Tour de France Tour de France 2023, stage 7: Mont-de-Marsan - Bordeaux, 169.9k

[Trofonios]

Jonas: ""It has been quite an easy stage, with only one man going in the breakaway. It has been a bit long, but I’m happy with the heat. I like the heat. In last year’s stages, my best stages were the warmest ones. I am feeling better after every stage and my morale is quite high."

And this:

"Had you told me before the Tour de France that I was going to be in the lead after seven stages, with a 25” gap on Pogacar, I almost wouldn’t have believed it," says Vingegaard. "I feel satisfied and happy that I am already in the yellow jersey. It’s always better to be at the front than behind. And the stages that suit me better are still to come…"

Jonas playing mind games now?

 

[gunara]

I might as well say that the reason Petacchi, Cipollini, Cavendish, Greipel and Kittel were that great was because they just didn't have particularly good opposition.

Can you seriously deny they are bigger names than today's sprinters (so far), and some of them raced against and beat each other and some other big names?

 

[RobertCrawley]

And this:

"Had you told me before the Tour de France that I was going to be in the lead after seven stages, with a 25” gap on Pogacar, I almost wouldn’t have believed it," says Vingegaard. "I feel satisfied and happy that I am already in the yellow jersey. It’s always better to be at the front than behind. And the stages that suit me better are still to come…"

Jonas playing mind games now?

Sure some mind games yes. But Jonas is better in the heat, and Pogi is historically not as strong in the heat. If the mountains are hot, weather could be a major factor.

 

[Panda Claws]

Bunch sprinting is a bit like cross. The best of them leave to greener pastures (Boonen, Van der Poel)

 

[RobertCrawley]

The race commissaires should invite plaintiffs to a "Show me on the doll where the sprinter touched you" stage debriefing.

Tell that to Jacobsen after Poland.

 

[RobertCrawley]

La Figaro had some things to say about JtD drifting off his line:

Tour de France : Jasper Philipsen est-il un sprinter dangereux ?

LA QUESTION DU JOUR - Le roi des sprinters de ce Tour a empoché, ce vendredi à Bordeaux, sa 3e victoire d'étape. Avec une nouvelle manœuvre périlleuse.

www.lefigaro.fr

À Bordeaux (7e étape), le maillot vert a, une nouvelle fois suivi le sillage du véloce Van der Poel mais au moment de quitter le sillage de son équipier sur la gauche de la route, aspiré par des rivaux lancés à vive allure sur la droite de la route (notamment Cavendish et Girmay), il a progressivement quitté sa ligne, traversé la largeur de la chaussée pour finir par tasser l'Erythréen Biniam Girmay contraint de freiner son effort.

100% de réussite​

Jasper Philipsen, avec 100% de réussite domine les flèches du Tour mais il n'a, cette année, pas remporté de sprint limpide. Ce vendredi, il a clairement quitté sa ligne. Cela ne fait pas de lui un sprinter dangereux et cela n'a pas été relevé par les commissaires. Mais il joue avec le feu.

Google translate:

In Bordeaux (7th stage), the green jersey once again followed in the wake of the swift Van der Poel but when leaving the wake of his teammate on the left of the road, he was sucked up by rivals launched at high speed on the right of the road (in particular Cavendish and Girmay), he gradually left his line, crossed the width of the road to end up packing the Eritrean Biniam Girmay forced to slow down his effort.

100% success

Jasper Philipsen, with 100% success, dominates the arrows of the Tour but he has not won a clear sprint this year. This Friday, he clearly left his line. This does not make him a dangerous sprinter and this was not noted by the marshals. But he is playing with fire.

 

[tobydawq]

Cavendish still being able to match all of them bar Philipsen at 38 despite having a subpar leadout is a decent pointer...

Cavendish is literally one of the five names being named.

 

[Devil's Elbow]

Cavendish is literally one of the five names being named.

*Prime* Cavendish is one of the five names being named. Do you really think 38-year-old Cavendish is still of similar level to prime Cavendish?

