Tour de France 2013

[cineteq]

Break with Tradition for one.

Next year's 100th Tour, it's about nothing but tradition.

 

[MatParker117]

Next year's 100th Tour, it's about nothing but tradition.

Exactly why would you drop the sprint finale? (Among other things?)

 

[oddspam]

This new twitter thing is obviously a hoax. It's strange in so many ways, an in a question of trusting Dauphine Liberte or this, I have no doubt what to choose.

Based on the DL-annoncement. Any ideas of how they will do the stage after Alpe d'Huez? It starts at the bottom of Alpe d'Huez and ends in Annecy area. Is it as easy as Galibier + Madeleine?

 

[cineteq]

Exactly why would you drop the sprint finale? (Among other things?)

Have you heard of Fignon and Lemond 1989's Tour battling it out in the last ITT (Versailles – Paris (Champs-Élysées)?

 

[BillytheKid]

Have you heard of Fignon and Lemond 1989's Tour battling it out in the last ITT (Versailles – Paris (Champs-Élysées)?

Your dating yourself again.

Time does get by. Fignon/Lemond....ancient times now.

 

[Ferminal]

I call BS, 201km from Luchon to Tourmalet is pure fantasy

 

[Magnus]

I call BS, 201km from Luchon to Tourmalet is pure fantasy

Could be done in reality though.
Louchon->Aspin->Arreau->Trebons->Lourdes->Pontacq->Nay->Soulor->Tourmalet
is ~204 km. Take out 3 km for the neutralized zone and you're set.

Edit:
And the Stage 19 could be Col de la Colombiere, Col de la Ramaz, Col de la Joux Plane, Morzine-Avoriaz. Could be fun.

 

[mb2612]

This wouöld be downright pathetic

two ridiculously short Mountain stages.


At least they dropped the parade through Paris though.

 

[OlavEH]

Edit:
And the Stage 19 could be Col de la Colombiere, Col de la Ramaz, Col de la Joux Plane, Morzine-Avoriaz. Could be fun.

This would have been great. I have wanted to see the Joux Plane again for several years, and very much so in combination with at MTF at Avoriaz. This would be a great last stage in the mountains. Too bad the rumours are probably false.

 

[Ferminal]

Could be done in reality though.
Louchon->Aspin->Arreau->Trebons->Lourdes->Pontacq->Nay->Soulor->Tourmalet
is ~204 km. Take out 3 km for the neutralized zone and you're set.
.

I'm not sure even Amaury would be capable of that, going on a 100km journey across the plains, just because. If the stage actually were true, I think 2x Tourmalet (!) would be more likely. The PSM stage would make more sense than all of it.

But Bagneres-de-Luchon as a start for the stage seems very unlikely given the fact they had a start/finish this year, the strong rumour for Saint-Girons, and a pointlessly long transfer from Bonascre.

 

[webvan]

This would have been great. I have wanted to see the Joux Plane again for several years, and very much so in combination with at MTF at Avoriaz. This would be a great last stage in the mountains. Too bad the rumours are probably false.

Joux-Plane + Avoriaz in succession ? That sounds a bit hard...can't remember that ever happening, before 2010 they hadn't been there since 1994 and, let's check, yes it was an ITT, like in 1979 if memory serves and in 1985 when Hinault put the hammer on it was a relatively easy stage.

 

[OlavEH]

Joux-Plane + Avoriaz in succession ? That sounds a bit hard...can't remember that ever happening, before 2010 they hadn't been there since 1994 and, let's check, yes it was an ITT, like in 1979 if memory serves and in 1985 when Hinault put the hammer on it was a relatively easy stage.

A bit hard? Don't understand why. It's only two climbs. If I suggested adding another 3-4 climbs like Saisies, Aravis and Colombiere before that I would agree, but only Joux Plane + Avoriaz won't be so terribly hard.

 

[webvan]

Doesn't look like you know that area well or seen how they always struggle on Joux-Plane (2000, the only time Dopestrong ever cracked, 2006 was terrible too, etc...), it's one of the hardest climbs in France and there would be maybe 1k of flat before they go up Avoriaz, when is the last time you saw that on a GT?

 

[Bavarianrider]

Ridicilously short Mounatin stages, a 15km TT:confused
No stage longer then 210km??????
What a joke for the 10oth edition this would be

 

[OlavEH]

Doesn't look like you know that area well or seen how they always struggle on Joux-Plane (2000, the only time Dopestrong ever cracked, 2006 was terrible too, etc...), it's one of the hardest climbs in France and there would be maybe 1k of flat before they go up Avoriaz, when is the last time you saw that on a GT?

Yeah, I have seen a couple of stages at Joux Plane and know it's really hard. But the last times they have been over Joux Plane, they have also done 3-4 climbs before that. This don't have to be the case if you finish at Avoriaz instead.

They have had much harder stages in the Giro than what i'm suggesting here. Don't see a too big of a problem with Joux Plane and Avoriaz.

 

[webvan]

Any specific examples? Don't confuse steepness with toughness, yeah Zoncolan is ridiculously steep but climbing Joux-Plane at full speed with "TDF pressure" certainly expends more energy. It's like VAM, it's easier to get high VAM on steep climbs than on 7% climbs.

 

[Ferminal]

Sky didn't have any trouble 6.0W/kg'ing it in the Dauphine...

 

[webvan]

The key here being "Dauphine".

 

[Ferminal]

So it's harder to ride 6.0W/kg in the Dauphine than the Tour?

Sky had four left at the end, so even if it is your penultimate climb that is about your standard from this year's Tour (Glandon/Bales)

 

[OlavEH]

Any specific examples? Don't confuse steepness with toughness, yeah Zoncolan is ridiculously steep but climbing Joux-Plane at full speed with "TDF pressure" certainly expends more energy. It's like VAM, it's easier to get high VAM on steep climbs than on 7% climbs.

Well, you did have the Gardaneccia stage in 2011 and the Pampeago stage this year. Both, espcially Gardaneccia, really hard and long stages with much tougher MTF than Avoriaz. I've rarely seen the riders so tired as towards the end of these stages.

And of course, if they add Avoriaz, the riders won't be riding Joux Plane as fast as if they were finishing in Morzine.

 

[webvan]

Depends on the race strategy really and a Giro won by Ryder Hesjedal and with most of the pacing in the climbs done by Caruso is not much of a yardstick.

 

[Maaaaaaaarten]

So it's harder to ride 6.0W/kg in the Dauphine than the Tour?

Sky had four left at the end, so even if it is your penultimate climb that is about your standard from this year's Tour (Glandon/Bales)

I don't know much about all these numbers, but the Sky train didn't even catch a 21 year old neo pro, who had barely raced anything before, in his first season in Europe. I know the neo pro in question in insanely talented, but I really can't imagine the same thing happening in the TDF.

 

[Ferminal]

I don't know much about all these numbers, but the Sky train didn't even catch a 21 year old neo pro, who had barely raced anything before, in his first season in Europe. I know the neo pro in question in insanely talented, but I really can't imagine the same thing happening in the TDF.

It means they went as fast as Sastre in July 2006.

 

[Parrulo]

what a bunch of nonsense joux plane+ avoriaz being too tought, god forbid us from a having a proper mountain stage at the tour. . . .

 

[jens_attacks]

It means they went as fast as Sastre in July 2006.

indeed.it wasn't quintana's fault for being so strong

nairo went 30 seconds faster than sastre '06.
that's very fast for a dauphine climb

honestly i would prefer the finish straight in morzine,no avoriaz.