Teams & Riders The Big 6

[Nick2413]

It just dawned on me that the combined population of the 4 countries of the big 6 is only 36M. Seems crazy in the context of the sport.

 

[Boehmand]

It just dawned on me that the combined population of the 4 countries of the big 6 is only 36M. Seems crazy in the context of the sport.

There are 500 million bicycles in China, but not a single Chinese rider at WT or PT level

 

[Potomac]

There are 500 million bicycles in China, but not a single Chinese rider at WT or PT level

We just need them to host WT races to raise awareness and....oh...wait. Nevermind

 

[Nick2413]

What perplexes me is that the (large) traditional cycling countries don’t have much representation at the very top. Italy, France, Spain combined have 5x the population but none of the riders, and it’s not like cycling isn’t popular there.

 

[CyclistAbi]

It's about some perspective too, for us, Slovenians, one in a million is still considered to be rather special.

 

[Hugo Koblet]

In my eyes, there's just the "big 4", Vingegaard, Van der Poel, Pogacar and Philipsen. And I can understand if you don't think that Philipsen quite belong with the other 3.

 

[Peyroteo94]

In my eyes, there's just the "big 4", Vingegaard, Van der Poel, Pogacar and Philipsen. And I can understand if you don't think that Philipsen quite belong with the other 3.

MVP is a great leadout man. If Philipsen wasn't in Alpecin with MVP, he would not win 4 stages in the Tour or MSR.

 

[Valv.Piti]

In my eyes, there's just the "big 4", Vingegaard, Van der Poel, Pogacar and Philipsen. And I can understand if you don't think that Philipsen quite belong with the other 3.

Oh stop it, because of 6 stages in TdF and MSR? Come on. Remco and Wout are obviously better for the moment, Philipsen needs to show this level for a season or two and do well in the cobbled classics to be considered in this league at all

Right now its a big 5. Roglic is MIA

 

[Boehmand]

MVP is a great leadout man. If Philipsen wasn't in Alpecin with MVP, he would not win 4 stages in the Tour or MSR.

I disagree.

Philipsen is extremely durable in races where other sprinters falter, and while it obviously helps having the worlds best lead out man (and a potential race winner to take some of the focus), he appears to have gotten the positioning problems of yesteryear out of the way, and is now often found in the right place at the right time, even without a lead out rider.

 

[hayneplane]

In my eyes, there's just the "big 4", Vingegaard, Van der Poel, Pogacar and Philipsen. And I can understand if you don't think that Philipsen quite belong with the other 3.

I could take it down as far as a big 2 of Pogi and MVDP as I honestly think they could win plenty of races as solo entrants without any team-mates gravel racing style. Possibly Vingegaard could also with minimal support but no chance Philipsen is doing that.

 

[CyclistAbi]

I could settle with just one, Rogla, but there is a reason we have it set at roughly top 6 and there is a reason this list doesn't change after each race.

 

[Froome]

The Big 3

 

[RedheadDane]

Those are the (very cute) tiny three!

 

[Vinther1991]

Oh stop it, because of 6 stages in TdF and MSR? Come on. Remco and Wout are obviously better for the moment, Philipsen needs to show this level for a season or two and do well in the cobbled classics to be considered in this league at all

Right now its a big 5. Roglic is MIA

Philipsen already has a 2nd place in Roubaix and two victories in Brugge-De Panne to show he can do well in the cobbled classics. Objectively he had a more successfull 2023 than Wout. Now he will also have a more successfull 2024.

 

[Didinho]

The Big 3

Another Rabofail?

 

[durtyfat7]

What is your pecking order of the Big 6 in terms of overall skills?

 

[Dekker_Tifosi]

What is your pecking order of the Big 6 in terms of overall skills?

hm, more like the big 1 , Pogacar. Then the others.

 

[Red Rick]

What is your pecking order of the Big 6 in terms of overall skills?

