Teams & Riders Tom Dumoulin discussion thread

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Paraphrasing a bit but

"I don't believe the class is gone. But becoming a stable rider again takes a very long time. And then I rather do something else. I don't wanna just ride around in the peloton and have the occasional good performance. I've tasted an extremely high level and I'm not gonna settle for just being there"
 
All the best with his life, logical decision. Same generation as Aru and Quintana, the GT train has long left the station. Outside of his TT career he had a short and happy high level grand tour experience, two great years. It is very hard to come back at a top competitive level after a debilitating injury, the landscape changed, Roglic happened, Bernal and other young guns took over. Years come and go fast, if you can't make a comeback quickly it's getting harder and harder until there's no point in trying.

Dumoulin's retirement puts into perspective why there are so few greats of the grand tours of this sport. The amount of dedication, mental toughness, sacrifices, outside pressure and work is tremendous. And of course, one needs a bit of luck, which Tom didn't have.
 
I think he was the best (or subjectively, most believable) grand tour rider of 2018, though he went without a #1 placing in the Giro and TDF, as runner-up in both. In the following years, injuries, bad luck, loss of form, and time have ensured that his best years as a professional cyclist are behind him. He did grab a silver medal in the Olympics on his comeback, so it wasn't without its rewards. Also, he can retire without having wondered "what if?" if he had never tried to come back. He's still young and has a life ahead. Well done.
 
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Bigger talent and greater rider than MVDP?
No, and no.
Van Der Poel is already a greater rider, and he's the biggest Dutch talent probably ever.
Dumoulin was a great rider, no doubt. Elite TT-ist, great GC rider, but seems to me that the pressure of being GC rider was too much for him. He didn't last long as a GC rider, and he didn't won much, considering how talented he was.
 
No, and no.
Van Der Poel is already a greater rider, and he's the biggest Dutch talent probably ever.
Dumoulin was a great rider, no doubt. Elite TT-ist, great GC rider, but seems to me that the pressure of being GC rider was too much for him. He didn't last long as a GC rider, and he didn't won much, considering how talented he was.
Van der Poel is world class, no doubt, but the niche in which he's the best in the world is very narrow. His current palmares is barely better than Niki Terpstra.
 
Interesting comparison but 2 very different riders. If Tom had maintained his 2016-18 level through now, I've not a scintilla of a doubt that he would be fighting with, if not Pogacar, definitely Roglic et al for Vueltas and Giros, and podium spots in the Tour. Maybe pick off a few ITTs and a classic here or there. So we'd be saying he's more complete than MvdP.
 
I mean it's not that weird. He was never meant to be a cyclist in the first place. He wasn't picked for his study of choice. So he spent some more time on his bike (which he started doing at 15).
Then he was riding for a relatively small cycling team and was suprisingly selected by Aart Vierhouten for a nations cup race.
There he was 2nd and 9th in the first two stages. He actually borrowed a TT bike from a friend for that race. Never ridden it before, and then won the TT before big favorite Nelson Oliveira and won the GC.
That catapulted it all.

And at the pro's he was primarily a TT-er before accidentely starting to climb well in, I think it was the Tour de suisse were he finished 5th? And the Vuelta was a completely suprise as well. He basically suprisingly stumbled his way to the top. But once on that top the pressure to do well got to him. Mainly the own pressure put on him

He could've probably stayed a very good rider for years even now. As shown by the TT's he did in UAE Tour and Giro. But he didn't want to settle for less. He couldn't reform himself into a domestique. Said something along the lines of "once you have had that level I couldn't go back".
 
The '17 Giro proved that Man can beat Nature (and the stops that it dictates.) Nibali was the real Nibali and the bag the size of a parachute. Nairo was an excellent Quintana judging by his epic win atop the Blockhaus. It was a special GT for me, with the best Pinot since '14. Tom was unstoppable, even dancing around his foes stage 18 or 19, mock attacks that could have stuck. He was the shark circling around Nibali, he was out-climbing the Colombian king, he was dominant. Head and shoulders above the rest.

Good luck Champ. Be happy, enjoy life. And merci.

I hope that this will give Froome something to think about. Kids my age moved on to Hinault and only remembered the '75, '76 or '77 Eddy Merckx...
 
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I mean it's not that weird. He was never meant to be a cyclist in the first place. He wasn't picked for his study of choice. So he spent some more time on his bike (which he started doing at 15).
Then he was riding for a relatively small cycling team and was suprisingly selected by Aart Vierhouten for a nations cup race.
There he was 2nd and 9th in the first two stages. He actually borrowed a TT bike from a friend for that race. Never ridden it before, and then won the TT before big favorite Nelson Oliveira and won the GC.
That catapulted it all.

And at the pro's he was primarily a TT-er before accidentely starting to climb well in, I think it was the Tour de suisse were he finished 5th? And the Vuelta was a completely suprise as well. He basically suprisingly stumbled his way to the top. But once on that top the pressure to do well got to him. Mainly the own pressure put on him

He could've probably stayed a very good rider for years even now. As shown by the TT's he did in UAE Tour and Giro. But he didn't want to settle for less. He couldn't reform himself into a domestique. Said something along the lines of "once you have had that level I couldn't go back".
Tom should take up cycling as a hobby
 
A shame to see him retiring bit for the best if he's not enjoying it and struggling to motivate himself.

Compared to his talent does seem like dumoulin has underachieved. Injuries, overtraining and he struggled mentally to deal with the pressure.
Carapaz almost seems like a Nibali mk2. Consistent, good endurance and good racer but not quite top tier climber.
 
Reactions: Sandisfan
Haha what? Not even close?

Van der Poel is probably the second best rider I have ever seen, but alright...
I would ask you if you've seen very few riders but then I presume you've been watching since the Valverde days.

I just struggle to see any train of thought that puts MvdP in the top 2 of the last ~15 years unless we're gonna rate CX extremely highly.

I will admit I don't give a *** about CX or MTB et al.
 
Reactions: Carols and kingjr
A bit cruel debate you are having.
You are not cruel when you write "cruel"...props to you.

Here, we are comparing apples and oranges, the apple being an orange with French Poupou blood. A blood orange :p . Both are Dutch, and that's where the comparison ends.

Let's not turn this into another Contador vs. Valverde discussion. That would be "cruel".

I love Poupou and his grandson MVP is my chouchou. But in the "what have you done for me lately" world that we live in, we may forget that not too long ago Tom was referred to as "Dumourain". That's how good and how scary he was...
 
That might be currently, but that would ignore overaell achievements and palmares, which is what Toby's implying. And MvdP has an insanely long way to go to get to that point. Like I would include my oft ridiculed Froome and Valverde in there over MvdP
It was ignoring palmares (hence my choice of the word best rather than biggest) and with a thought for his cross and MTB skills. And quite a bit of weight on the pure talent aspect.

Pogacar is the one I have above him, by the way.

But of course it's probably a bit of an overstatement, just like yours. Van Aert should probably be above him too.
 

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