TDF Stage 15 - Monday, July 19 2010, Pamiers - Bagnères-de-Luchon, 187 km

[Hawkwood]

just posted by andy:



I lost yellow today!**** happens but the race is not over yet!!!I be back!


i picture arnold saying that last line. hope andy will become the terminator.

Wasn't Ulllrich nicknamed the `Tourminator' at one point?

 

[reubenr]

Has anyone asked Schleck how he ended up throwing his chain? Was it a mis-shift?

I think at this point everyone is asking what kind of shifters he had, so they don't make the same mistake!

 

[Maxiton]

i watched all those tours. i have NO memory of la ever being booed on the podium with the mj. am i losing my memory or are you only talking about on the road?

Right. I'm pretty sure LA was never booed on the podium. And no one has ever seen him being spat upon on the road, either. Myth. Now, if LA had pulled some crap like today, then you'd have seen him booed on the podium.

 

[reubenr]

Everybody waited for Schleck on stage 2. On stage 3 most of the peloton was held back because of Fränk Schleck's crash. Then Cancellara turned on his engine with Andy in his wheel and gained back a WHOLE MINUTE. How is that not the same as what just happened now? Andy Schleck is a hypocrite, and I really hope he never wins a single Grand Tour in his career now.

And something similar happened to Contador in the Tour of 2007. No one waited for him as well then... Why should Contador have waited? He shouldn't have, and you guys know it.

Ditto! Plus or minus 10 characters. What a bunch of whimps!

 

[alberto.legstrong]

Right. I'm pretty sure LA was never booed on the podium. And no one has ever seen him being spit upon on the road, either. Myth. Now, if LA had pulled some crap like today, then you'd have seen him booed on the podium.

I am confused, are you saying that the spitting on him was a myth? because if that is what you're saying, then you probably don't want to hear who porpagated that myth.

 

[lilyprotector]

The Chicken. What was his name? Oh yeah, Michael Rasmussen.

don't remember that either! was he booed after revelations that he wasn't where he was supposed to be but before he got kicked out by his team?

 

[Anonymous]

I disagree completely. If Contador is back there because he's inattentive or messing about, that's his own problem. He should always be watching Schleck. If he lost focus, Schleck was correct to attack.

There is no parallel between this and attacking your rival when he has a mechanical. That's just utterly lame.

What if he was talking with his team car? I am guessing it was not inattention as he AND Vino were back there.

 

[Maxiton]

I am confused, are you saying that the spitting on him was a myth? because if that is what you're saying, then you probably don't want to hear who porpagated that myth.

Right I'm saying it's a myth. Or at the very least totally unproven/undocumented it. And yeah, I know who propagated it: Armstrong.

Maybe it's true (would Armstrong lie?), but who cares; on the podium as far as I know/heard, he was always cheered.

 

[lilyprotector]

tweet from kloeden

andreas kloeden just tweeted:

Bad luck for @andy_schleck He had technical problems. Was'nt à nice Move from Alberto on this moment. But this is cycling now :-(


makes me feel old...i remember back in the day when the riders stopped for the maillot jeune...there was one year when the racers could have taken advantage but set tempo instead out of respect for the jersey...

really, grandma? why would anybody do such a thing?

 

[Maxiton]

don't remember that either! was he booed after revelations that he wasn't where he was supposed to be but before he got kicked out by his team?

Yes. The fans couldn't stand the chicken. His doping was too obvious and he just wasn't at all a sympathetic character.

 

[Weapons of @ss Destruction]

Schlecklet has a lot to learn (about shifting).

 

[red_flanders]

So the first week of the Tour does not count towards the final result? I am pretty sure Allex Zulle disagress based on his experiences of 99 and 97

It is amazing how much all of you LA fanboys/AC haters are willing to ignore reality and facts in order to criticize your nemesis.

Bravo Alberto

Why don't you look at my posting record before you call me either an LA fanboy or AC hater. You sound foolish.

 

[lostintime]

I should have asked if the MJ was ever booed for their actions on the road.

 

[red_flanders]

I am so so so happy for Tommy he is such a decent, nice guy I know the peleton will be happy for him also.

