Tour de France Tour de France 2023, stage 2: Vitoria-Gasteiz - Donostia/San Sebastián, 208.9k

[Jacques (7 ch)]

KIJK. “Ik heb toch iets voor Wout gedaan?”: Vingegaard zich van geen kwaad bewust na veelbesproken finale

Hij is voor veel Belgische wielerfans een beetje de gebeten hond na de <a href="https://www.hln.be/tour-de-france/vloekende-van-aert-komt-net-te-laat-in-san-sebastian-lafay-wint-na-ultieme-uitval~a990c0f1/" target="_blank">tweede plaats</a> van <a...

www.hln.be

Vingegaard better pray Wout is of the same opinion and hope he doesn't blame him, because Vingegaard has played this very badly as far as being a leader goes.

Well, we know from football that the Dutch are good at fighting each other, but I’d say UAE’s greatest achievement over these two stages is to get JV well and truly rattled - over nothing much.

 

[yaco]

BTW, on WvA and MvdP, that many expected to dominate the first 4 days of the race.

I think we are seeing both start the Tour below their peak condition, in order to peak from the 2nd rest day and until Worlds is over.

Nah - If you studied the profiles of the first two stages MVDP was unlikely to make the finish while VWA had some chance - Which is fairly much what has happened.

 

[Samu Cuenca]

It wasn't that often that Valverde had a teammate they would be better off riding for (I know, Firenze, I know).

Salzburg, too, of course

 

[Unterlenkerfahrend]

Haha these takes here and in the media are getting ridiculous.
Belgian Pozatto has a whole team to babysit him and the best climber since Contador to police every attack on the climbs and that's somehow still not enough? If Vingegaard doesn't exist Pogi and the Yates bros sail off into distance and put a minute into his ugly red bull helmet. Don't give me that generational all rounder talent rubbish, we wouldn't even be talking about his chances these last two days if Vingegaard doesn't suck out the momentum of every attack.
Get this donkey in line and let him do some actual work for the captain - which is last years Tour de France winner. Jumbo got bigger fish to fry.

 

[yaco]

I guess there's absolutely 0 scenarios for them to lose then with about 17 riders from other teams there.

Reality is from like 2km onwards 3 different attacks might happen and Vingegaard can't close all 3 either.

Agree - I am surprised that another rider failed to latch onto Lafay when he attacked - Then it would have been a more comfortable victory.

 

[Andy schleck]

Jumbo obviously doesn’t have the confidence Vingegaard will drop Pogacar in the mountains with upping the pace when Pog stops to pee.

Can you explain that story? I didn't hear anything about that.

 

[nightowl]

Cycling fans are truly something else - will criticize Pogi for doing a couple 10 second sprints for bonis as wasting energy but then will also criticize Vingegaard for not doing hard pulls on the front for no gain while there’s 2 other teammates in the group who’s job it is to do that

 

[Red Rick]

I'm kinda surprised by how many think there's gonna be this huge fight within Jumbo. All that's happening is Van Aert is disappointed at getting 2nd, and media being full of ***.

 

[Rackham]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1675562100897333250

View: https://twitter.com/LeGruppetto/status/1675562100897333250

 

[ManicJack]

Cycling fans are truly something else - will criticize Pogi for doing a couple 10 second sprints for bonis as wasting energy but then will also criticize Vingegaard for not doing hard pulls on the front for no gain while there’s 2 other teammates in the group who’s job it is to do that

Pretty much sums it up perfectly.

 

[Samu Cuenca]

Can you explain that story? I didn't hear anything about that.

Mattias Skjelmose felt they had done it, while Matxin only saw it as being a normal fight for positions at the front of the peloton. Vingegaard, unsurprisingly, hadn't registered what was going on around him.

 

[Andy262]

You're aware these aren't photo's of them actually on the podium? It's a stock photo with the jersey superimposed: he was probably going for a bit of Gallic insouciance.

Yeah, sure it’s the weird green I was commenting on. It doesn’t stand out at all. Just why?

 

[bNator]

Cycling fans are truly something else - will criticize Pogi for doing a couple 10 second sprints for bonis as wasting energy but then will also criticize Vingegaard for not doing hard pulls on the front for no gain while there’s 2 other teammates in the group who’s job it is to do that

Borrowing an idea from another poster: it’s as if different people had different opinions about things…

 

[Salvarani]

Nothing better than a Rabofail orchestrated by Belgian Pozzato . I've been trying to explain to you all that he is a liability

You were always right about this. Glad that finally more people are seeing the light.

