTs and 1D classics. I just don't believe Pog could stomach those kind of "wins".

'Ordinary doping' is another matter. Riders seem to convince themselves that "everybody does it and so can I and that's just fair". I hold that as a much more likely cause to his extraordinary performances.

 

[E_F_]

So, I think the second clip in the post from Tour de e-Dope, shows that the Pogster probably likes riding with his thumbs pressing down on the very top of the hoods (right? hoods?). What I will say is that I doubt his high cadence is actually effective.

 

[Mayomaniac]

I think you're onto something.

Nah, the cape goes on Gianetti himself!

 

[E_F_]

Also the winners bikes often (or even always at bigger races?) get checked for motors.

Well... Ngh... Ah... Sort of? Maybe? A bit? Sometimes?

 

[Samu Cuenca]

The guy's hands are so dirty not even Jannik Sinner would hire him as a masseur.

However, I also fail to see how his riding can't be explained by medical doping, which we know is both effective and possible to get away with. The fact that it is at times possible to beat him is also more in line with blood boosting, which can sometimes go wrong or be equaled by others, rather than the use of an engine.

Sure, he's riding very fast, but so is everyone these days, and I doubt they all got engines in their bikes, cause then nothing should be stopping them from catching him more regularly.

I have no reason to believe that there aren't riders who have been/are willing to use engines (especially in time trials) or shoot a cat if they think it can make them faster, but I assume it would be much harder to stay dominant for a long time that way (even though UAE obviously have a lot of resources), since there's not the same kind of limit to what's possible to achieve for the opponents as there is in the medical department.

 

[Tricycle Rider]

Nah, the cape goes on Gianetti himself!

True, very true. But Gianetti let Pog borrow it just because of the rain at FW.

 

[Red Rick]

The bike / motor doping just seems so incomprehensibly risky and unlikely to escape controls. Further, albeit all cheating should be treated equally, motor doping is just so completely shameful and with enough motor even we could win GTs and 1D classics. I just don't believe Pog could stomach those kind of "wins".

'Ordinary doping' is another matter. Riders seem to convince themselves that "everybody does it and so can I and that's just fair". I hold that as a much more likely cause to his extraordinary performances.

Any reason to dismiss it that depends on "he just wouldn't do that" can be blindly dismissed.

 

[E_F_]

Watch the video of his final acceleration at 0.25 speed.

Yeah, you can see that his butt is sliding backwards and forwards almost the full length of the saddle with every stroke of the pedals...

Also, he's actually slipping and sliding with his back wheel. He looks like MvdP on the Koppenberg last year.

I have to say, the more I look at it, the less motor-y it appears to me (and I didn't think "motor" when watching it live). The thing is, you can see the bike move forward with every pedal-stroke.

 

[E_F_]

Amazing performance - maybe his best ever apart from Plateau de Beille 2024.

Generally he's improved greatly from pre 2024

​

Hey, we're kind of in the middle of something here! Hehe.

 

[Stablo]

The bike / motor doping just seems so incomprehensibly risky and unlikely to escape controls. Further, albeit all cheating should be treated equally, motor doping is just so completely shameful and with enough motor even we could win GTs and 1D classics. I just don't believe Pog could stomach those kind of "wins".

'Ordinary doping' is another matter. Riders seem to convince themselves that "everybody does it and so can I and that's just fair". I hold that as a much more likely cause to his extraordinary performances.

Yes it's very risky and the consecuents would be very dramatic and that's why if used I think there's a deal between the UAE& the Devil, later being the UCI. The controversy after WC with Dopacars bike would hint to that something shady is going on and after yesterday it's more likely again than not. Also skipping the olympics with a ridicilous reason seems weird. Maybe it's been always there or was added after 2022&2023, when vampire&UAE noticed they can't win Vingo anymore in the biggest race of the year. Handy extra watts with some super juice would also explain why he basically never get's fatiguet and is capable for monster performances all year round. It's was mind blowing how easy it was to win both Giro&Tour, spring classics, WC and Lombardia, usually with unreal solos.

 

[Red Rick]

If you're huffing carbon monoxide all year you can have high oxygen vectors all year.