 

[tobydawq]

Can you seriously deny they are bigger names than today's sprinters (so far), and some of them raced against and beat each other and some other big names?

No, but if you are in an era with a lot of equally matched sprinters with equally matched teams, they will necessarily take turns winning, thus making it impossible to reach the numbers of former great sprinters even if they had the same ability as those.

That is the situation we have now, yet Philipsen has won five Tour sprints in a row which should practically be an impossibility considering the 200 teams that have a sprinter they believe in and thus mix it up in the sprints. Meanwhile, he also casually got a podium in Paris-Roubaix.

Don't tell me that you believe that Philipsen would come up short if you dropped him into the 1990's peloton.

 

[tobydawq]

*Prime* Cavendish is one of the five names being named. Do you really think 38-year-old Cavendish is still of similar level to prime Cavendish?

No. But 36-year-old Cavendish looked decent (but okay, back then you could argue about a weak sprinting field).

 

[jono]

Philipsen has won 8 bunch sprints in UCI races this year, and finished 2nd twice (both to Jakobsen). I suppose you can have some reservations about the quality of competition, but there's no way to argue he isn't the dominant sprinter at present.

 

[Red Rick]

No. But 36-year-old Cavendish looked decent (but okay, back then you could argue about a weak sprinting field).

The beauty is that he beat Philipsen 4 times that year.

It's perfectly circular.

 

[Netserk]

His opposition is not meh, are you kidding me... Who else should be in this race to make the sprinting field better?

Merlier. Arguably Bennett and Kooij as well. And Van Aert could sprint more than once. If Jumbo did a full lead-out, they would out-muscle Alpecin.

 

[gunara]

No, but if you are in an era with a lot of equally matched sprinters with equally matched teams, they will necessarily take turns winning, thus making it impossible to reach the numbers of former great sprinters even if they had the same ability as those.

That is the situation we have now, yet Philipsen has won five Tour sprints in a row which should practically be an impossibility considering the 200 teams that have a sprinter they believe in and thus mix it up in the sprints. Meanwhile, he also casually got a podium in Paris-Roubaix.

Don't tell me that you believe that Philipsen would come up short if you dropped him into the 1990's peloton.

I'm not arguing about Philpsen's worth, in fact I'm a believer that if someone deserves to dominate this era, it's him. But I also believe - and of course a believe is always indicates insufficient evidence - that he's having less optimum rivalry than the mid 2010s field (with also guys like Sagan, Kristoff, Degenkolb, Demare, and Matthews at their prime, in addition to some you mentioned above), which I think is still a more comparable era of sprinting than the wild 1990s. Yes many teams today seem to have sprinter they believe can compete, but most of them are sprinters with various issues who are either past it or never consistent winner.

 

[tobydawq]

The beauty is that he beat Philipsen 4 times that year.

It's perfectly circular.

Yes, I thought about that but decided not to bring it as it wouldn't exactly further my cause.

Philipsen hadn't really broken through at that point, though.

 

[Netserk]

Cav here is like Petacchi in 2012. Well past his prime.

 

[Rackham]

La Figaro had some things to say about JtD drifting off his line:

Tour de France : Jasper Philipsen est-il un sprinter dangereux ?

LA QUESTION DU JOUR - Le roi des sprinters de ce Tour a empoché, ce vendredi à Bordeaux, sa 3e victoire d'étape. Avec une nouvelle manœuvre périlleuse.

www.lefigaro.fr

À Bordeaux (7e étape), le maillot vert a, une nouvelle fois suivi le sillage du véloce Van der Poel mais au moment de quitter le sillage de son équipier sur la gauche de la route, aspiré par des rivaux lancés à vive allure sur la droite de la route (notamment Cavendish et Girmay), il a progressivement quitté sa ligne, traversé la largeur de la chaussée pour finir par tasser l'Erythréen Biniam Girmay contraint de freiner son effort.

100% de réussite​

Jasper Philipsen, avec 100% de réussite domine les flèches du Tour mais il n'a, cette année, pas remporté de sprint limpide. Ce vendredi, il a clairement quitté sa ligne. Cela ne fait pas de lui un sprinter dangereux et cela n'a pas été relevé par les commissaires. Mais il joue avec le feu.

