Tennis

[sniper]

I'm not arguing that Djokovic threw the game, but tennis is one of the easiest sports to throw. You can play full on 99% of the points and a couple of unforced errors throw it for you.
I mean so many games end up with a forfeit etc, for no apparent reason, call the trainer for a few massages to your leg or knee and you're done.

I'm not up for looking up loads of sources right now, but I've read many articles about match-fixing and gambling being a problem in Tennis, both at the top level and at lower levels ( with only lower level players getting caught of course ).

I'm not arguing against this. And it's an interesting issue also.

Just saying that this particular final wasn't fixed, imo. (and you seem to agree)
Or if it was, lifetime Oscars to both players.

 

[blackcat]

but nobody threw nothing here, imo.

but double negative for ambiguity sake

 

[wansteadimp]

Because Murray may not be British anymore next year Scotland is having a referendum. ( I could almost believe this to be honest )

Ridiculous theory, next year's Wimbledon is before the referendum - no need to panic and fix this year's when there was next year's if needs be.

 

[lemoogle]

Ridiculous theory, next year's Wimbledon is before the referendum - no need to panic and fix this year's when there was next year's if needs be.

Haha, yeah I didn't bother to check when the referendum will be.
It would definitely be interesting if it passes what happens for this great love for Murray in the rest of the UK.

 

[walker]

Why would Novak give the match - to Murray?

It wouldn't be a match fix aka cricket. The first 2 sets were a true competition and the rallies reflected that, Djokovic having an argument with the umpire proved how intent he was to win. The 3rd set was laughable....a friend also commented 'when have you ever seen Djokovic make SO MANY UNFORCED ERRORS'.

When have you ever seen a top 5 player have a 'tired match' - doesn't happen these days and we know why. So for Djoko to 'spray balls' around like he did was a red flag to anyone. Beginning of that 3rd set he couldn't hit a ball in court - I recall a passing shot from Murray when Djoko was at the net and Djoko was so close to the ball he could have caught it in his hand.

No idea why Djoko didn't comeback from 2 sets down...but he threw that 3rd set.

And the argument as to why wouldn't Murray have been gifted the Wimbledon title in last years final against Federer....well Federer's career is on the way down and he hadn't had a win never mind a Grand Slam title for some time.

I completely agree with Cycle Chic and am glad that someone who knows about tennis sees it as I see it, as my friends dismiss my opinion on the basis that I don’t know enough about tennis. Novak played worse than about 10 years ago: hitting the net while serving, throwing balls out of the pitch as if it was getting him points... He looked out of place and the crowd wasn’t even bad towards him as he could have expected. He used to play against the spectators as much as against his opponents wherever he plays.

For those who ask why he would throw the match, there are many reasons, not money for himself, though. He is above that. One of the reasons, and probably the most important one, is his friendship with Murray and knowing how much winning this tournament means to him. One Serbian comment on facebook was ‘and from the best man, Wimbledon!’ That is how in Serbia traditionally, at weddings, a gift by the best man is announced. It was a rumour that Andy will be Novak’s best man at his wedding. I don’t think this is literarily a wedding gift but a gift it is, which would be in line with Novak’s character.

Second possible reason is a political deal. Novak is known to be a great patriot and would do much more for his country. As many people know, Serbia has constantly been under enormous pressure by big powers like UK & USA for over 20 years and there are endless list of things and deals they could do with, whilst the Brits get a nice boost.

Some Serbs who refuse to believe it was a fixed match, keep saying that he’s still a champion. Yes he is, if his position was not as strong as it was, he would not have given it. This was the best time for all and the most suitable player who could afford to give a Brit the Wimbledon title.

Even if it wasn’t fixed, it is shocking how the media describes this ‘well deserved victory’ and ‘fantastic match’!! This was one of the worse matches ever seen at any tournament (not to mention the biggest of all), not a match between 1st and 2nd player. Won thanks to unforced errors by the champion.