I'd say Pog > Vingegaard > MvdP >> Evenepoel > Roglic = Van Aert

Vingegaard and MvdP are both specialists, but I give Vingegaard the edge because he didn't get clapped by Pog last year in his #1 race, plus he goes hard more than 3 race days a year. Evenepoel deserves credit for his versatility, but he gets beaten by Pog on any terrain. Rog has the same issue as Evenepoel, but a bit worse, and he doesn't win big Tier 2 races as much as Evenepoel does, even if he's more likely to get 3rd in a TdF. Van Aert is the one that both can only win few top tier races AND he gets beaten in them, though you may argue Rog can't win monuments.

 

[Winnen]

I'd say Pog > Vingegaard > MvdP >> Evenepoel > Roglic = Van Aert

Vingegaard and MvdP are both specialists, but I give Vingegaard the edge because he didn't get clapped by Pog last year in his #1 race, plus he goes hard more than 3 race days a year. Evenepoel deserves credit for his versatility, but he gets beaten by Pog on any terrain. Rog has the same issue as Evenepoel, but a bit worse, and he doesn't win big Tier 2 races as much as Evenepoel does, even if he's more likely to get 3rd in a TdF. Van Aert is the one that both can only win few top tier races AND he gets beaten in them, though you may argue Rog can't win monuments.

I would change two details:

Pog >> Vingegaard > MvdP > Evenepoel > Roglic = Van Aert

Pog may have lost 2 TdF's from Vingegaard, but last year his preps where not perfect and the year before that he was also fighting Roglic. That was a mistake. I think there is not much between them in terms of GC skills. Adding his superhuman one day race performances makes him significantly better than Vingegaard IMHO.

I also rate Remco closer to MvdP due to his versatility. He has already won a grand tour, been world champion on the road and in time trialling, and has won a monument (twice). You could even argue that he is equal to VdP. But I am a MvdP fan, so I am not going to.

 

[VayaVayaVaya]

Nah.

Pog > Ving > MvDP > Rog > Remco > Wout

Pog is the most versatile, with varied monuments + 2 x Tour

Ving is reigning 2 x Tour champ with all time performances, plus dominant one-week performances + Vuelta podium

MvDP is as good at monuments as Ving is GTs but, as they say, the Tour is the Tour.

Rog is almost as versatile as Remco with 4 GTs, a monument, Olympics ITT gold, and numerous 1-week victories.

Remco is elite at non-cobbled monuments but not as good as Rog at GTs or 1-week,

Wout has more tools than palmares but still a phenomenon.

Edit: In my Venn diagram post, I had Remco before Rog, but then Rog stomped this ITT and I am all about the recent bias.

 

[VeloMaster]

Right now its a big 5. Roglic is MIA

That aged well.

 

[SHAD0W93]

That aged well.

Race isn’t over yet but I hope he can be on the up and up.

 

[Blanco]

I'd say Pog > Vingegaard > MvdP >> Evenepoel > Roglic = Van Aert

Vingegaard and MvdP are both specialists, but I give Vingegaard the edge because he didn't get clapped by Pog last year in his #1 race, plus he goes hard more than 3 race days a year. Evenepoel deserves credit for his versatility, but he gets beaten by Pog on any terrain. Rog has the same issue as Evenepoel, but a bit worse, and he doesn't win big Tier 2 races as much as Evenepoel does, even if he's more likely to get 3rd in a TdF. Van Aert is the one that both can only win few top tier races AND he gets beaten in them, though you may argue Rog can't win monuments.

What do you consider big tier 2 races?

 

[Blanco]

Pog, Vinge, VDP on the same level.
Remco, Roglic little below.
Van Aert further below.

 

[Berniece]

Pog, Vinge, VDP on the same level.
Remco, Roglic little below.
Van Aert further below.

I agree with this one. The moment you put Pogacar ahead of the rest you are implying that you are comparing riders over multiple disciplines, which isn't possible. You should look at the riders within their speciality, and in such a case, these 3 are the best.