Tour de France 2020 | Stage 15 (Lyon - Grand Colombier, 174.5 km)

[titan31]

I am so, so sorry for Higuita and I don't hold him responsible in any way, but I think it just happens, it does not help to punish Jungels.

It was a dangerous and reckless move, so much as like Sagan was punished, or Groenewegen was, Jungels should be.

Otherwise, might as well give carte blance for Oss to go and do the same to Bennett, and Rowe to do the same to Roglic

 

[Breezy1985]

That was dumb by Jungels. He should be punished.

 

[roundabout]

I am so, so sorry for Higuita and I don't hold him responsible in any way, but I think it just happens, it does not help to punish Jungels.

Some message should be sent that swerving across the road without being aware of the surroundings is not ok

 

[RedheadDane]

Jungels should be at least fined and relegated

Relagated to what position? Back of the group he finishes in? He could very well finish on his own. Or maybe he'll finish in the gruppetto, at which point I don't think he'll care much about being listed as having finished last there.

 

[TomLPC]

Carapaz chute

 

[Cance > TheRest]

CNN BREAKING NEWS: White supremacist assaults minority cyclist through mostly peaceful swerve

Are you trying to voice an opinion here, that is unrelated to the bike race or cycling in general?

 

[Pirazziattacks]

Jungels- life ban from the group ride. But it's racing so he won't suffer any serious consequences for his amateurish riding.

 

[Luthor]

What happened in the Carapaz crash? Eurosport kinda sucks with their transmissions.

 

[TomLPC]

Jungles public crucifixion.

It's the only way.

 

[TomLPC]

What happened in the Carapaz crash? Eurosport kinda sucks with their transmissions.

Touch of wheels with Hugo Hofstetter at the back

Lots of grimacing going on with both but back on the bike

 

[Savant12]

It was a racing incident. Not sure their was any malicious intent. Though, bit of bad move by Jungels not to put his hand up as an apology.

 

[Red Rick]

It was a racing incident. Not sure their was any malicious intent. Though, bit of bad move by Jungels not to put his hand up as an apology.

And that doesn't absolve everyone from blame.

 

[Libertine Seguros]

I thought that after the Groenewegen/Jakobsen incident we were supposed to be calling the UCI to police the bunch according to action rather than outcome, but this week we've seen a lot of people go out of their way to exonerate a rider for a dangerous action without a bad outcome, largely because they like him or because it is good for the race action to not punish him. Now we have a case where the action is similar but the outcome is worse, and apparently we're back to brandishing pitchforks.

 

[titan31]

It was a racing incident. Not sure their was any malicious intent. Though, bit of bad move by Jungels not to put his hand up as an apology.

Sagan and Groenewegen were racing incidents and there was no malicious intent tbf. They still deserved their punishment

 

[Nacho23]

Don't think that Jungels has to be punished.

I really hope that Higuita is ok and can race the WC.

 

[titan31]

I thought that after the Groenewegen/Jakobsen incident we were supposed to be calling the UCI to police the bunch according to action rather than outcome, but this week we've seen a lot of people go out of their way to exonerate a rider for a dangerous action without a bad outcome, largely because they like him or because it is good for the race action to not punish him. Now we have a case where the action is similar but the outcome is worse, and apparently we're back to brandishing pitchforks.

I think it's only natural. Like Kwiatowski and Roglic did same to Dumoulin and Pogacar. Uphill so lot slower speed so damage wasn't as bad. Jungels did it on a downhill section and speed was higher. All 3 were negligent imo but Jungels was the more dangerous move

 

[Cance > TheRest]

Trentin almost tasted his own medicine there.

 

[Kangaridoo]

Sagan and Groenewegen were racing incidents and there was no malicious intent tbf. They still deserved their punishment

Groenewegen and Sagan had much more culpa in their actions. Jungels was not cognitively aware of his action being an invasive action towards anyone which could possibly result in harm. So they in no way similar situations. What Jungels caused is an actual accident. What happened through Groenewegen was not.

 

[Salvarani]

45 points difference now Bennett vs Sagan

 

[Breezy1985]

We just had a sprint. Bennett takes 2 points more than Sagan.

Sorry for going off topic on the Bob Jungles thread

 

[titan31]

Groenewegen and Sagan had much more culpa in their actions. Jungels was not cognitively aware of his action being an invasive action towards anyone which could possibly result in harm. So they in no way similar situations. What Jungels caused is an actual accident. What happened through Groenewegen was not.

He should have been aware though. He cut across Higuita. Be like out if you're out driving and you overtake someone and then swing in too early. You're hoping the other driver realises in the split second that you're doing something dangerous and stops. You're still responsible if there's a crash

 

[ppanther92]

Is this really all Sagan can do? Constantly losing to Morkov...

 

[Keram]

Sagan seems hopeless against Bennet and QS. At first Bennet didnt let him to break and now they schooled him at sprint. This game is over.

 

[Red Rick]

Groenewegen and Sagan had much more culpa in their actions. Jungels was not cognitively aware of his action being an invasive action towards anyone which could possibly result in harm. So they in no way similar situations. What Jungels caused is an actual accident. What happened through Groenewegen was not.

it's an accident that doesn't happen if he looks where he's going.

 

[Cance > TheRest]

I thought that after the Groenewegen/Jakobsen incident we were supposed to be calling the UCI to police the bunch according to action rather than outcome, but this week we've seen a lot of people go out of their way to exonerate a rider for a dangerous action without a bad outcome, largely because they like him or because it is good for the race action to not punish him. Now we have a case where the action is similar but the outcome is worse, and apparently we're back to brandishing pitchforks.

This is your theory. Some people also go out of the way to judge a rider they do not like. It goes both ways, and there is no way we can escape our biases unless we are completely dispassionate about the riders. Luckily, this is not the case, as the debate would be potentially boring with only one correct opinion. Cycling is not a black and white sport - that is what makes it so great. Let's never pretend it is black and white for if we do, the magic will be lost.