Another small, but not insignificant point, when has anyone seen Novak getting off a court with his head so down?! He is normally great and proud in defeat as in winning. This was not Novak as we’ve known him. He's been defeated by Murray a number of times and there's nothing surprising about that, just the way he (didn't) play this time was too obvious and suspicious.

 

[Briant_Gumble]

I completely agree with Cycle Chic and am glad that someone who knows about tennis sees it as I see it, as my friends dismiss my opinion on the basis that I don’t know enough about tennis. Novak played worse than about 10 years ago: hitting the net while serving, throwing balls out of the pitch as if it was getting him points... He looked out of place and the crowd wasn’t even bad towards him as he could have expected. He used to play against the spectators as much as against his opponents wherever he plays.

For those who ask why he would throw the match, there are many reasons, not money for himself, though. He is above that. One of the reasons, and probably the most important one, is his friendship with Murray and knowing how much winning this tournament means to him. One Serbian comment on facebook was ‘and from the best man, Wimbledon!’ That is how in Serbia traditionally, at weddings, a gift by the best man is announced. It was a rumour that Andy will be Novak’s best man at his wedding. I don’t think this is literarily a wedding gift but a gift it is, which would be in line with Novak’s character.

Second possible reason is a political deal. Novak is known to be a great patriot and would do much more for his country. As many people know, Serbia has constantly been under enormous pressure by big powers like UK & USA for over 20 years and there are endless list of things and deals they could do with, whilst the Brits get a nice boost.

Some Serbs who refuse to believe it was a fixed match, keep saying that he’s still a champion. Yes he is, if his position was not as strong as it was, he would not have given it. This was the best time for all and the most suitable player who could afford to give a Brit the Wimbledon title.

Even if it wasn’t fixed, it is shocking how the media describes this ‘well deserved victory’ and ‘fantastic match’!! This was one of the worse matches ever seen at any tournament (not to mention the biggest of all), not a match between 1st and 2nd player. Won thanks to unforced errors by the champion.

Another small, but not insignificant point, when has anyone seen Novak getting off a court with his head so down?! He is normally great and proud in defeat as in winning. This was not Novak as we’ve known him. He's been defeated by Murray a number of times and there's nothing surprising about that, just the way he (didn't) play this time was too obvious and suspicious.

Just looked to me like a guy who had played one of the longest matches in history and certainly one of the longest matches played at a high level only two days earlier.

 

[faraday]

I completely agree with Cycle Chic and am glad that someone who knows about tennis sees it as I see it, as my friends dismiss my opinion on the basis that I don’t know enough about tennis. Novak played worse than about 10 years ago: hitting the net while serving, throwing balls out of the pitch as if it was getting him points... He looked out of place and the crowd wasn’t even bad towards him as he could have expected. He used to play against the spectators as much as against his opponents wherever he plays.

Hi Cycle Chic!

 

[lemoogle]

Novak Djokovic Foundation

I think we've all got our answer here

 

[Cycle Chic]

I completely agree with Cycle Chic and am glad that someone who knows about tennis sees it as I see it, as my friends dismiss my opinion on the basis that I don’t know enough about tennis. Novak played worse than about 10 years ago: hitting the net while serving, throwing balls out of the pitch as if it was getting him points... He looked out of place and the crowd wasn’t even bad towards him as he could have expected. He used to play against the spectators as much as against his opponents wherever he plays.

For those who ask why he would throw the match, there are many reasons, not money for himself, though. He is above that. One of the reasons, and probably the most important one, is his friendship with Murray and knowing how much winning this tournament means to him. One Serbian comment on facebook was ‘and from the best man, Wimbledon!’ That is how in Serbia traditionally, at weddings, a gift by the best man is announced. It was a rumour that Andy will be Novak’s best man at his wedding. I don’t think this is literarily a wedding gift but a gift it is, which would be in line with Novak’s character.