The periodization of old school blood doping is soooooo 1994.

 

[Stablo]

The guy's hands are so dirty not even Jannik Sinner would hire him as a masseur.

However, I also fail to see how his riding can't be explained by medical doping, which we know is both effective and possible to get away with. The fact that it is at times possible to beat him is also more in line with blood boosting, which can sometimes go wrong or be equaled by others, rather than the use of an engine.

Sure, he's riding very fast, but so is everyone these days, and I doubt they all got engines in their bikes, cause then nothing should be stopping them from catching him more regularly.

I have no reason to believe that there aren't riders who have been/are willing to use engines (especially in time trials) or shoot a cat if they think it can make them faster, but I assume it would be much harder to stay dominant for a long time that way (even though UAE obviously have a lot of resources), since there's not the same kind of limit to what's possible to achieve for the opponents as there is in the medical department.

I just think he has been super juiced since joining Vampire-Gianetti's team and the electric has been added at some point/some events to get the extra watts. For example in some races if his not feeling super fresh. Just to make sure the Vingo beating of 22/23 doesn't happen again.

 

[Stablo]

I have to say, the more I look at it, the less motor-y it appears to me (and I didn't think "motor" when watching it live). The thing is, you can see the bike move forward with every pedal-stroke.

That's what happens with some electric assistance too, it just gives you the monster level wattage around the year, every race. To make sure no one can follow. PEDs wasn't anymore enough against Vingo on high mountains, so with some extra power he can beat every specialist aswell.

 

[Unchained]

I can't figure out if people are intentionally getting off message!! Pogacar is getting blood transfusions with worms, riding a bike with an motor and associated controls that are ignored by public, bike inspectors, post race inspections, race organizations and then the kicker he either doesn't use the advantages or loses intentionally so that he can save credibility for cheating correctly for certain races.
If these motors are available, why not everyone on UAE? And why crash? That's a puzzle for sure!! Why come into corners too hot or take chances on decents when you can overcome everything, everyone with the push of a button!!!?
And I still never got the payroll report for why all these people are either doing UAE dirty work for free..or what is the method for payment agreements for all involved!!

 

[Stablo]

I can't figure out if people are intentionally getting off message!! Pogacar is getting blood transfusions with worms, riding a bike with an motor and associated controls that are ignored by public, bike inspectors, post race inspections, race organizations and then the kicker he either doesn't use the advantages or loses intentionally so that he can save credibility for cheating correctly for certain races.
If these motors are available, why not everyone on UAE? And why crash? That's a puzzle for sure!! Why come into corners too hot or take chances on decents when you can overcome everything, everyone with the push of a button!!!?
And I still never got the payroll report for why all these people are either doing UAE dirty work for free..or what is the method for payment agreements for all involved!!

Ignorance is a bliss. A fast example US Postal and Lance was off limits also, the current money horse is UAE, theyre winning almost all of it, only crumbs left to others. Off course the can't let it go completely bonkers, thou we are closing it when more and more people are getting annoyed and asking questions.

 

[Unchained]

Ignorance is a bliss. A fast example US Postal and Lance was off limits also, the current money horse is UAE, theyre winning almost all of it, only crumbs left to others. Off course the can't let it go completely bonkers, thou we are closing it when more and more people are getting annoyed and asking questions.

I honestly have zero idea what you are talking about!!
Lance was Trek, Gatorade, Livestrong, Discovery, US Post Office, Nike, Giro, Bell, Oakleys..not selling clothes that are hard to find, MET helmets, no name sunglasses and Colnagos!! The amount of money that was being shoveled into Armstrong engine was 10 times anything Pogacar' personality is generating!! His TDF victories are celebrated in a cycling echo chamber bubble, nobody cares!! He isn't a world wide celebrity!! Don't kid yourself!! Cycling has exploded in exposure because of cable TV and social media and with all that more people still watch dog shows, darts ,bowling and billiards compared with bike racing!! A few elite pro golfers make as much in a couple of good weeks than Pogacar clears in a year.. The number of people and mega corporations that had an interest in letting Lance not lie himself into scandal was long and well funded.. Pogacar is not able to move the meter..
that is probably the only compelling thing about most of the muck people type.. Why are big multi nationals steering clear of Pogacar and UAE? Why would a sugar drink company like Coke, Gatorade, Red Bull, Monster try some association? Maybe they have done some research and think the liability is too massive.. Why would some company ( companies) want to be associated with the most winning team in cycling history? Maybe they discover some skeletons and opt out!!?

