TDF Stage 14 - Sunday, July 18 2010, Revel - Ax-3 Domaines, 184 km

[roundabout]

Has anyone of note missed the time limit. Pettachi? Cav? THor?

Nope, all are still there.

 

[theyoungest]

I heard he is still going.

Meanwhile, it seems we have 3/4 battles going on now

1) Contador vs A.Schleck for yellow
2) Menchov vs Samuel Sanchez for 3rd place
3) Vandenbroeck vs Gesink vs Rodriguez vs Leipheimer(?) for 5th..
4) Rest of top 10 spots between the failing Basso/Kreuziger and so on

If Menchov keeps going like this he could still be in the running for 2nd. Or 1st, for that matter, although I don't see that happening.

Oh, and what's up with Van den Broeck? I really didn't think he could do this. Chapeau to him.

 

[jilbiker]

AS looked spent...

i doubt that

I think AS pushed himself way over. He said at the end that he knew this mountain wasn't a fit for him, he looked uncomfortable during the ride but was determined to stay with AC no matter what. In doing so, he flew past red zone. I saw how exhausted he looked at the end. Unless he has some tremendous recovery overnight, I see tomorrow being quite tough for him to repeat. I actually think Menchov and Sanchez saw the weakness and will absolutely attack tomorrow. If he sits on AC like today, he may lose the yellow tomorrow.

AC is waiting, not sure what he plans next. If I were him I would remove focus on AS and pay attention to number 3&4

 

[oronet commander]

2) Menchov vs Samuel Sanchez for 3rd place

We're all giving for sure that AS will win or be second, but if he doesn't take more time, Andy will be within Menchov's range in such a long ITT as this Tour's...

 

[ManInFull]

The big news today is Contador tried one big attack but Andy Schleck managed to cover it with ease.

I think we are seeing a repeat of the Rasmussen/Contador battle. AC will blow himself out trying to attack in the coming days, then Schleck will finish him off with one big counter attack.

And then Saxo Bank will fire AS for not identifying where he was during some training period??

 

[Moose McKnuckles]

Did the wild boar gap Lance on the final climb?

 

[Dekker_Tifosi]

I did see a butterfly passing Armstrong a few kilometers from the finish

 

[Nickbeam]

We're all giving for sure that AS will win or be second, but if he doesn't take more time, Andy will be within Menchov's range in such a long ITT as this Tour's...

if Andy keeps playing silly games, Menchov will destroy him in the TT and take over the 2nd. Denis is on top of his form, it's clear now.

 

[Moose McKnuckles]

Lance is obviously sitting on some excellent form and deciding to save it for a stage win as that will show what a selfless teammate he is.

Or something.

 

[Anonymous]

I did see a butterfly passing Armstrong a few kilometers from the finish

OK, that made me laugh.

 

[Anonymous]

Lance is obviously sitting on some excellent form and deciding to save it for a stage win as that will show what a selfless teammate he is.

Or something.

This one too.


Keep it up you two.

 

[Straßenrennen]

Anyone else think Hesjedal did okay today? Only 2 minutes and 12th on the stage? For an emergancy grand tour contender he didnt doo too badly imo, perhaps Vaughters sold the pumpkin last year and has kept the prince for this year. Would be interested how he does with a real tour build up behind him. This tour is hard as sin and he came just for the ride and perhaps a few breakaways but instead hes climbing O.K. and is 13th overall.. true hes 7minutes down but possibly a top10 in the future? Yes okay hes 29 but next year.. top 10 is possible imo.

 

[ScottyMuser]

Anyone else think Hesjedal did okay today? Only 2 minutes and 12th on the stage? For an emergancy grand tour contender he didnt doo too badly imo, perhaps Vaughters sold the pumpkin last year and has kept the prince for this year. Would be interested how he does with a real tour build up behind him. This tour is hard as sin and he came just for the ride and perhaps a few breakaways but instead hes climbing O.K. and is 13th overall.. true hes 7minutes down but possibly a top10 in the future? Yes okay hes 29 but next year.. top 10 is possible imo.

probably not top 10 next year. Liquigas have been disappointing, with Kreuziger being worse than usual, and Basso exhausted from the Giro - next year they'll probably have Nibali and Kreuziger who both are better top 10 contenders. Cuddles will probably be better next year, Sastre could hardly do worse, and am sure KSy will change their squad and realise that Wiggo isn't the mabn for the tDf. Also, as Farrar has had a broken wrist, it has freed up Ryder to go for the GC, and Garmin to partially support him. T

 

[skidmark]

Anyone else think Hesjedal did okay today? Only 2 minutes and 12th on the stage? For an emergancy grand tour contender he didnt doo too badly imo, perhaps Vaughters sold the pumpkin last year and has kept the prince for this year. Would be interested how he does with a real tour build up behind him. This tour is hard as sin and he came just for the ride and perhaps a few breakaways but instead hes climbing O.K. and is 13th overall.. true hes 7minutes down but possibly a top10 in the future? Yes okay hes 29 but next year.. top 10 is possible imo.

