Team Ineos (Formerly the Sky thread)

[del1962]

yet you made conclusions on the stuff you did quote, even though by taking away other stuff you totally changed the meaning



your comment here is confusing you are saying the interview is after Landis -2011, yet also saying it's 2009. The interview date on your link is 2011. He is talking in 2011 not 2009 so why are you also claiming he said in 2009 that lance had charisma (btw even Walsh said this). The photoshoot took place in 2009 but he is talking on 2011. You can't possibly equate his Minot priase of lance here with what Wiggins did because unlike Wiggins he is calling lance out as a doper.



ugh Wiggins himself said he knew lance was a doper since 2008. Vaughters confirms at Garmin he told Wiggins did. So all the praise anx hero worship wiggins gave to lance was while knowing lance was a doper and a liar. Whatsmore he knew Landis was telling the truth when he decided to cast doubt on what Landis said. And you either have no concept of morality or simply have your head stuck as far up wiggos *** as wigo did up Armstrong's if you can't notice that this is fiendish and disgusting behaviour on the part of Wiggins that cannot possibly be justified.

Pinnoti on the other hand when he found out lance was a doper said it. There's no similarity whatsoever.

Actually if you read the article the implication is he suspected Lance was a doper in 2005.

When I rode the Tour in 1999 he was a source of inspiration. I was like a lot of other people. Looking back now….when he gave up the first time and L’Equipe published the article about his 1999 urine samples, it was a bit of a kick in the stomach.

But after this Pinotti is quite happy to set up photo opputunities with Lance and seems to like him in 2009 and even though he know in 2011 that Lance is a doper, his attitude to Lance is a lot softer than his attitude towards De Luca from my reading of the article.

 

[JimmyFingers]

Hi Jimmy,
Sky doping or not doping has nothing to do with the dishonesty portrayed by certain Sky fans.
You're welcome.

Or Sky's accusers too. Too often I have been accused opf PR or spin at the same time as my views and statements are twisted and misrepresented to suit someone else's agenda. He who is without sin cast the first stone as they say, and his statement was not qualified by 'certain' sky fans, and that is an ambiguous qualification anymore.

 

[thehog]

I miss the old Jimmy. The one who was sickened by Geert injecting Rabo riders.

Now he's just parody.

 

[Dr. Maserati]

Or Sky's accusers too. Too often I have been accused opf PR or spin at the same time as my views and statements are twisted and misrepresented to suit someone else's agenda. He who is without sin cast the first stone as they say, and his statement was not qualified by 'certain' sky fans, and that is an ambiguous qualification anymore.

Hi Jimmy,
I did not mention you, so you can save your 'woe me post' for someone who cares.

I put in the qualifier, and purposely so, because I would not like to accuse all Sky fans of dishonesty.

 

[the sceptic]

This is an unconstitutional witch hunt against Jimmy.

 

[del1962]

This is an unconstitutional witch hunt against Jimmy.

No Jimmy just fingered himself

 

[JimmyFingers]

Hi Jimmy,
I did not mention you, so you can save your 'woe me post' for someone who cares.

I put in the qualifier, and purposely so, because I would not like to accuse all Sky fans of dishonesty.

Strange that you care so little yet post so much. In future if you don't wish for a reply from me then don't respond to something I was saying to someone else entirely, then compound that by being obnoxious when I was nothing of the kind to you.

Perhaps it will save us both time in the future if we avoid conversations where we have no interest in the response of the other.

 

[ebandit]

know?

He's saying what everyone is thinking.

/QUOTE]

he thinks.............but does not know?

what exactly his he thinking because these tweets appear to be rather vague

we continue to need to know the truth

Mark L

 

[DirtyWorks]

I'm personally bored hearing about how the average race speed has (apparently) dropped so doping is finished, but I have never seen one team spend so much time riding on the front. I think Kiryenka rode 30% of the Tour of Basque on the front, and in last years tour it seemed Eisel was driving the peloton along at 45km/h for hour after hour in pole position.

Don't forget the London Olympics performance in the road race. Their dragging the peloton along until the run-in to the finish was unbelievable. It just crushed any notion that there were clean-ish athletes dragging the peloton around.

 

[DirtyWorks]

My problem is not that (I have hope that Pinotti is clean), but what he hasn't said about Santambrogio/Ballan/Rihs/Ochowicz/Lelangue/Aldag/Holm/Zabel etc etc.

And there is far more against those names than there is against Sky.

+1.

20 characters.

 

[Bexon30]

Something I would really like to see is a statistical analysis of how long both Team Sky, and each of their individual riders spends on the front of the bunch during stages races.

I'm personally bored hearing about how the average race speed has (apparently) dropped so doping is finished, but I have never seen one team spend so much time riding on the front. I think Kiryenka rode 30% of the Tour of Basque on the front, and in last years tour it seemed Eisel was driving the peloton along at 45km/h for hour after hour in pole position.

Estimating power outputs vs durations for these Team Sky monster sessions on the front could be very revealing.

A great point. My memory is not the best so forgive me. Which stage recently saw Vasil pull back an 8~ man breakaway by riding on the front of the peleton for 2 hours? That for me was way too crazy. Just Sky always being on front pulling monster turns is a step back. I really think the Giro/Tour will see a different level of domination but that's just opinion.
So yea anyone with any data on length of individuals pulling and numbers their pulling would be of great interest to me also.

 

[thehog]

I don't like Pro cyclists speaking out.

It's better when they hold the omertà.

