Tour de France Tour de France 2022: Stage 8 (Dole – Lausanne, 186.3k)

[RobertCrawley]

then you use your team differently if you wan tot win the Tour
Like WVA attacks in last kms and gets Pog ot chase

there are many options but no its WVA win which is fine but not if you want to win the Tour

I'm pretty sure Mumbo Jumbo has not allowed Vinegar to face a puff of unnecessary headwind this entire Tour. They are a professional bike team and they know how to take care of their GC leader.

As others have said, the Tour is won in the big hills. We might learn a lot tomorrow.

 

[SafeBet]

I'm a big fan of Kron, but don't think he should be here, particularly with getting Covid just before. Seems like desperate/poor management by Lotto?

Kron after COVID is better than the majority of Lotto riders anyway.

 

[Sciatic]

In

Explain to me how Wout losing the bunch sprint helps Vigo?

In addition, if JV were only focused on Vingegaard, he probably would attacked a little early (knowing he can’t win the sprint), Pogacar would have gotten on his wheel and then swung past him before the line to take the stage win AND the time bonus. How does that work out better for JV? (Perhaps I can’t think of what other strategy they could have used).

 

[Valv.Piti]

Jumbo is literally the first team where a glorified stage hunter gets precedent over the potential winners.

A glorified stage hunter who just so happens to to be the best bike rider in the world (or maybe 2nd) who instantly would leave if you made him slave like half of the CN forum would make him want to. On top of that, you get the stage, you get a big lead for green, you keep Wout happy etc. which will only benefit Jumbo down the road this race. 4 seconds - who cares?

 

[ppanther92]

In 2016, he scored 242 more points than Kittel

I would say thats in reach for WvA

 

[Salvarani]

I just wonder how the likes of Kuss, Kruijswijk, Beenot and Van Hoydonck will hold up over three weeks. They have essentially had to protect and ridden for three leaders in the first week.

 

[tobydawq]

A glorified stage hunter who just so happens to to be the best bike rider in the world (or maybe 2nd) who instantly would leave if you made him slave like half of the CN forum would make him want to. On top of that, you get the stage, you get a big lead for green, you keep Wout happy etc. which will only benefit Jumbo down the road this race. 4 seconds - who cares?

He's a "lone Sanremo winner", don't you forget.

 

[KOM]

You're right I'm so embarrassed and hateful for thinking winning the Tour is more important than winning stages. My position has been nothing but consistent, and the only thing that's changed is Jumbo have proven my assumption wrong that they wouldn't sacrifice chances for the win for stages.

My point was the the "pog couldve taken 10 secs JUST as easily" which is ridiculous and frames the argument to fit your narrative

 

[Red Rick]

You're acting like this is a one-week race which will be decided exclusively on a short TT and an easy MTF.

No, I think that if you make winning the Tour your big white whale of the team for multiple years than you should do everything you can to win it. Now they're actively harming that goal.

It's very different if Roglic is expecting to beat Pog in a sprint and loses. It's also very different if Pogacar is not an uphill sprinter to go for these stage wins because then 2 goals do not contradict each other.

 

[Ilmaestro99]

A glorified stage hunter who just so happens to to be the best bike rider in the world (or maybe 2nd) who instantly would leave if you made him slave like half of the CN forum would make him want to. On top of that, you get the stage, you get a big lead for green, you keep Wout happy etc. which will only benefit Jumbo down the road this race. 4 seconds - who cares?

He won 1 monument and 0 wolrd championships and 0 grand tours in the last 4 years. He is not the best in the world.

But the rest of your post makes sense, actually you make a good point.

 

[ppanther92]

Jumbo is literally the first team where a glorified stage hunter gets precedent over the potential winners.

I agree in so far that every second CAN matter in the end.

But I don't agree in almost all the other points:
(i) Without WvA going for the win, it is more likely than not that Pogacar would have got even more bonus seconds today.
(ii) Without WvA GC is anyway "over" (ok, too much) for Vingegaard after the cobbles.
(iii) If Vingegaard/Roglic don't have great climbing legs in week 3 (still possible), WvA at least wins Green and stages (and there it is already debatable what gets remembered more - a 2nd on GC or Green and stage wins)
(iv) WvA is so far the absolute star of this TdF with Pogacar (naive to think this is not important to the team/sponsors)
(v) Letting WvA go for his goals (upon which he delivers) probably gets him more engaged in situations where he is needed (e.g. cobbles)

Btw., I think the whole "JV is doing so bad" is a beyond absurd discussion. Vingegaard is probably the best shielded rider so far. Never in the wind, always with support. What should Pogacar say with his team?

