Teams & Riders Tom Dumoulin discussion thread

[Devil's Elbow]

This has been coming for a while to be honest, he's spent three years questioning his future in the sport and unfortunately he hasn't been getting the results he's looking for this year in particular. We'll all miss him but I do think it's the right decision for him mentally. And hopefully he can still make a positive memory for himself out of his farewell, he deserves it for how long he's been fighting his demons.

 

[Luthor]

Sad news. Quite strange what happened with him . I wish he would've converted into a TT specialist/stage hunter, he has the talent and still make it work. The route for WC ITT is spicy, he has a good chance for a medal with WvA also skipping. Who knows, maybe he changes his mind after it. I will def root for him there.

 

[Big Doopie]

One of my favorites riders.

wish him the best and that he find happiness.

 

[Red Rick]

Sad news. Quite strange what happened with him . I wish he would've converted into a TT specialist/stage hunter, he has the talent and still make it work. The route for WC ITT is spicy, he has a good chance for a medal with WvA also skipping. Who knows, maybe he changes his mind after it. I will def root for him there.

The role within the team isn't exactly the problem. The problem is that his body doesn't react to training stimuli as it used to and he doesn't recover anymore when training intensity goes up. Therefor you can't really say "I'll just become a stagehunter instead" either.

Apart from that breakaway he was in on stage 7, the Giro was a downhill trajectory from the start. Seems like a minor miracle he got that close to winning the ITT.

 

[Boes]

A lot of respect for a fantastic rider who sees and accepts the end of this carreer when it has come.
Froome should take his example.

 

[Luthor]

The role within the team isn't exactly the problem. The problem is that his body doesn't react to training stimuli as it used to and he doesn't recover anymore when training intensity goes up. Therefor you can't really say "I'll just become a stagehunter instead" either.

Apart from that breakaway he was in on stage 7, the Giro was a downhill trajectory from the start. Seems like a minor miracle he got that close to winning the ITT.

Which kinda means to me his body can't take a full GT. So he should ride outside them. Yeah, I know it sounds harsh for a GT winner but it's not impossible. But I imagine he wouldn't be motivated enough for other objectives outside GTs.

 

[KZD]

Sad news. Quite strange what happened with him . I wish he would've converted into a TT specialist/stage hunter, he has the talent and still make it work. The route for WC ITT is spicy, he has a good chance for a medal with WvA also skipping. Who knows, maybe he changes his mind after it. I will def root for him there.

Is the Van Aert part already confirmed? It would be kind of dumb in my opinion

 

[Carols]

So sorry to see him go, but he knows his body and has made the best decision for himself. What a shame for JV, they spent a fortune on him and got very little back in return

 

[CyclistAbi]

Tom knows his body and motivation the best. All in all hard not to wish him the best. As for remaining season. Being the last one i would suggest to try. Try as hard as possible and win some more. After to hang up the bike on the wall and to move on into a different future.

 

[CyclistAbi]

 

[DoYouEvenRideBruh]

Greatest French rider of his generation. He will be sorely missed.

 

[jmdirt]

I think that Devil's Elbow hit it, the battles in his head are greater than his battles on the bike. I hope that he can find some joy on the bike before he calls it quits, but even if he doesn't, I hope that the next chapter works out well for him.

 

[samhocking]

Very similar statement as Wiggins ending his stage racing career, in that the family, physical and emotional sacrifice needed to train away from home to remain at the very top level become too great along with the expectation of a nation once you've won a GT. Some riders cope with the sacrifice as they remain really hungry even after adversity like Froome, Valverde, Contador, but I think the Indurain style of GT winner has ended, in no small part to the ITT km reduced to the point it's not enough for the pure Rouleurs to win GTs anymore.

 

[Logic-is-your-friend]

Is the Van Aert part already confirmed? It would be kind of dumb in my opinion

Not confirmed, but very much considered.

 

[Dekker_Tifosi]

I think that Devil's Elbow hit it, the battles in his head are greater than his battles on the bike. I hope that he can find some joy on the bike before he calls it quits, but even if he doesn't, I hope that the next chapter works out well for him.

Hmm only partly true.

I think in a great part his decline already started after doing that absolutely mental 2018 year. Trying to peak for Giro + Tour + Worlds took it's toll, especially combined with all the mental pressure and added attention after his Giro win.

