Team Ineos (Formerly the Sky thread)

[Ripper]

I have sounded ridiculous for quite a while now.

Fixed that for you

 

[Zam_Olyas]

This made me LOL

Orla Chennaoui ‏@SkyOrla 2 May

Asked Cavendish for fav Giro memory: "Getting dropped with Wiggins in 2008. We were in the Grupetto now he wants to win the thing." Classic.

 

[oldcrank]

Fixed that for you

Comedic genius, my friend.

 

[Benotti69]

This made me LOL

Orla Chennaoui ‏@SkyOrla 2 May

Asked Cavendish for fav Giro memory: "Getting dropped with Wiggins in 2008. We were in the Grupetto now he wants to win the thing." Classic.

I think Orla missed the sarcasm from Cavendish.

 

[Zam_Olyas]

I think Orla missed the sarcasm from Cavendish.

Is Cavendish a sky hater now that's what i want to know?

webvan you there?

 

[hiero2]

I think this is a little bit 'poor-form'. By continuing to take this out of context, you're deluding not just yourself, but trying to mislead others.

The actual quote is this:

Some 86 per cent of Tour de France winners since Tommy Simpson’s death have been tarnished or implicated by doping. There is nothing to suggest that Bradley Wiggins achieved yesterday’s historic victory through anything other than talent and hard work. But at this time of glory, why does Team Sky leave itself open to insinuation by employing Leinders?
Here’s the question again: Was this Tour de France clean? Here’s the tragedy: I don’t know if the public’s answers would have changed since 2006.

You can see when it's in context that it has a different flavour about it and if you don't agree with that, then I pity you.

I can also make a quote out of context if you'd like:

'Team Sky leaves itself open to insinuation by employing Leinders'.

Pity me all you like - but I have to agree that both sentences can stand on their own - they don't need to be together, and putting them together doesn't particularly change the meaning of either one. Particularly when you note that Kimmage, being someone who makes his living with words, still says "there is nothing . . ." IN SPITE of his closing sentence about Leinders!

You can read meanings in between the lines all you want - but you'd have to go back to the horse's mouth to get something more solid.

 

[Dear Wiggo]

Pity me all you like - but I have to agree that both sentences can stand on their own - they don't need to be together, and putting them together doesn't particularly change the meaning of either one. Particularly when you note that Kimmage, being someone who makes his living with words, still says "there is nothing . . ." IN SPITE of his closing sentence about Leinders!

You can read meanings in between the lines all you want - but you'd have to go back to the horse's mouth to get something more solid.

Disagree. English is far more subtle than that.

"I don't mean to insult you, but - "

You know what's coming right? Yes. An insult.

"There's nothing to make me think Wiggins did this with 'assistance'. But - "

At least, that's my take on it.

 

[hiero2]

Let's keep the conversation civil. You all seem to have it fairly well in hand, but trim the personal insults.

 

[martinvickers]

Disagree. English is far more subtle than that.

"I don't mean to insult you, but - "

You know what's coming right? Yes. An insult.

"There's nothing to make me think Wiggins did this with 'assistance'. But - "

At least, that's my take on it.

I think you may be miss the subtlety there yourself.

"i don't mean to, but" - I am not doing this intending to insult you, but ...you may consider it insulting. Being insulting, and intending insult are twp rather different and separate things, so it's not a contradiction

"There is nothing to suggest" is more a statement of fact than of intention. He didn't say "While I've seen nothing to suggest" or "nothing I've seen suggests" - which would, or in the latter case, might imply stuff may be going on outside of his eyesight. He said "THERE IS NOTHING" to suggest. i.e. that the absence of evidence is basically a verifiable fact.

The tenor of that paragraph, thus, is far more about annoyance at Sky Policy laxness than genuine doubt about Wiggins individually.

I would certainly agree that his views and statements on Wiggins have hardened very considerably since - whether that is because they have actually hardened, or because the original editor forced him to soften his original views for publication, you'd have to ask him.

 

[goggalor]

This made me LOL

Orla Chennaoui ‏@SkyOrla 2 May

Asked Cavendish for fav Giro memory: "Getting dropped with Wiggins in 2008. We were in the Grupetto now he wants to win the thing." Classic.

He's shed a ton of upper body muscle since then.

 

[hiero2]

Disagree. English is far more subtle than that.

"I don't mean to insult you, but - "

You know what's coming right? Yes. An insult.

"There's nothing to make me think Wiggins did this with 'assistance'. But - "

At least, that's my take on it.

Well enough said - especially that this is your take on it. And, that is your prerogative, you won't get any argument from me about that. And wasn't it you who said you hates it when people take things "out of context"? But not everyone agrees that this is even out of context. You can't take a quote without leaving something out.

