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If Danielson walks, it will just reinforce my opinion that clean riders wont hang around a sport that recognises doping as an integral part and only punishes those that are caught with dope in a totally ad hoc and unexplainable manner. How could you block out these guys in a peloton of dopers that they all have an advantage especially when so many would laugh, jeer, slag, and bully you for not doping!
Tygart is part of the problem, not the solution. Yes he took down Armstrong, when he was retired, but as we have seen with Mayweather, Gaitlin and others he is part of the problem of doping in sport. I mean it was Vaughters who suggested those on his team get 6 months bans over winter FFS and no one paid back a cent of their ill gotten gains!!
Tygart is part of the problem, not the solution. Yes he took down Armstrong, when he was retired, but as we have seen with Mayweather, Gaitlin and others he is part of the problem of doping in sport. I mean it was Vaughters who suggested those on his team get 6 months bans over winter FFS and no one paid back a cent of their ill gotten gains!!
- Mar 15, 2011
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Re:
I have no idea.
The tweets makes it sound like Tom Danielson thinks that Tom Danielson will walk away. He's always been arrogant, so his confidence doesn't really mean anything.
As for the delay, I'm sure he has the money to obfuscate. I couldn't think of any testosterone positives being successfully argued away, found one cycling and one non-WADA case after looking
- There was a baseball player who successfully appealed on grounds of the sample collection not following protocol.
- From Wiki:
The test seems pretty robust. Only Floyyd and Landaluze have tried to fight. There was a US track runner, Mary Decker Slaney who took the case to arbitration (USATF cleared her, IAAF appealed). IAAF used longitudinal t/e scores to make its case. Slaney said that birth control affected her results. (Fun details: she was coached by Alberto Salazar at the time. She also cracked the 6:1 ratio, way more than the 4:1 we have now.). Not even Gay or Gatlin tried to appeal: Gatlin made an appeal after his T positive, but only in regards to whether his first positive "counted" or not (4 vs 8 year ban). Gay did not appeal, and got time off for cooperation.
Cooke's tweets make it sound like it would be a technicality if he does get off. I'm not sure if the tweets mean that something in his sample other than testosterone triggered the positive, which was not in the b- sample, or if there was not enough testosterone in his b- sample to back up the A.
Fun drama for the coming off-season
mrhender said:
I have no idea.
The tweets makes it sound like Tom Danielson thinks that Tom Danielson will walk away. He's always been arrogant, so his confidence doesn't really mean anything.
As for the delay, I'm sure he has the money to obfuscate. I couldn't think of any testosterone positives being successfully argued away, found one cycling and one non-WADA case after looking
- There was a baseball player who successfully appealed on grounds of the sample collection not following protocol.
- From Wiki:
The test seems pretty robust. Only Floyyd and Landaluze have tried to fight. There was a US track runner, Mary Decker Slaney who took the case to arbitration (USATF cleared her, IAAF appealed). IAAF used longitudinal t/e scores to make its case. Slaney said that birth control affected her results. (Fun details: she was coached by Alberto Salazar at the time. She also cracked the 6:1 ratio, way more than the 4:1 we have now.). Not even Gay or Gatlin tried to appeal: Gatlin made an appeal after his T positive, but only in regards to whether his first positive "counted" or not (4 vs 8 year ban). Gay did not appeal, and got time off for cooperation.
Cooke's tweets make it sound like it would be a technicality if he does get off. I'm not sure if the tweets mean that something in his sample other than testosterone triggered the positive, which was not in the b- sample, or if there was not enough testosterone in his b- sample to back up the A.
Fun drama for the coming off-season
- Jul 11, 2013
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Thanks MSTR.
I guess nothing would surprise these days.
After all, if you think about it, who would really gain from a final guilty verdict here.
Sometimes I think cases are opened as part of a wider anti-doping strategy.
It is communicating to the racing environment that "now we got this stuff covered so don't go do stupid things".
Same as the ABP with comlplete rider access really.
It's all about percetion, and distributing responsibilities to keep the "sport" reliable.
Signalling that you are able and willing to do something, but also holding back on execution because that ain't necessary no more once you sent the message?
Okay, in my sceptical corner tonight.
I guess nothing would surprise these days.
After all, if you think about it, who would really gain from a final guilty verdict here.
Sometimes I think cases are opened as part of a wider anti-doping strategy.