It was confirmed he was overtrained in 2019, and even before the Giro injury / DNF he'd probably would have done bad. He put his body through too much in 2018, and mentally it was too much as well. And never really recovered. I think he is STILL, to this day struggling with the after effects of this.
The fatigue/injuries after training..

He knows this himself as well, he says in his goodbye message he could probably get back to full potential with a more slow, deliberate training program. But there are no guarantees.. and he doesn't want to put himself through that again (also again, knowing there is 0 guarantees). So he takes another path.

I for one will forever be grateful for all that he achieved. 9 GT stage wins (in all GT's). Giro win, Tour podium... almost a Vuelta win (but yet so far). World Champ ITT, Benelux Tour, Olympic silver (x2). Mans brought us Dutchies much joy.
I hope for him that he has a good result in the WC ITT once more and then can enjoy his life in peace

 

[Barnacle Bill]

Disappointed to hear this, but perhaps it's a wise choice. All the best to him.

 

[Red Rick]

Greatest French rider of his generation. He will be sorely missed.

I can't believe the Dumoulin brothers are so different in height

 

[woodburn]

Hmm only partly true.

I think in a great part his decline already started after doing that absolutely mental 2018 year. Trying to peak for Giro + Tour + Worlds took it's toll, especially combined with all the mental pressure and added attention after his Giro win.

It was confirmed he was overtrained in 2019, and even before the Giro injury / DNF he'd probably would have done bad. He put his body through too much in 2018, and mentally it was too much as well. And never really recovered. I think he is STILL, to this day struggling with the after effects of this.
The fatigue/injuries after training..

He knows this himself as well, he says in his goodbye message he could probably get back to full potential with a more slow, deliberate training program. But there are no guarantees.. and he doesn't want to put himself through that again (also again, knowing there is 0 guarantees). So he takes another path.

I for one will forever be grateful for all that he achieved. 9 GT stage wins (in all GT's). Giro win, Tour podium... almost a Vuelta win (but yet so far). World Champ ITT, Benelux Tour, Olympic silver (x2). Mans brought us Dutchies much joy.
I hope for him that he has a good result in the WC ITT once more and then can enjoy his life in peace

Do you think the the knee injury and then the diagnosis issues with Sunweb were also a setback that greatly contributed to his loss of form? For two years, he was arguably the second-best GT rider in the world before the incident. He never really found that form after the move to Jumbo, which is a big strange considering that you'd think he would have gotten better with them.

 

[Bolder]

As others said, hardly surprising. He was my favorite rider in the mid 2010s, on an underdog team sticking it to the big guys. And what a talent, he never quit, and his 2017 Giro win was a testimony to that. He beat all the best GC riders of his generation straight up, except for Froome, and he came damn close at that.

I think his knee injury was a real physical and mental setback and was probably at the root of his decision to quit.

I'd love to see him grab a win or two this year and go out on a high note.

 

[Red Rick]

DSMs greatest rider also DSMs greatest victim

 

[Sciatic]

Hmm only partly true.

I think in a great part his decline already started after doing that absolutely mental 2018 year. Trying to peak for Giro + Tour + Worlds took it's toll, especially combined with all the mental pressure and added attention after his Giro win.

It was confirmed he was overtrained in 2019, and even before the Giro injury / DNF he'd probably would have done bad. He put his body through too much in 2018, and mentally it was too much as well. And never really recovered. I think he is STILL, to this day struggling with the after effects of this.
The fatigue/injuries after training..

He knows this himself as well, he says in his goodbye message he could probably get back to full potential with a more slow, deliberate training program. But there are no guarantees.. and he doesn't want to put himself through that again (also again, knowing there is 0 guarantees). So he takes another path.

I for one will forever be grateful for all that he achieved. 9 GT stage wins (in all GT's). Giro win, Tour podium... almost a Vuelta win (but yet so far). World Champ ITT, Benelux Tour, Olympic silver (x2). Mans brought us Dutchies much joy.
I hope for him that he has a good result in the WC ITT once more and then can enjoy his life in peace

I think his Giro-Tour double is the best performance of those who’ve attempted it (in the several decades), beautiful racing with great style, but yeah, that has to have taken its toll. And that has probably given pause to other riders considering that double at a high level in both races.