We can 2nd guess subrosa meanings all day - and still not know. Somebody needs to interview the interviewer (meaning Kimmage, himself). Or, better yet, we need to get rid of McQuaid and the UCI's machinations, so we can have some faith that somebody is doing something to keep things honest.

A drowning man will clutch at straw
The trodden upon worm still turns in rage
The blind will read between the lines
With not a single word upon the page

Lee Knight
Harmony Central forum

 

[northstar]

This made me LOL

Orla Chennaoui ‏@SkyOrla 2 May

Asked Cavendish for fav Giro memory: "Getting dropped with Wiggins in 2008. We were in the Grupetto now he wants to win the thing." Classic.

Followed up with:

charlie orr @charliejorr
@SkyOrla And it’s all been done with Marginal Gains #flyingpig

Orla Chennaoui @SkyOrla
@charliejorr Unless you have evidence to the contrary, I’m afraid that’s libellous #justsaying

Sky reporter Orla seems to be super sensitive or maybe she doesn't like pigs.

 

[red_flanders]

He's shed a ton of upper body muscle since then.

What evidence is there of that? Lost so much weight as to,go from the grupetto to winning it. Did he lose 40lbs?

 

[Dear Wiggo]

What evidence is there of that? Lost so much weight as to,go from the grupetto to winning it. Did he lose 40lbs?

28lbs lost
2M GB pounds gained
???
profit!!

 

[Zam_Olyas]

Followed up with:

charlie orr @charliejorr
@SkyOrla And it’s all been done with Marginal Gains #flyingpig

Orla Chennaoui @SkyOrla
@charliejorr Unless you have evidence to the contrary, I’m afraid that’s libellous #justsaying

Sky reporter Orla seems to be super sensitive or maybe she doesn't like pigs.

I think she likes pink floyd .. on a serious note i think she is a sky fangirl.

 

[Benotti69]

What evidence is there of that? Lost so much weight as to,go from the grupetto to winning it. Did he lose 40lbs?

His Ego gained a ton

 

[SundayRider]

He's shed a ton of upper body muscle since then.

He's been a full time cyclist since he was a kid, where would said upper body muscle have come from in the fist place

 

[Ferminal]

Beer gut...

 

[SundayRider]

He does look a bit skinner than years ago but not 12Kg less as claimed. Thats 15% of total bodyweight

 

[BYOP88]

I think she likes pink floyd .. on a serious note i think she is a sky fangirl.

Well she does get her paycheck from Sky. But yes she is an uber Sky fangirl.

 

[Zam_Olyas]

Wasn't it Ulle who once said "For me Doping is, if someone is caught positive"? I think lotsa people will love the quote.

 

[BroDeal]

He's shed a ton of upper body muscle since then.

Yeah, WIgans was a real he-man before.

The most you can say is he went from the 97 pound weakling look to the 96.5 pound weakling look.

 

[taiwan]

There is nothing to suggest that Bradley Wiggins achieved yesterday’s historic victory through anything other than talent and hard work. But

...is the relevant quote. If you thought this means the same as "There is nothing to suggest that Bradley Wiggins achieved yesterday’s historic victory through anything other than talent and hard work.", you would fail English GCSE.

@martinvickers it's clearly not a statement of full confidence in Wiggins. It's written with careful ambiguity. It's not even as positive as "they're clean but they've made themselves look dodgy" as you say, because he entreats the reader to draw their own conclusions about the hiring of Leinders and the credibility of the race. For the total casual fan, it introduces doubt. Let's not kid ourselves, if this was a pro Wiggins article it would be about how Kerrison has taught him to eat and drink during a bike race and he gained 50W.

 

[Ripper]

...is the relevant quote. If you thought this means the same as "There is nothing to suggest that Bradley Wiggins achieved yesterday’s historic victory through anything other than talent and hard work.", you would fail English GCSE.

@martinvickers it's clearly not a statement of full confidence in Wiggins. It's written with careful ambiguity. It's not even as positive as "they're clean but they've made themselves look dodgy" as you say, because he entreats the reader to draw their own conclusions about the hiring of Leinders and the credibility of the race. For the total casual fan, it introduces doubt. Let's not kid ourselves, if this was a pro Wiggins article it would be about how Kerrison has taught him to eat and drink during a bike race and he gained 50W.

And Bam.

Amazing how increasing the visual field by one word changes everything.

And a good ending point. We all know how positive spin works (see most of the direct Sky PR, or most Sky fanboys posts go )

 

[Bexon30]

I think Orla missed the sarcasm from Cavendish.

I don't watch Sky could anyone post a link to Cavs comment please.