It looked to me like even Vino had the class to stop attacking when he saw Andy drop his chain. Alberto capitalized on it and that's poor form in my opinion. And 2 wrongs never make a right.

Alberto had a golden opportunity to prove he is a true champion, the next patron of the peleton, and gain the respect of his peers and fans alike. Instead, he is truly "yellow" tonight and will have to deal with crowds booing him. There is a big stain on his yellow jersey. He would have gained so much respect from everyone, if he would have just sat up and not seem to attack when the MJ was in difficulty.

Agreed, good post. It's less about what he did than what he didn't do.

 

[Escarabajo]

...
But i don't know if it is easy to choose what to do in such a small frame of time especially when fatigued

This is also true.

The other point is that he would have his coach on his ear screaming at him "Venga, venga, vamos, Schleck esta parado, sigue pedaleando, venga venga venga"

Or in english, or whatever language they speak in the Astana radio.

 

[hrotha]

Everybody waited for Schleck on stage 2. On stage 3 most of the peloton was held back because of Fränk Schleck's crash. Then Cancellara turned on his engine with Andy in his wheel and gained back a WHOLE MINUTE. How is that not the same as what just happened now? Andy Schleck is a hypocrite, and I really hope he never wins a single Grand Tour in his career now.

And something similar happened to Contador in the Tour of 2007. No one waited for him as well then... Why should Contador have waited? He shouldn't have, and you guys know it.

First of all, Andy doesn't post here. Whatever arguments against Contador you read, Andy's not posting them. What he said, once he calmed down, was this:

I lost yellow today!**** happens but the race is not over yet!!!I be back!

Secondly, I don't care what happened before this stage. Stage 3 may not have been a good display of sportsmanship (I honestly don't think there was anything wrong with that stage, but just for the sake of the argument), but that doesn't mean what happened in this stage was fine.

I don't like what Contador did. Simple as that.

Your argument is not wholly dissimilar from someone saying "he doped because everyone else did".

 

[El Pistolero]

First of all, Andy doesn't post here. Whatever arguments against Contador you read, Andy's not posting them. What he said, once he calmed down, was this:

Secondly, I don't care what happened before this stage. Stage 3 may not have been a good display of sportsmanship (I honestly don't think there was anything wrong with that stage, but just for the sake of the argument), but that doesn't mean what happened in this stage was fine.

I don't like what Contador did. Simple as that.

Your argument is not wholly dissimilar from someone saying "he doped because everyone else did".

I'm calling Andy Schleck a hypocrite for what he said in an interview.

And there's no difference between the second/third stage and this one. Contador lost time on stage 3 for something that wasn't his fault. Same thing happened to Andy now. Deal with it.

 

[red_flanders]

In the end, Mr. Schleck will be angry with himself for making a poor shift change, but the moment was more revealing in retrospect basically for how the media has reacted. Contador was always wearing the "black hat" because of the media's love affair with Armstrong and the dollars he represents, but once Armstrong bit the dust, it was a fairly rapid transition to bestowing the "white hat" on Mr. Schleck. Today, the "shift" was cemented. That's unfortunate, since the Contador/Schleck dual could have been interesting, in and of itself, as road racers, but now we will have to listen to Liggett and Sherwen destroy the heart of the race with their repulsive reporting and proselytizing on behalf of RS and, now, the "injured" Schleck. Do these men have any shame? The only chain drop for which Sherwen ever stopped was his own.

I agree with you on the "shift" portion. Very accurate and perceptive.

I have to disagree with lumping Phil Liggett into this situation, in this one case. He was quite defensive of Contador's actions and called out Paul for his comments.

 

[alberto.legstrong]

First of all, Andy doesn't post here. Whatever arguments against Contador you read, Andy's not posting them. What he said, once he calmed down, was this:

Secondly, I don't care what happened before this stage. Stage 3 may not have been a good display of sportsmanship (I honestly don't think there was anything wrong with that stage, but just for the sake of the argument), but that doesn't mean what happened in this stage was fine.

I don't like what Contador did. Simple as that.