 

[Red Rick]

Hmm only partly true.

I think in a great part his decline already started after doing that absolutely mental 2018 year. Trying to peak for Giro + Tour + Worlds took it's toll, especially combined with all the mental pressure and added attention after his Giro win.

It was confirmed he was overtrained in 2019, and even before the Giro injury / DNF he'd probably would have done bad. He put his body through too much in 2018, and mentally it was too much as well. And never really recovered. I think he is STILL, to this day struggling with the after effects of this.
The fatigue/injuries after training..

He knows this himself as well, he says in his goodbye message he could probably get back to full potential with a more slow, deliberate training program. But there are no guarantees.. and he doesn't want to put himself through that again (also again, knowing there is 0 guarantees). So he takes another path.

I for one will forever be grateful for all that he achieved. 9 GT stage wins (in all GT's). Giro win, Tour podium... almost a Vuelta win (but yet so far). World Champ ITT, Benelux Tour, Olympic silver (x2). Mans brought us Dutchies much joy.
I hope for him that he has a good result in the WC ITT once more and then can enjoy his life in peace

Yeah he's really spent the last 3 years either off the bike or rushing to get to form.

I don't remember when he was back to riding his bike after the knee injury, but even then it wasn't just knee injury cause even then he was overtrained or something or had digestive issues or whatever it was that had to be resolved.

Still Jumbo rushed him to the Tour in 2020. Which in hindsight wasn't even that bad. But then he tried to do the fking Vuelta afterwards.

Then 2021 comes, and basically while he takes a break, I also argue that he probably rushed to get to the Olympics.

 

[Mayomaniac]

Yeah he's really spent the last 3 years either off the bike or rushing to get to form.

I don't remember when he was back to riding his bike after the knee injury, but even then it wasn't just knee injury cause even then he was overtrained or something or had digestive issues or whatever it was that had to be resolved.

Still Jumbo rushed him to the Tour in 2020. Which in hindsight wasn't even that bad. But then he tried to do the fking Vuelta afterwards.

Then 2021 comes, and basically while he takes a break, I also argue that he probably rushed to get to the Olympics.

The way he looked at the end of the 2020 Dauphine I was actually really confident in his chances of riding a great Tour.
I wonder how much of it is physical and how much of it is psychological.
Reminds me a bit of Aru's later career, his recovery was also totally gone. He was still willing to put himself through +8H training rides, but his body was no longer the same.

 

[Red Rick]

The way he looked at the end of the 2020 Dauphine I was actually really confident in his chances of riding a great Tour.
I wonder how much of it is physical and how much of it is psychological.
Reminds me a bit of Aru's later career, his recovery was also totally gone. He was still willing to put himself through +8H training rides, but his body was no longer the same.

I feel he had to work too hard to hit that 2020 Dauphine level. Like at some point he would put in the work, hit a decent level, but it would also tire him out, and he just hit the wall before he would hit a proper peak.

But it is indeed strange that Dumo emphasizes 2020 was when he was really overtrained but he was going better in 2021 by the time he was doing Binkbank Tour.

Even in his best years it was a bit of a recurring thing that Dumo would start the season slow. He didn't have the highest base level, and I feel maybe to he had to be too skinny to be competitive in GC than was optimal for his body. Similarly, the only season he had a decent spring, in 2019, he was also strangely bad in the opening TT of the Giro.

I wonder if this is why his TTs even recently were pretty good. No need to focus excessively on weight. Light racing schedule, and al that. May have been why he was good at Binkbank then too, cuase he wasn't focusing on being skinny.

Giant Sunweb did a lot of shitty things with his scheduling though, even outside Giro/Tour. In 2017 he went to Switserland after the Giro, he was doing Hammer series as well, loads of little things like that..

I do think in the end it's mental as well, in that he says he can give it another try with resting and building up really slowly, but there's no guarantees to that and he doesn't wanna do it anymore. Doesn't seem like he wanted to just try his best whatever level that might have been. He's wasted a few years of his life chasing ghosts already.

Seems like half the WT was interested in signing him.

 

[Breh]

I had hoped to see the best of him again, but if this is best for him, then so be it. Greatest Dutch rider of the last 30 years, and maybe the most talented we ever had.

Bigger talent and greater rider than MVDP?