Well he finished ahead of Basso and Kreuziger, who were both ahead of him in the GC, so it seems like he's doing okay. He could end up being the guy that gets the top 10 because he's far enough away to not be a threat to the podium, goes on a break in the mountains that they let go, and then picks up 2-3 minutes. Like Le Mevel last year (although that wasn't a mountain stage I guess), or Kirchen, Astarloza in previous years. There might be a couple of guys that can salvage a top 10 like that.

 

[The Hitch]

Earlier in this thread people were mocking Versus for not considering Samu a contender. So why are people here commiting the same mistake. Menchov this Menchov that.

Sure i understand, Menchov is a proven GT winner and better in tts. But as Armstrong, sastre, evens show, there is no nostalgia in this here game. There is only the here and the now.

Samu finished with Menchov today.
He finished with menchov on the col Jallaber.
He finished ahead of Menchov in the Avoriaz stage.
He finished ahead of Menchov on the Madeline and kept this up on a 30k descent + flat on his own while Menchov was with Gesink.
He was losing to Menchov before the mountains and he is ahead of Menchov now. If anyone is coming good in the mountains it is Sanchez.

 

[theyoungest]

probably not top 10 next year. Liquigas have been disappointing, with Kreuziger being worse than usual, and Basso exhausted from the Giro - next year they'll probably have Nibali and Kreuziger who both are better top 10 contenders. Cuddles will probably be better next year, Sastre could hardly do worse, and am sure KSy will change their squad and realise that Wiggo isn't the mabn for the tDf. Also, as Farrar has had a broken wrist, it has freed up Ryder to go for the GC, and Garmin to partially support him. T

Why worse than usual? Kreuziger isn't very consistent in the high mountains, we've seen that now for three years in a row. He's still young, of course, but he hasn't shown any real improvement in his climbing. Which is a bit worrying, TBH.

Hesjedal is quite a character, BTW. You see him hanging at the back of the group, getting dropped pretty early, and finishing ahead of most people who dropped him earlier. Kind of a lesser Gesink.

 

[killswitch]

Lance is obviously sitting on some excellent form and deciding to save it for a stage win as that will show what a selfless teammate he is.

Or something.

Obviously he'll go alone on a breakaway on the tourmalet stage, Coppi/Merckx/Landis style and finish 45 minutes ahead of everyone, taking teh yellow jersey and winning the all-important team classification.
To quote Sergio Paulinho, who knows about the evil Bruyneel masterplan: "Well done Sky, Astana and Garmin amateurs. The last laugh, laughs best."

 

[The Hitch]

Why worse than usual? Kreuziger isn't very consistent in the high mountains, we've seen that now for three years in a row. He's still young, of course, but he hasn't shown any real improvement in his climbing. Which is a bit worrying, TBH.

Hesjedal is quite a character, BTW. You see him hanging at the back of the group, getting dropped pretty early, and finishing ahead of most people who dropped him earlier. Kind of a lesser Gesink.

I rate wins in the 2 swiss stage races and podiums in these same races in different years + podium in paris nice as signs of someone who could yet come good in the mountains. Though you are right, he isnt very consistant in the mountains atm

 

[bobs nob]

..um, you are familiar with my work...."harsh" would be a term I think could be used frequently in relation to my posts. Its kind of my thing...

Yes, but honesty is also your thing. But I am very forgiving.

On another topic, just got back from some tennis with my son. Has Lance come in yet?

 

[theyoungest]

I rate wins in the 2 swiss stage races and podiums in these same races in different years + podium in paris nice as signs of someone who could yet come good in the mountains. Though you are right, he isnt very consistant in the mountains atm

He's strong, of course, but he's been at this level for years now. He hasn't really made that step up. That's what I mean.

His stage race wins are also the result of peaking for those races when not many other contenders do. But they're legitimate wins, of course.

 

[bobs nob]

Earlier in this thread people were mocking Versus for not considering Samu a contender. So why are people here commiting the same mistake. Menchov this Menchov that.

Sure i understand, Menchov is a proven GT winner and better in tts. But as Armstrong, sastre, evens show, there is no nostalgia in this here game. There is only the here and the now.

Samu finished with Menchov today.
He finished with menchov on the col Jallaber.
He finished ahead of Menchov in the Avoriaz stage.
He finished ahead of Menchov on the Madeline and kept this up on a 30k descent + flat on his own while Menchov was with Gesink.
He was losing to Menchov before the mountains and he is ahead of Menchov now. If anyone is coming good in the mountains it is Sanchez.