Google translate:

In Bordeaux (7th stage), the green jersey once again followed in the wake of the swift Van der Poel but when leaving the wake of his teammate on the left of the road, he was sucked up by rivals launched at high speed on the right of the road (in particular Cavendish and Girmay), he gradually left his line, crossed the width of the road to end up packing the Eritrean Biniam Girmay forced to slow down his effort.

100% success

Jasper Philipsen, with 100% success, dominates the arrows of the Tour but he has not won a clear sprint this year. This Friday, he clearly left his line. This does not make him a dangerous sprinter and this was not noted by the marshals. But he is playing with fire.

Call me cynical but I'm convinced most "polemics" in pro cycling (especially the Tour) are entirely self serving based on sponsor pressure for results. It means people in the sport will always complain about something when they don't win. Whether it's the stage profile or the behavior of their opponents (I'm just reading Intermaché's complaints about Philipsen on RMC, i.e. strong words, aka they're really publicly p*ssed off).

With regards to Philipsen's sprint, he clearly jumps over to grab Cav's wheel for the drafting before launching his winning burst of speed. That's about it really. And he's in front of Girmay the entire time.

 

[RobertCrawley]

Call me cynical but I'm convinced most "polemics" in pro cycling (especially the Tour) are entirely self serving based on sponsor pressure for results. It means people in the sport will always complain about something when they don't win. Whether it's the stage profile or the behavior of their opponents (I'm just reading Intermaché's complaints about Philipsen on RMC, i.e. strong words, aka they're really publicly p*ssed off).

With regards to Philipsen's sprint, he clearly jumps over to grab Cav's wheel for the drafting before launching his winning burst of speed. That's about it really. And he's in front of Girmay the entire time.

What is RMC?

 

[Valv.Piti]

Imagine going to the Tour with sprinters like Groenewegen and Jakobsen, especially Jakobsen. You build your team around him, he struggles in the mountains, and doesn't really deliver. Then your other superstar is way off his prime performances as well and he is essentially your only real rider in medium mountains/high mountains that you can rely on to do at least something of notice and not drop as one of the first guys in the breaks.

Long, long Tour for QS ahead.. just like last year, but at least they got 2 wins the 2 first days and then went MIA for 19 days. They need to go on the attack tomorrow with lots of other teams, because there are not many stages left as the transtional stages are simply too hard for everyone bar Alaf and the mountains.. well.

 

[Rackham]

What is RMC?

A sports site: https://rmcsport.bfmtv.com/cyclisme...res-le-sprint-a-bordeaux_AV-202307070721.html

 

[RobertCrawley]

A sports site: https://rmcsport.bfmtv.com/cyclisme...res-le-sprint-a-bordeaux_AV-202307070721.html

Thanks! I'm looking at it.

"une manœuvre polémique du vainqueur"

Mais, oui.

Intermarché really is angry.

They have to defend their guy. If it was my guy, I'd do the same.

 

[rallybanana]

Cavendish saying after the stage, he had a gear issues in the sprint, with his gear popping into a lighter gear when he stood up, twice.

British riders having a lot of equipment issues recently

 

[KZD]

Total dominance from Philipsen and Alpecin but like the Le Figaro article said, he is indeed playing with fire after his line deviation today that almost took out Girmay. Cavendish is coming closer from the record and while Girmay was unlucky today, he is looking fast and tomorrow will have a golden opportunity of making history.

On another note, Quick Step have been really bad during this Tour sure Jakobsen crashed but that doesn't excuse their sprint train being this bad.

 

[Krzysztof_O]

Cav so close to a historical win but then disaster struct.

 

[Danskebjerge]

Uno-X is obviously going for results, but being a minor team, I would expect them to put more effort into breakaways even on sprinter stages. Today, the excuse for leaving the breakaway was that it wasn't the intention to go with a breakaway, and that they would use the energy for the sprint instead. It seems exposure ("TV time") means little to them.