It is communicating to the racing environment that "now we got this stuff covered so don't go do stupid things".
Same as the ABP with comlplete rider access really.
It's all about percetion, and distributing responsibilities to keep the "sport" reliable.
Signalling that you are able and willing to do something, but also holding back on execution because that ain't necessary no more once you sent the message?
Okay, in my sceptical corner tonight.
- Apr 19, 2011
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Re:
Please excuse my ignorance, but are they buddies? Seems weird if they were buddies for Matt to blab a convo on twitter, especially something as sensitive as a doping pos. Otherwise, how would Matt hear it from the horses mouth?
So what, Matt Cooke just overheard this in a bar or something along those lines?More Strides than Rides said:
Please excuse my ignorance, but are they buddies? Seems weird if they were buddies for Matt to blab a convo on twitter, especially something as sensitive as a doping pos. Otherwise, how would Matt hear it from the horses mouth?
- Jun 27, 2013
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Re: Re:
It's hard to overstate just how much Cooke despises Danielson
http://www.crankpunk.com/blogs/crankpunk-interviews/item/133-matt-cooke-interview-you-would-never-know-their-names-if-they-had-never-taken-drugs.html
irondan said:
It's hard to overstate just how much Cooke despises Danielson
http://www.crankpunk.com/blogs/crankpunk-interviews/item/133-matt-cooke-interview-you-would-never-know-their-names-if-they-had-never-taken-drugs.html
- Sep 29, 2012
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Re: Re:
Okay, we know Matt Cooke dislikes TD. Matt's comment on twitter that 'This is from the horses mouth btw" still doesn't make much sense. Maybe TD was bragging to him in public, which is entirely possible considering they both live in the same town?
It sounds like Levi's not one of his favorite people either.GuyIncognito said:
Okay, we know Matt Cooke dislikes TD. Matt's comment on twitter that 'This is from the horses mouth btw" still doesn't make much sense. Maybe TD was bragging to him in public, which is entirely possible considering they both live in the same town?
- Sep 29, 2012
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Re: Re:
He did start by saying, "allegedly". So no, TD did not tell him nor say it in his hearing. They are both cyclists and no doubt are only 1 degree of separation apart. So it's no doubt hearsay, but so far it's looking consistent with the rest of what is NOT going on.
irondan said:
He did start by saying, "allegedly". So no, TD did not tell him nor say it in his hearing. They are both cyclists and no doubt are only 1 degree of separation apart. So it's no doubt hearsay, but so far it's looking consistent with the rest of what is NOT going on.
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IzzyStradlin said:
Airgas-Safeway? Without shame they signed Horner (How long is his contract btw?)
Re:
Well i say he talks allot and it gives we addicts something to read. Thanks JV for not being a bore and making some entertaining comments.
I find the topic interesting. Lots of interesting first/second hand and alleged stories. Many want to lambaste TD and get readers feeling the same...thats fine.However If making personal comments about his ability to bed younger,legal aged consenting woman is meant to compound the disdain i have to tell you its having the opposite effect on me personally. I am even starting to like him a bit. JV is trying to race a clean team(putting aside the endless conspiracies), maybe another rider he is not an adjoined twin with,will test positive?? Possible No?Could anyone on this thread run a cycling team and guarantee never a positive? "oh but he said he would resign...blah blay"mrhender said:
Well i say he talks allot and it gives we addicts something to read. Thanks JV for not being a bore and making some entertaining comments.
Re: Re:
Id guess that few people have a problem with TD hooking up with young hotties- unless of course it comes at the expense of TD's wife and kids. In this case, TD was openly cheating on his wife and mother of his children, which is just poor form.
red ink said:
Id guess that few people have a problem with TD hooking up with young hotties- unless of course it comes at the expense of TD's wife and kids. In this case, TD was openly cheating on his wife and mother of his children, which is just poor form.
Re: Re:
one point I was trying to make was that this is a cycling forum and discussing riders,teams,unethical gains through chemicals, behavior toward teammates,media,fans etc OK fine. Well there is a demarcation line for me and i am sure other fans.
What he does with woman/men/relationship with his wife and the details or these relationships are none of our business. I am sure plenty of these stories are *** and knowing he may have children who can go on line now or future and read about them can only be a sad thing for his household
I am no fan of Mr Danielson but i find it gross and irresponsible that a cycling magazine associates itself with random (with potentialy) family damaging comments made by anyone careless enough to pen them.
