Wait, so Rogers and Gutierrez were cleans in Madrid? Both of them weren't "half the rider they used to be" in later years? Well, until Rogers discovered marginal gains that is
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hrotha said:Hahahaha. Oh god.
The Hitch said:Funny how the "half the rider" argument only applies if you start as a gt contender and end up being ****.
If you start **** and end up being a million times better than Ruben Plaza was in his wildest dreams, that's not suspicious at all. In fact its actually proof of a new era.
And Cancellara. Let us not forget Cancellara.Gung Ho Gun said:Wait, so Rogers and Gutierrez were cleans in Madrid? Both of them weren't "half the rider they used to be" in later years? Well, until Rogers discovered marginal gains that is
Dear Wiggo said:I bet Lance never said, " I just kinda stumbled into Fourth at the Tour de France."
wrinklyvet said:Lance never had that wry self-deprecating sense of humour. There's clear daylight between them in that respect!
Benotti69 said:Wiggins self deprecating humour is that where he asked someone for Oral Sex on live tv?
Wiggins is a a grade A C***
Dear Wiggo said:But not the doping. Peas in a pod in that respect!
wrinklyvet said:If anyone ever proves that I'll eat my hat. I have lots of hats and will choose one of them.
wrinklyvet said:If anyone ever proves that I'll eat my hat. I have lots of hats and will choose one of them.
How convenient that you can just keep moving the goalposts to ensure that never happens.wrinklyvet said:If anyone ever proves that I'll eat my hat. I have lots of hats and will choose one of them.
The Hitch said:How convenient that you can just keep moving the goalposts to ensure that never happens.
Only because Cound doesn't want him to ride GT's anymore.the sceptic said:But Wiggins went both ways, as he is now half the rider of what he was when he won the tour
the sceptic said:After the details became known, it's obvious Leinders was a very experienced doping doctor with UCI connections to avoid positives.
This is what sky fans desperately are trying to avoid thinking about.
And yes, there is no reasonable explanation as to how he ended up at sky. Well except for the one obvious reason.
agreed.thehog said:Correct. Leinders was successful because there were no positives.
Did a Rabo rider ever test positive in his time there? I don't think they did. No one wonder Sky needed him.
"There, on that day, is the first time the EPO word is mentioned, it is May 1996. Team doctor Geert Leinders then called everyone one by one with him in the room and explained what was EPO, which was hematocrit. What were the dangers, the disadvantages and advantages. What you do not, and what you should do. And from whom he knew it was used by other teams. According to Leinders EPO was no dope, because "it was not positive."
http://www.nrc.nl/nieuws/2013/01/21...als-zovele-over-gebruik-doping-bij-raboploeg/A former cyclist says he consulted with Leinders to inject the Tour 1996 microdosis of EPO. Against possible blood clot he gave him the blood thinner Asaflow
"I've been through the nineties, when there was a problem in the peloton with a product that was not detectable. I have not caused that eh. But I was there. So it is part of my past. "
sniper said:agreed.
There are some lovely testimonies out there.
Leinders was a frontrunner, already microdosing his riders in 1996.
http://www.nrc.nl/nieuws/2013/01/21...als-zovele-over-gebruik-doping-bij-raboploeg/
correctemundo.the sceptic said:Leinders sounds like he knew what he was doing. A low profile version of Ferrari.
lol, but yes, that's probably more or less how it went down. The Zorzoli-Lienders-Sky link is compelling.In 2011 Leinders said to Brailsford "AICAR is not dope, Zorzoli will make sure there are no positives"
sniper said:agreed.
There are some lovely testimonies out there.
Leinders was a frontrunner, already microdosing his riders in 1996.
http://www.nrc.nl/nieuws/2013/01/21...als-zovele-over-gebruik-doping-bij-raboploeg/
and really unfortunate that Leinders lied to Dr. Peters in that job interview.
Luckily Leinders didn't lie to the newspaper:
MartinGT said:
thehog said:Indeed.
Article here that the Sky bus doesn't even have a mobile kitchen like the other teams: http://rouleur.cc/journal/performance/kitchen-confidential-no-pie-team-sky
Margarine gains.