 

[Red Rick]

Grischa Nierman taking full responsibilty for the decision to not have Vingegaard pull

Grischa Niermann neemt verantwoordelijkheid voor keuze Vingegaard

Video Wout van Aert greep in de tweede etappe van de Tour de France net naast de ritzege. Victor Lafay plaatste in de laatste kilometer een succesvolle demarrage en bleef uit de greep van de sprintende meute, met voorop Van Aert. De renner van Jumbo-Visma wilde na de finish de pers niet te woord...

www.wielerflits.nl

 

[Oldermanish]

Agree - I am surprised that another rider failed to latch onto Lafay when he attacked - Then it would have been a more comfortable victory.

He had enough momentum when he passed the front guys none of them could respond without towing the rest. Typical brinksmanship; waiting for someone to begin the pursuit. By the time they counted "one....two..." to themselves the gap was too big.

 

[Oldermanish]

Grischa Nierman taking full responsibilty for the decision to not have Vingegaard pull

Grischa Niermann neemt verantwoordelijkheid voor keuze Vingegaard

Video Wout van Aert greep in de tweede etappe van de Tour de France net naast de ritzege. Victor Lafay plaatste in de laatste kilometer een succesvolle demarrage en bleef uit de greep van de sprintende meute, met voorop Van Aert. De renner van Jumbo-Visma wilde na de finish de pers niet te woord...

www.wielerflits.nl

Hell, Vingo himself should know not to pull unless doing a quick downhill spell. Oh wait, he covered his main rival Pogacar on the downhill...that's right.

 

[Salvarani]

Jumbo better sort out their tactics.

They want too much by the looks of things and that might hurt them in the end. The Belgians are doing their best to cause chaos as well.

We will see what happens next.

 

[frisenfruitig]

Does anyone actually believe Vingegaard didn't cooperate with Pogacar because he wanted to give Wva a chance? I'm sure that's what he was doing yesterday as well. What a load of bs

 

[Unterlenkerfahrend]

Does anyone actually believe Vingegaard didn't cooperate with Pogacar because he wanted to give Wva a chance? I'm sure that's what he was doing yesterday as well. What a load of bs

What other reason is there?

 

[Jagartrott]

Does anyone actually believe Vingegaard didn't cooperate with Pogacar because he wanted to give Wva a chance? I'm sure that's what he was doing yesterday as well. What a load of bs

It would have been smarter for him to say nothing, or at least not this to not further risk team disharmony. He needs his teammates, and Van Aert was instrumental for him last year. Maybe not the sharpest tool in the shed.

 

[Salvarani]

Actually, my main issue with Vingegaard is not that he didn't help Wout, it is that he never takes the lead, ever, unless he drops everyone. Another example is from the Roubaix stage last year where he didn't lift a finger to help himself out of his predicament but solely relied on his teammates. Afterward, he said some nonsense along the lines of "it would probably be better for me not to disturb my teammates in the work as they are more suited to riding on the flat". It's like it never even occurs to him to hit the front. I guess I just find it weird.

Have we ever seen him on an echelon stage?

Basically he needs baby-sitting and being told what to do. When to go etc.

He doesnt have the persona of a leader or hasnt developed any leadership qualities yet. Some people just doesnt have it, will ever have it, but are great at what they do or have a specific talent that make them stand out.

 

[SHAD0W93]

Can you explain that story? I didn't hear anything about that.

I was falling asleep throughout the Peacock stream but I think it was around KM 110 of the commentators talking of Pog going to pee and Jumbo upping the pace on the hill. @Boehmand mentioned it too.

Skjelmose saying in his post-stage interview, that there is a war on between Jumbo and UAE, and points to Jumbo raising the tempo on a hill today, when Pogacar had stopped to pee

 

[ManicJack]

What other reason is there?

Um....the two staying away and Pogacar getting a time gap and the bonus seconds for one....

 

[Volderke]

Don’t forget that there is a big chance WvA will leave the tour halfway if his second baby comes early, and in that case, he won’t be of the same value as last year.
WvA has had a slow year in terms of wins (Ghent-Wevelgem didn’t help), so he is desperate for some wins in the prime years of his career.
He is one of Jumbo’s team leaders and paid as such; he is supposed to win and he is the main marketing subject for the jumbo shops in Belgium. Saying that the GC is more important is, imho, what cycling fans think is most important, but not necessarily what jumbo management thinks is most important: after all, they already won the tour (and giro and vuelta), but they eg never won the worlds, some classics,… and Wva would be as valuable, if not more, for jumbo, if he can win those.