I have been watching the time gap from AC to him since the get go. It's versus, Hitch, they are still tracking Armstrong forchrissakes.

 

[nia O'Malley]

Hi all


First I'd like to congratulate Christophe Riblon, who got two mentions in this thread while every other loser on the planet got several dozen pages. He deserved it and it was a great ride.


Second, I fail to see what's wrong with AS's tactics, as it's pretty public knowledge he hasn't the speed for these short sharp climbs, so how is he supposed to gain time on them is a mystery. It would have been the height of stupidity to try and attack today with the major contender in his wheel, who is much better at these sorts of things than he is.
As it is he gained a lot of brownie points for not being shaken off by AC even once.

With Frank out, he hasn't a teammate currently able to really help, and I love the way he rides, not constantly in his hapless slaves' wheels like we've seen in the last decade, but with panache; saying he wants the three jerseys if he can have them, trying to win stages........

The mind-numbing bore that was Armstrong's era (heralded by Indurain's already) maybe made us forget what it is to be able to cheer on a proper contender with heart on top of class.

I prefer Frank but I'll sure take Andy instead as he is. He might not get yellow this year but he's only a chap and has quite a few years in front of him, and I'll keep cheering. It's been too long someone with a bit of charisma, a decent bad temper and no excuses handy when things go wrong has been around to make le tour exciting

Fair play to him and best of luck! It's surely more fun this way than watch Contador lord it over from day 1, with no suspense or opposition.

 

[scribe]

Lance is obviously sitting on some excellent form and deciding to save it for a stage win as that will show what a selfless teammate he is.

Or something.

He is riding to peak at Leadville.

 

[The Hitch]

Hi all


First I'd like to congratulate Christophe Riblon, who got two mentions in this thread while every other loser on the planet got several dozen pages. He deserved it and it was a great ride.


Second, I fail to see what's wrong with AS's tactics, as it's pretty public knowledge he hasn't the speed for these short sharp climbs, so how is he supposed to gain time on them is a mystery. It would have been the height of stupidity to try and attack today with the major contender in his wheel, who is much better at these sorts of things than he is.
As it is he gained a lot of brownie points for not being shaken off by AC even once.

With Frank out, he hasn't a teammate currently able to really help, and I love the way he rides, not constantly in his hapless slaves' wheels like we've seen in the last decade, but with panache; saying he wants the three jerseys if he can have them, trying to win stages........

The mind-numbing bore that was Armstrong's era (heralded by Indurain's already) maybe made us forget what it is to be able to cheer on a proper contender with heart on top of class.

I prefer Frank but I'll sure take Andy instead as he is. He might not get yellow this year but he's only a chap and has quite a few years in front of him, and I'll keep cheering. It's been too long someone with a bit of charisma, a decent bad temper and no excuses handy when things go wrong has been around to make le tour exciting

Fair play to him and best of luck! It's surely more fun this way than watch Contador lord it over from day 1, with no suspense or opposition.

Most people here (those who werent busy still complaining about evens of course) said chapeau to Riblon. His performance was so good there is not much more you can say. You cant critiscise him, or talk up anyone else as he was simply the best. So people say congratulations and start debating more contentious issues, like who was weaker AC or AS, etc because there really is no debate as to who was the most impressive rider of the day.

 

[Moondance]

He's strong, of course, but he's been at this level for years now. He hasn't really made that step up. That's what I mean.

His stage race wins are also the result of peaking for those races when not many other contenders do. But they're legitimate wins, of course.

I think you've got a point. He level of climbing has, if anything, regressed since 2008. He finished approx. 2 minutes down on the top GC men today, when, to take an example from 2008, on Alpe d'Huez he lost only about a minute to the likes of Evans, Schlecks, and Menchov (granted he did lose 3 minutes to Sastre that day).

Maybe he got shook up badly the first week, and because he doesn't complain about it we simply haven't heard about an injury which he may or may not have. Maybe he's a bit sick, or just botched the preparation. He was good in the prologue this year (around 25th i remember), but Kreuziger is prologue specialist, so it might just be an indication of non-peak form going in. He might not be the type of rider who can grow in form during a GT, which in and of itself is not at all a surprise for rider who just turned 24.

I still think he's capable of more than he's shown so far this Tour, and despite moderately 'underperforming' in my eyes he's still in 12th place overall, which is still a great performance for a 24 year old.

It might be an idea for Roman to leave Nibali to focus for the Tour next year, while he targets the Vuelta, and rides for a Top-3 placing there. Should raise his profile and his confidence a little more. This suggestion is, of course, completely motivated by a desire to see him out of the white jersey race with Gesink next year