Second possible reason is a political deal. Novak is known to be a great patriot and would do much more for his country. As many people know, Serbia has constantly been under enormous pressure by big powers like UK & USA for over 20 years and there are endless list of things and deals they could do with, whilst the Brits get a nice boost.

Some Serbs who refuse to believe it was a fixed match, keep saying that he’s still a champion. Yes he is, if his position was not as strong as it was, he would not have given it. This was the best time for all and the most suitable player who could afford to give a Brit the Wimbledon title.

Even if it wasn’t fixed, it is shocking how the media describes this ‘well deserved victory’ and ‘fantastic match’!! This was one of the worse matches ever seen at any tournament (not to mention the biggest of all), not a match between 1st and 2nd player. Won thanks to unforced errors by the champion.

Another small, but not insignificant point, when has anyone seen Novak getting off a court with his head so down?! He is normally great and proud in defeat as in winning. This was not Novak as we’ve known him. He's been defeated by Murray a number of times and there's nothing surprising about that, just the way he (didn't) play this time was too obvious and suspicious.

At last - someone else who knows a bit about tennis and watches the ATP Tour all year. Some great points made.

 

[sugarman]

For those who ask why he would throw the match, there are many reasons, not money for himself, though. He is above that. One of the reasons, and probably the most important one, is his friendship with Murray and knowing how much winning this tournament means to him. One Serbian comment on facebook was ‘and from the best man, Wimbledon!’ That is how in Serbia traditionally, at weddings, a gift by the best man is announced. It was a rumour that Andy will be Novak’s best man at his wedding. I don’t think this is literarily a wedding gift but a gift it is, which would be in line with Novak’s character.

So as a gesture from the great man that Novak is, he decides to throw the final and gift his friend with a hollow victory at what would be Murray's most important tournament? That would be insulting more than anything to Murray...

 

[sniper]

there might be shiploads of matchfixing in tennis, but nobody saw djoker throw anything in that final other than his own racket.

there is a lot of good info and interesting links in this thread for people who want to read up on doping in tennis. let's not muddy the waters with a completely unfounded matchfixing theory.

 

[Cycle Chic]

So as a gesture from the great man that Novak is, he decides to throw the final and gift his friend with a hollow victory at what would be Murray's most important tournament? That would be insulting more than anything to Murray...

A WIN IS A WIN....look at Marion Bartoli....you think she felt bad cause she didn't beat anyone to get to the final. Murray wouldn't have cared if Djoko had thrown the first 2 sets.....who remembers how you get the win...you remember who won.

 

[sugarman]

It wouldn't be a match fix aka cricket. The first 2 sets were a true competition and the rallies reflected that, Djokovic having an argument with the umpire proved how intent he was to win. The 3rd set was laughable....a friend also commented 'when have you ever seen Djokovic make SO MANY UNFORCED ERRORS'.


No idea why Djoko didn't comeback from 2 sets down...but he threw that 3rd set.

So your just saying he didn't try in the third set???

Thats not a 'fixed-match' - not trying because your a long way down, tired, bored, eager to get to the winner's ball, whatever is COMPLETELY different to actively trying to lose the entire match.

 

[Cycle Chic]

So your just saying he didn't try in the third set???

Thats not a 'fixed-match' - not trying because your a long way down, tired, bored, eager to get to the winner's ball, whatever is COMPLETELY different to actively trying to lose the entire match.

Try reading a few pages of the thread not just come in and answer 1 post. You,re new here...that's how it works.

 

[sugarman]

Try reading a few pages of the thread not just come in and answer 1 post. You,re new here...that's how it works.

Yep it was a genuine question cause im confused what your saying and what your point is...

Well if that wasn't a match fix I don't know what is. Djokovic beaten in 3 straight sets ! how much more ridiculous can today get....

Did you watch the 3rd set ? Djokovic spraying balls ? did you see the stats for this match ? unforced errors for Djokovic were off the richter....when he lost the first 2 sets he threw it. Djokovic tired from the Potro match ??