Wasn't Wiggins accusing Contador and Shleck in ProCycking magazine re: 2009?

 

[thehog]

A great point. My memory is not the best so forgive me. Which stage recently saw Vasil pull back an 8~ man breakaway by riding on the front of the peleton for 2 hours? That for me was way too crazy. Just Sky always being on front pulling monster turns is a step back. I really think the Giro/Tour will see a different level of domination but that's just opinion.

So yea anyone with any data on length of individuals pulling and numbers their pulling would be of great interest to me also.

I believe you're looking for this:

 

[ebandit]

?

I don't like Pro cyclists speaking out.

It's better when they hold the omertà.

Wasn't Wiggins accusing Contador and Shleck in ProCycking magazine re: 2009?

and you think wiggo was unfair? alberto .............popped

frank............popped..............andy ...........implicated!

i would like to see pro cyclists including wiggo speaking up more

Mark L

 

[maltiv]

A great point. My memory is not the best so forgive me. Which stage recently saw Vasil pull back an 8~ man breakaway by riding on the front of the peleton for 2 hours? That for me was way too crazy. Just Sky always being on front pulling monster turns is a step back. I really think the Giro/Tour will see a different level of domination but that's just opinion.
So yea anyone with any data on length of individuals pulling and numbers their pulling would be of great interest to me also.

Kiri did similar things at Movistar, though. His stage win in the 2011 Giro was insane, he was in a breakaway all day yet he rode up the last two mountains faster than the peloton. That was certainly better than anything he's done on Sky yet.

If Kiri is doping, then he's always been doping and Sky's doping doesn't seem to be particularly better than what he used to take...

 

[LaFlorecita]

I don't like Pro cyclists speaking out.

It's better when they hold the omertà.

Wasn't Wiggins accusing Contador and Shleck in ProCycking magazine re: 2009?

yes it's a bit ridiculous. was it when he said "who knows I might be the winner of tdf 2009" or something like that?

 

[mattghg]

Kiri did similar things at Movistar, though. His stage win in the 2011 Giro was insane, he was in a breakaway all day yet he rode up the last two mountains faster than the peloton. That was certainly better than anything he's done on Sky yet.

If Kiri is doping, then he's always been doping and Sky's doping doesn't seem to be particularly better than what he used to take...

Good point.

 

[The Hitch]

and you think wiggo was unfair? alberto .............popped

frank............popped..............andy ...........implicated!

i would like to see pro cyclists including wiggo speaking up more

Mark L

What have you got against Andy schleck?

 

[thehog]

Kiri did similar things at Movistar, though. His stage win in the 2011 Giro was insane, he was in a breakaway all day yet he rode up the last two mountains faster than the peloton. That was certainly better than anything he's done on Sky yet.

If Kiri is doping, then he's always been doping and Sky's doping doesn't seem to be particularly better than what he used to take...

Track rider turned beast! No wonder he's strong. Probably win Tour one day.

He rode for Tinkoff and Casse so most certainly clean

Two Giro wins in 7 years as a Pro.

Surprised no one saw this talent before.

 

[the sceptic]

and you think wiggo was unfair? alberto .............popped

frank............popped..............andy ...........implicated!

i would like to see pro cyclists including wiggo speaking up more

Mark L

Agreed, I think Wiggo should start speaking up more, like he used to.

He was very outspoken against teams that hire dodgy personel or riders. Or when someone destroys everyone in the ITT, Wiggo knew that was too good to be true, and he spoke his mind. I wonder what happened to that old Wiggins.

 

[mattghg]

What have you got against Andy schleck?

I agree. Are you (ebandit) saying that Andy is implicated simply because he's Frank's brother, or was there something particular about the Schleck zipamide case that implicated Andy somehow?

 

[Dr. Maserati]

Strange that you care so little yet post so much. In future if you don't wish for a reply from me then don't respond to something I was saying to someone else entirely, then compound that by being obnoxious when I was nothing of the kind to you.

Perhaps it will save us both time in the future if we avoid conversations where we have no interest in the response of the other.

Ok, I do apologize if you took my post as obnoxious.

However, you jumped in on a post that did not mention you and introduced yourself in to it. You are not the Sky representative here. No need to take something that was not about you personally.
I don't know you, and quite frankly dont need to, so in that context I don't really care about you, I do like and appreciate your input even if at different times I agree of disagree.

 

[armchairclimber]

Ok, I do apologize if you took my post as obnoxious.

However, you jumped in on a post that did not mention you and introduced yourself in to it. You are not the Sky representative here. No need to take something that was not about you personally.
I don't know you, and quite frankly dont need to, so in that context I don't really care about you, I do like and appreciate your input even if at different times I agree of disagree.

Aw, that's nice. Really. Not enough of that around these parts. I know it's OT, but I like you both (as forum contributors).
Anyway, back to Kiri...quietly awesome to obviously awesome? Or ridiculous improvement?

 

[ebandit]

talk

What have you got against Andy schleck?

just talk.....................but i don't think he has always been clean

writing 'andy.........implicated' was me agreeing that wiggo was making valid
accusations

Mark L

 

[the sceptic]

just talk.....................but i don't think he has always been clean

writing 'andy.........implicated' was me agreeing that wiggo was making valid
accusations

Mark L

Wiggins 2009 tour must be one of the best sporting performances of all time. (after his 2012 tour) If you remove all the dopers from that tour Wiggins wins by 10 minutes or something.

The..power..of..marginal..gains..was...not...even...invented...in...2009...