Lance was the only one punished, UCI ,everyone in cycling who played along, lied along with him, nothing.. Nike, Trek, half dozen others who knew the score but shut up and cashed the checks.. No punishment.. Nothing.. Trek,Nike, Gatorade should have been banned from cycling, Olympics and sponsorship of anything, dirty, dirty, filthy dirty cheaters..

 

[Mayomaniac]

True, very true. But Gianetti let Pog borrow it just because of the rain at FW.

Dracula Gianetti drained him of all the cobbled classics blood after AGR and the put fresh one into him, no wonder Pogacar looked undead after FW.

 

[Casual cyclist]

Yeah, you can see that his butt is sliding backwards and forwards almost the full length of the saddle with every stroke of the pedals...

Also, he's actually slipping and sliding with his back wheel. He looks like MvdP on the Koppenberg last year.

I have to say, the more I look at it, the less motor-y it appears to me (and I didn't think "motor" when watching it live). The thing is, you can see the bike move forward with every pedal-stroke.

Well, that means he kept pushing the pedals even after activating the assist. No s**t. But did you honestly expect him to stop pedaling altogether? A simple back-of-envelope calculation shows that immediately after his "attack'', the system Pog+motor puts in excess of 800W (possibly more) to the ground. How much of that would you want the motor to take on? Obviously, he had to keep pushing and his contribution likely exceeded that of the motor and that's why overall it did look somewhat "pedaly". But the extra contribution of that motor (the continuous input on top of Pogo's pedal pushing) made sure that gap magically appeared and kept growing, and Pogo himself could still breathe through his nose at the finish. If the new rules are that it has to be 100% motor to be considered motor-doping, then yeah he is clean as fresh snow.

 

[HashRouge]

That's what happens with some electric assistance too, it just gives you the monster level wattage around the year, every race. To make sure no one can follow. PEDs wasn't anymore enough against Vingo on high mountains, so with some extra power he can beat every specialist aswell.

I have no idea if he's doping (or Vingegaard, Remco, MdvP etc). However, I don't buy the motor-doping theory for a number of reasons. If he's got some sort of secret motor, I don't understand why he gets caught by Vinegaard on Le Lorian, or why he can't drop MdvP and Ganna on the Cipressa, or why he gets caught at Amstel. It also seems that it would be SO difficult to keep secret and it would rely upon so many different people to keep quiet. I could sort of buy that UAE is doing something shady with blood doping or something else that is undetectable by testing. But surely a motor in his bike would ping every time a commissaire checks his bike - even if you assume some sort of big conspiracy theory where UAE is paying off half the UCI officials, all it would take is ONE honest official. It would be SO easy to get caught.

 

[AmRacer]

Just watch the last 1.2km of this race and tell me it looks normal how Poga accelerates. You can't. It's an E-bike he's riding. Just f-ing look at the cadence and the sudden change in speed.

Mathieu is faster than any e-bike

 

[E_F_]

Mathieu is faster than any e-bike

No one is saying "any e-bike" c'mon. We're talking a small, but significant boost to an already super doped rider.

 

[Ilmaestro99]

The part after his attack on the final ascent of mur de huy is missing from his strava file for the race.

 

[Gratemans]

The bike / motor doping just seems so incomprehensibly risky and unlikely to escape controls. Further, albeit all cheating should be treated equally, motor doping is just so completely shameful and with enough motor even we could win GTs and 1D classics. I just don't believe Pog could stomach those kind of "wins".

'Ordinary doping' is another matter. Riders seem to convince themselves that "everybody does it and so can I and that's just fair". I hold that as a much more likely cause to his extraordinary performances.

This is word for word exactly how I feel about it. But then I see him sprinting away on the Mur while sitting down and I can't deny that there are at least some doubts in my mind.
But all in all.. yeah it's just very hard to believe he would want to win like that.