The first 2 sets were the real deal. Set 1 went on forever, rallies were amazing and hard fought. The 2nd set was the same....but when he'd lost those 2 sets he threw it....and came out smelling of roses.

The stats were posted also that fairly glaringly contradict what your saying...

I didn't watch the 3rd set...

I pick up a few inconsistencies, so, not that it matters much, but are you saying the whole match was 'fixed' or he just gave up in the last set?

For the record, im sure ive been visting the clinic at least as long as you, perhaps longer, the reason i dont contribute much is cause you tend to just end up with rubbish like this...

Says Mr Junior poster who has 8 posts....go read some threads me laddie and wisen up before you join in the discussions.

I think theres plenty of suspicion around Djokovic, but Sunday's final didn't add anything to it for me

 

[Wallace and Gromit]

I wonder if Cycle Chic is just too shocked to accept a British man winning at Wimbledon. It's not so far fetched when one considers that Murray himself was reluctant to go to sleep in case he woke up to find it was all a dream.

I still can't work out whether she's a professional wind-up merchant, temporarily overcome by the heat or just plain bonkers.

I'm still waiting - though not with any great expectation - of her explanation of Djokovic's motivation to throw the match.

 

[Cycle Chic]

I wonder if Cycle Chic is just too shocked to accept a British man winning at Wimbledon. It's not so far fetched when one considers that Murray himself was reluctant to go to sleep in case he woke up to find it was all a dream.

I still can't work out whether she's a professional wind-up merchant, temporarily overcome by the heat or just plain bonkers.

I'm still waiting - though not with any great expectation - of her explanation of Djokovic's motivation to throw the match.

durrrrrrrrrrr Murray is number 2 in the world and US Open winner.....of course he's capable of winning Wimbledon...pity Djoko was the only hurdle. And stop insulting me with your inept comments.

 

[Wallace and Gromit]

durrrrrrrrrrr Murray is number 2 in the world and US Open winner.....of course he's capable of winning Wimbledon...pity Djoko was the only hurdle. And stop insulting me with your inept comments.

Well when you put it like the #2 and reigning US Open champ beats the #1 in a close final, it all sounds so reasonable. Anyone would think this was a normal match where the better player on the day won!

Sorry for the insults. FWIW, I think you're just a wind-up merchant, but please explain how Djokovic was motivated to throw the match so that Murray could win.

 

[buckle]

Doping duo

Given the amount of doping in the sport, it's difficult to take anything seriously. Even the commentators are ex-dopers. It was Murray's turn and that's it. They must both know that Nadal is a full on juicer so why are they not more indignant?

 

[The Principal Sheep]

Channel 4 (UK) carried out a 'FactCheck' on doping in sports, dirtiest is weightlifting followed by cycling, cleanest is badminton with tennis coming fourth on the cleanest list.

 

[Wigwan]

Channel 4 (UK) carried out a 'FactCheck' on doping in sports, dirtiest is weightlifting followed by cycling, cleanest is badminton with tennis coming fourth on the cleanest list.

Based on what? Numbers of positive? If you don't want to find the cheater you'll never find them...

 

[Bicycle]

Channel 4 (UK) carried out a 'FactCheck' on doping in sports, dirtiest is weightlifting followed by cycling, cleanest is badminton with tennis coming fourth on the cleanest list.

A meaningless exercise if ever there was one.

 

[bikelizard]

Channel 4 (UK) carried out a 'FactCheck' on doping in sports, dirtiest is weightlifting followed by cycling, cleanest is badminton with tennis coming fourth on the cleanest list.

And most readers possibly believe such nonsense.

But hey, I play badminton myself sometimes and manage quite well without doping, so there must be some truth in there.

 

[Cauberg]

Just curious, Buckle. Which commentators are ex-dopers?

 

[buckle]

Just curious, Buckle. Which commentators are ex-dopers?

McEnroe and Rusedski.