.Froomestrong. said:
one point I was trying to make was that this is a cycling forum and discussing riders,teams,unethical gains through chemicals, behavior toward teammates,media,fans etc OK fine. Well there is a demarcation line for me and i am sure other fans.
What he does with woman/men/relationship with his wife and the details or these relationships are none of our business. I am sure plenty of these stories are *** and knowing he may have children who can go on line now or future and read about them can only be a sad thing for his household
I am no fan of Mr Danielson but i find it gross and irresponsible that a cycling magazine associates itself with random (with potentialy) family damaging comments made by anyone careless enough to pen them.
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Re: Re:
The girl he destroyed his family over happened to be a podium girl. Podium girls are part of cycling and when a rider openly cheats on his wife at cycling races with podium girls, it becomes cycling forum fodder whether you like it or not.
Pretty sure TD damaged his kids/family all by himself.red ink said:
The girl he destroyed his family over happened to be a podium girl. Podium girls are part of cycling and when a rider openly cheats on his wife at cycling races with podium girls, it becomes cycling forum fodder whether you like it or not.
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It speaks to his integrity, IMO. Sport is a sacrifice, cheating through doping is dodging that sacrifice to get as much for your selfish self as you possibly can.
So for me, his character, particularly considering he has a child, is lowered in my estimation, because he left his wife and kid for a selfish reason.
Compare the quick fix mentality of ditching the wife and kid for a podium girl to the opposite scenario where you stick with someone.
That's why I think it's relevant.
So for me, his character, particularly considering he has a child, is lowered in my estimation, because he left his wife and kid for a selfish reason.
Compare the quick fix mentality of ditching the wife and kid for a podium girl to the opposite scenario where you stick with someone.
That's why I think it's relevant.
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We can talk about the journalist/fanboy with typewriter connection on the clinic, and they are a step removed from the dopers.
As we said in the book/(auto)biography thread, cyclists' jobs are to win, but their image is their career. Someone like Tom Danielson can't post Strava files, twitter conversations, Tom's Cycling Camp, Tom's Cycling Camp truck, and then decide something that is actually part of his character isn't associated with that. And to be fair to Danielson, he hasn't, just one post here and several on Strava.
Skin in the game... skin in the game...
I can't remember who, but some cyclist said that he would never dope because of the example it would set for his kids, or something like that. Unfortunately for that cyclist, he just made his family part of the game. That's skin in the game. Whatever you put out there was put out there by your own doing.
And just to reiterate, fair play to Danielson, who is keeping his skin in the game. He's decided to posting his rides/triumphs on Strava and assert his innocence while provisionally suspended, but he is leaving himself open to critics. The fanboyism is what reignited this thread...
#skininthegame
As we said in the book/(auto)biography thread, cyclists' jobs are to win, but their image is their career. Someone like Tom Danielson can't post Strava files, twitter conversations, Tom's Cycling Camp, Tom's Cycling Camp truck, and then decide something that is actually part of his character isn't associated with that. And to be fair to Danielson, he hasn't, just one post here and several on Strava.
Skin in the game... skin in the game...
I can't remember who, but some cyclist said that he would never dope because of the example it would set for his kids, or something like that. Unfortunately for that cyclist, he just made his family part of the game. That's skin in the game. Whatever you put out there was put out there by your own doing.
And just to reiterate, fair play to Danielson, who is keeping his skin in the game. He's decided to posting his rides/triumphs on Strava and assert his innocence while provisionally suspended, but he is leaving himself open to critics. The fanboyism is what reignited this thread...
#skininthegame
- Apr 30, 2014
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Tom Danielson is a cheater, whether it's with testosterone patches at the Tour of Utah or with a woman who is not his wife. He is of low moral character and fortitude.
He's arrogant enough to think that if/when his B sample comes back negative, he'll get off scott free. That's just not the case here. His A sample was a confirmation that he's been doping his entire career, anyone can see that.
His consequences will be handed out by Joe public this time, forget about USADA.
Joe says Tommy D has no place in cycling.
He's arrogant enough to think that if/when his B sample comes back negative, he'll get off scott free. That's just not the case here. His A sample was a confirmation that he's been doping his entire career, anyone can see that.
His consequences will be handed out by Joe public this time, forget about USADA.
Joe says Tommy D has no place in cycling.
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