 

[Red Rick]

A glorified stage hunter who just so happens to to be the best bike rider in the world (or maybe 2nd) who instantly would leave if you made him slave like half of the CN forum would make him want to. On top of that, you get the stage, you get a big lead for green, you keep Wout happy etc. which will only benefit Jumbo down the road this race. 4 seconds - who cares?

Sure, and Cavendish was the best rider of 2009.

If you'd put Van Aert over a rider who's won 3 Grand Tours, a monument, and Olympic gold, a 2nd place in the Tour de France in addition to more GT stage wins and more wins overall in the same period then I'm not questioning if I am biased, and I'm also not really thinking I'm blinded by hatred.

 

[Extinction]

Tadej gave another show of strength and character.

 

[Didinho]

I like that climb and the finish, just needed a better medium mountain stage in the leadup. Boring stage like this.

That steep part missed Julian and (in normal form) Mathieu. This UAE tempo was ideal for Wout, easy win.

 

[RedheadDane]

He won 1 monument and 0 wolrd championships and 0 grand tours in the last 4 years. He is not the best in the world.

But still better than Masnada, who's at 0/0

 

[Bonimenier]

But still better than Masnada, who's at 0/0

Not better than the Belgian Spilak though

 

[Ilmaestro99]

But still better than Masnada, who's at 0/0

I know and it's very sad . Fausto is a good guy. But I never claimed he is the best rider of the world. Just a very good one

 

[Rackham]

I was thinking to myself, no way the Wout haters find a way to make this win somehow about Jumbo tactics, this was the obvious play since he’s the only one on the team faster than Pogi in such a finish…

I guess I should never be surprised on these forums.

Great win, he’s simply in another class than anyone else this year.

I wonder what Vingegaard fans are thinking. "Woohoo great! Now Jonas is further behind in GC because Van Hooydonck pulled all day to make WvA win the stage without concern for Pog grabbing more bonus seconds".

lol, what a sh*tshow.

 

[SafeBet]

I'm tempted to open a thread with all the nicknames for Van Aert

Belgian Pozzato
Belgian Potato (this is for our northern European friends)
Glorified stage hunter
Lone Sanremo winner

Anything else?

 

[Red Rick]

I'm tempted to open a thread with all the nicknames for Van Aert

Belgian Pozzato
Belgian Potato (this is for our northern European friends)
Glorified stage hunter
Lone Sanremo winner

Anything else?

55th best climber in the world, though I admit I forgot the exact number.

Also think of all the hypothetical top 5 rankings per year we can do

 

[stonerider]

Could've been 10 seconds just as easily.

Like they're straight up signaling that when Van Aerts and Vingegaards/Roglic' interests are at odds with each other they literally go for the inferior goal.

Wout is guaranteed win...Vingegaards/Roglic are always going to be 2nd tier to Pog. Smart to go for stage wins when your GC guys aren't going to win yellow.

 

[Bonimenier]

I wonder what Vingegaard fans are thinking. "Woohoo great! Now Jonas is further behind in GC because Van Hooydonck pulled all day to make WvA win the stage without concern for Pog grabbing more bonus seconds".

lol, what a sh*tshow.

I can only imagine how terrible the atmosphere will be at the dinner table tonight.

 

[stonerider]

Jumbo is literally the first team where a glorified stage hunter gets precedent over the potential winners.

They don't have potential GC winners at the Tour...they're always going to be playing for 2nd place to Pog.

 

[Rackham]

Sure, and Cavendish was the best rider of 2009.

If you'd put Van Aert over a rider who's won 3 Grand Tours, a monument, and Olympic gold, a 2nd place in the Tour de France in addition to more GT stage wins and more wins overall in the same period then I'm not questioning if I am biased, and I'm also not really thinking I'm blinded by hatred.

The mere mention of Roglic triggers some people really badly.

I mean what's the deal? Did Imola 2020 leave such a huge scar on so many people? I previously mentioned Vingegaard because he's the obviously best placed Jumbo rider in best condition to win the TdF, but Rogla man... what a tragedy.

Everything he's done for that team, all the wins, Grand Tours (something WvA can only dream of), & for what? To get dropped by his own team on the cobbles & then see green become the main objective in the TdF? Sucks.

 

[Red Rick]

The mere mention of Roglic triggers some people really badly.

I mean what's the deal? Did Imola 2020 leave such a huge scar on so many people? I previously mentioned Vingegaard because he's the obviously best placed Jumbo rider in best condition to win the TdF, but Rogla man... what a tragedy.

Everything he's done for that team, all the wins, Grand Tours (something WvA can only dream of), & for what? To get dropped by his own team on the cobbles & then see green become the main objective in the TdF? Sucks.

He Who Must Not Be Hyped