The Real Football Thread

[Bala Verde]

Ymmm, they had 10 man in 2nd half ? I Think it's logical to defend

Agreed. That was their only option basically (today). It's not necessarily pretty, but certainly tactical given the circumstances. And it was not that it disadvantaged Barcelona; I mean they had 11 players on the field, meaning they had the best chance to convert that into an advantage. Too bad they failed, but then again, how close did they come with that missed penalty.

Great entertainment again.

 

[Gloin22]

They defended like that over the 2 games even when they had 11 on the field with occasional break-away's, i.e how they got their goals.

Did you even watch the games?

They executed their plan better than Barca 'nuff said

 

[Zam_Olyas]

They executed their plan better than Barca 'nuff said

Barca did not have Plan B. they were barsenal, trying to pass it in at times.

 

[pmcg76]

They executed their plan better than Barca 'nuff said

Which like I said is a very unattractive and negative style of football for neutrals, hence the reason why I said people wwould dislike soccer because of that.

Winning like that might be efficent but it is the equivalant of sitting on during an entire race and then winning in sprint.

 

[Nielsa]

One team attacks while the other defends. It's like watching basket, baseball, handball except Barcelona was on the attack for 90% of the time.
I thought it was more exciting than two teams locked in trench warfare in the middle, like the Manchester United vs Chelsea games in the CL some years back.

 

[Gloin22]

To add to this. Barca is very dimensional team too. They only play for Messi. If he doesnt deliver and struggles in a match ...they usually fail. Kepp Messi under leash and Barca isnt so strong

 

[Zam_Olyas]

To add to this. Barca is very dimensional team too. They only play for Messi. If he doesnt deliver and struggles in a match ...they usually fail. Kepp Messi under leash and Barca isnt so strong

Thats not true.

 

[Gloin22]

Thats not true.

It's my opinion and has been confirmed in the last 3 matches at least I know people will disagree with that a lot

 

[Zam_Olyas]

It's my opinion and has been confirmed in the last 3 matches at least I know people will disagree with that a lot

Of course, we are entitled to our opinion even if this CN .

 

[Nastyy]

Barcelona's style of playing is usually what makes games boring. They pass and pass and pass and pass and pass and basically force the other team to defend. If you put pressure on Barca they will crack your defense or just pass the ball backwards for as long as they find a hole in the defense. And so far anyone hasn't been able to keep the ball against Barca as they defend very well and put pressure on you.

This year they seem to be worse at this than in previous years or other teams have become better at playing against them. Hopefully Guardiola leaves Barca and the whole team will crumble. Messi ain't that phenomenal without his good team, when he plays for Argentina he's usually very anonymous on the field and so far hasn't convinced that he's a true great outside Barcelona. Ronaldo has proven he's hot stuff everywhere but Messi hasn't and that's what separates him from the true greats like Zidane and Maradona.

 

[Christian]

They defended like that over the 2 games even when they had 11 on the field with occasional break-away's, i.e how they got their goals.

Did you even watch the games?

You play to win and against Barca this is your best shot. Sure it's not pretty but if you don't do it you get smashed.

In 2004 they accused Otto Rehhagel of not having his Greek team play "modern" football. His response: "Winning is modern" ("Modern ist, wer gewinnt")

 

[pmcg76]

You play to win and against Barca this is your best shot. Sure it's not pretty but if you don't do it you get smashed.

In 2004 they accused Otto Rehhagel of not having his Greek team play "modern" football. His response: "Winning is modern" ("Modern ist, wer gewinnt")

I dont disagree with that but it is negative and unattractive to watch. I like to watch open, skillful, attacking football, not 11 men behind the ball all the time.

 

[Zam_Olyas]

Priceless

 

[plooton]

Priceless

the more idiotic stare, the more idiotic foul

 

[The Hitch]

Makes me even more sad that spain managed to scrape the wc. It was basically this team - messi,

I hope that idiot midfielder who cost brazil the tournament is still having nightmares.

 

[Parera]

Chelsea were the superior side over 180 minutes. They limited Barcelona's chances, maintained discipline in their backline (Terry's moment of madness aside) and Lampard/Mikel/Meireles were superb at neutralizing Xavi's effectiveness. Di Matteo won the tactical battle with Guardiola.

 

[Swede1]

Barcelona's style of playing is usually what makes games boring. They pass and pass and pass and pass and pass and basically force the other team to defend. If you put pressure on Barca they will crack your defense or just pass the ball backwards for as long as they find a hole in the defense. And so far anyone hasn't been able to keep the ball against Barca as they defend very well and put pressure on you.

Chelsea were the superior side over 180 minutes. They limited Barcelona's chances, maintained discipline in their backline (Terry's moment of madness aside) and Lampard/Mikel/Meireles were superb at neutralizing Xavi's effectiveness. Di Matteo won the tactical battle with Guardiola.

I agree that Barcelona's style of playing is kinda boring because its sooooo controlled. But I can see that its hard to play against. Chelsea did an amazing job at ruining Barcelona's tactics though. Even with their whole team on defense they still had some pretty exciting plays, and were constantly lobbing the ball.

And for tomorrow I predict Bayern will advance to the finals. It will likewise be a 2 to 2 draw.