Your argument is not wholly dissimilar from someone saying "he doped because everyone else did".

That isn't what I am saying and you're right, saying it was t!t for tat is a pretty poor excuse.

What I am saying is if I am in a race with a guy who can't shift properly, what is my obligation to him?

 

[hrotha]

I'm calling Andy Schleck a hypocrite for what he said in an interview.

And there's no difference between the second/third stage and this one. Contador lost time on stage 3 for something that wasn't his fault. Same thing happened to Andy now. Deal with it.

Maybe you're superhuman and can control your emotions after half an hour of chasing in a somewhat tricky descent with your adrenaline pouring out of your ears. As for me, I'll judge him from what he said after some rest.

Cancellara and Andy's actions in stages 2 & 3 have no bearing on Contador's class or lack thereof in this stage.

 

[Mellow Velo]

I guess it is going to be a long night with disgruntled Armstrong fans trying to score points against their Nemesis.

Things were different back in the day?
That's a new one.
The Tour has been around since 1903, not 1999 and such things did happen during the Armstrong era and regularly, back in the days.
The Passage du Gois incident was as cynical a manouvre as ever we have seen.

Both Riis and Andy have sucked it up and spat it out, but I guess on here, things will continued to be amateurish and emotionally charged.

 

[alberto.legstrong]

I agree with you on the "shift" portion. Very accurate and perceptive.

I have to disagree with lumping Phil Liggett into this situation, in this one case. He was quite defensive of Contador's actions and called out Paul for his comments.

Off off topic (and please don't tell kurinsc I posted this in this thread) It seems to me that Phil has gradually grown disgusted with Sherwen as I see/hear it. At the very least, a lot of Paul's comments go on to be contradicted by Phil shortly thereafter.

 

[hrotha]

That isn't what I am saying and you're right, saying it was t!t for tat is a pretty poor excuse.

What I am saying is if I am in a race with a guy who can't shift properly, what is my obligation to him?

Good point. I guess at some level I'm not considering the mechanical could be his fault, because honestly, how smooth their gears are? I had an old bike with gears on the frame and whenever I shifted gears I'd get a mechanical, so I virtually gave up on shifting gears, but I'm not a pro!

Seriously though, someone should ask Andy what happened and see if it's his fault or not.

 

[alberto.legstrong]

I guess it is going to be a long night with disgruntled Armstrong fans trying to score points against their Nemesis.

Things were different back in the day?
That's a new one.
The Tour has been around since 1903, not 1999 and such things did happen during the Armstrong era and regularly, back in the days.
The Passage du Gois incident was as cynical a manouvre as ever we have seen.

Both Riis and Andy have sucked it up and spat it out, but I guess on here, things will continued to be amateurish and emotionally charged.

Riis will always be a villainous character to me. I don't know why, but he has a little Doctor Evil in him. I don't like him. He seems conspiratorial...or something like that....

 

[Dedelou]

I've lost a lot of respect for Contador today. He should have waited. Forget Menchov and Sanchez--this is and always was between Schleck and Contador.

That said, those who are proclaiming that Andy is the strongest rider in the race, that somehow he was burying Contador--you're wrong. That has not yet been revealed. Contador was down a few riders in the group when AS attacked, and was bridging easily and rapidly when the mechanical went down.

I look for a huge battle on the Tourmalet. I don't know who will win. One thing for certain, it's not clear who the strongest is.

What Contador did today was poor, poor form. Forget stage 2 and 3, that was week one stuff. It doesn't matter. You don't attack the yellow jersey on a mountain pass in week 3 when there's a mechanical. His yellow is an embarrassment today.

The Tourmalet will decide the race. The only way for partial redemption for Contador is if he wins on that climb. His victory will still be tainted though.

I don't think it will. Andy lost the time on the down hill after they allowed him to get back without too much effort .. at the speed of riders who are generally dropped by minutes in those last kilometer. I think It was nice of them to keep andy in the race. They could easily have burried him to 4 on GC today. But, as you said, He will have another chance tomorrow, thursday to keep his second place or attempt the impossible and regain first. On saturday it could be an open battle for 2-3-4 like last year.