 

[Bala Verde]

The one touch passing game from Barcelona, for me, comes closest to football perfection. I find it the opposite of boring, because it shows tremendous skill, control, insight in the game (positioning), and tactics (finding the opening, prying open the defensive line etc), just because 'you can't outrun the ball' and 'you can't score without the ball.'

But to keep a high level of possession, your individual players need to be extremely skilled and they need to work together as a team/machine. What is brilliant about messi in this system is that he is one of those rare players who can and almost always think and move forward when in possession. Most players turn around, or pass back or laterally to control and guard the ball, whereas he has the ability to gain meters. Good positioning and careful attention from team members then moves the whole team and it's lines up the field and into the defensive lines of the opponent.

This match was much better than most champions league matches (or other high level events such as world or euro cup semis and finals), which are often so calculated, and premised on the 'we cannot afford to lose' dogma, that it kills any creativity, risk and spontaneity. 10 players with their backs against he wall and 11 players, at home, who HAD to win, HAD to score, trying to go 100% in attack mode. The defense proved impenetrable (which is also an art in itself).

Let's hope the next game is as entertaining.

 

[pmcg76]

Chelsea were the superior side over 180 minutes. They limited Barcelona's chances, maintained discipline in their backline (Terry's moment of madness aside) and Lampard/Mikanel/Meireles were superb at neutralizing Xavi's effectiveness. Di Matteo won the tactical battle with Guardiola.

Saying Chelsea were the superior side is a bit like saying Nick Nuyens was the superior rider at Flanders last year. Dont think so. I think everyone knows that the best team/rider doesnt always win.

At this stage every man and his dog knows the most effective way to play against Barcelona and indeed Spain. 11 men behind the ball and try to hit them on the odd break-out. It doesnt take some tactical genius to think up that plan. Sometimes it works (Switzerland done it to Spain at the last World Cup ffs) but mostly it doesnt.

Yes it takes incredible discipline to implement such a rearguard action but last night it also involved a huge amount of luck which even the Chelsea players have admitted, Messi missing a penalty is incredibly rare and he had 3/4 great chances of which he would usually convert at least one.


.

 

[Bike Boy]

Games like this are exactly why I understand those who dont like soccer. Negativity and pure luck wins out, the equivilant of those races where everyone sits on Cancellara.

You know the feeling when you have been totally absorbed by a match with your faverourite team in it and then the next day you realise that nobody but you thought it was epic?

That's why I'm surprised this match is the talk of the town today. Everybody is talking about where I live, apparantly the game had an amazing impact, so I guees your view is shared by very few.

Of course I'm a long time Chelsea supporter so for me yesterday was bordering to a nervous breakdown. Cetainly could have done without all that drama.

But I don't think you comparsion makes sense. tactics in football and cycling aren't that similar. Let's say team x is a very physical strong team and team y is a very strong passing team. Team x does not in general have to catch a lucky break to win. Sometimes team x is just superior, whereas Cancellara very often is the strongest guy, especially when he loses out to a second tier rider like Nuyens.

Obviously Chelsea was lucky yesterday, but luck is a different size in football. I just don't agree with you. Think 3 years back and Chelsea almost proved my point...

 

[Libertine Seguros]

But to keep a high level of possession, your individual players need to be extremely skilled and they need to work together as a team/machine. What is brilliant about messi in this system is that he is one of those rare players who can and almost always think and move forward when in possession.

Unless you give him a blue and white striped shirt to wear, whereupon he promptly forgets all of this

 

[Parera]

Saying Chelsea were the superior side is a bit like saying Nick Nuyens was the superior rider at Flanders last year. Dont think so. I think everyone knows that the best team/rider doesnt always win.

At this stage every man and his dog knows the most effective way to play against Barcelona and indeed Spain. 11 men behind the ball and try to hit them on the odd break-out. It doesnt take some tactical genius to think up that plan. Sometimes it works (Switzerland done it to Spain at the last World Cup ffs) but mostly it doesnt.

Yes it takes incredible discipline to implement such a rearguard action but last night it also involved a huge amount of luck which even the Chelsea players have admitted, Messi missing a penalty is incredibly rare and he had 3/4 great chances of which he would usually convert at least one.


.

Sigh.

Messi is not a great penalty taker. Dead average by the numbers (~ 75%). I think that was his 3rd miss this year. You must have him mistaken for Ronaldo, who since moving to La Liga owns a 96% conversion rate.

I will say it again, Barcelona created very little in the second half after the penalty. Speculative shots and half-chances, nothing more; much like the first leg, when the match was over, Barcelona for all their "possession" they only managed to create 5 solid chances.

 

[jamiephillips]

Enjoyed the penalty shoot out in the other semi tonight!

 

[pmcg76]

Some good saves, I knew Ramos would miss.

First half of that game was very good but if really fizzled out as a contest in the 2nd half onwards and everyone looked dead in Extra-time.

Ronaldo apart from his 2nd goal was invisible in a big game as has become the norm now.

Should be an interesting final. At least there wont be any parking the bus from the first minute.

 

[Christian]

Congrats Bayern! I only saw the second half and the penalty kicks, that was very exciting stuff. Would be nice if they won it at home