Tour de France Tour de France 2024 route rumours and announcements

[Red Rick]

I don't think so. Very few riders would abandon the Tour voluntarily.

With the Paris Olympics this close I think a lot of guys will consider it if the final 5 days are all mountain/GC days.

Which is all the more reason to do it.

 

[gavia88]

There could be, but that wouldn't fit with the rumours of the article in question.

Once again, this time not translated:

"Trois jours ou plus dans les Hautes-Alpes et l'Ubaye


Reste donc à imaginer le scénario: cela pourrait prendre cette forme par exemple


Mercredi 17 juillet : Une arrivée à Super-Dévoluy en provenance du pied du Mont ventoux?


Jeudi 18 juillet : Une étape Gap-Barcelonnette? Certains espèrent voir le Tour franchir pour la première fois le col de Moissières...


Vendredi 19 juillet : Une étape Embrun-Isola 2000 (ou Auron) via les cols de Vars et de Restefond/ la Bonette ?"

not everything make sense here. That means at least 5 GC days in a row. With Mont Ventoux before as they suggest in the article even 6 days. And risk of riders preparing for the olympics will leave early as well as riders that have nothing more to fight for. Besides Moissieres make no sense in a stage to Barcelonette.

So:

1. 17-07 Noyer + Super-Dévoluy, not super hard, but a nice final of the stage
18-07 Gap - Barcelonette (with the three colls, Allos, Champs, Cayolle)
19-07 transistion stage
20-07 Nice - Couillole
21-07 ITT

2. 17-07 Noyer + Super-Dévoluy, not super hard, but a nice final of the stage
18-07 Gap - Barcelonette as a transistion stage
19-07 Embrum - Aulon/Isola (Vars and Bonette)
20-07 Nice - Couillole
21-07 ITT

3. The super-devoluy stage is not at the end of the tour, but in the beginning.
stage 4: Mont-Cenis - Valloire/Vallmeir
stage 5: Briancon/Embrun - Super Devoluy

 

[Netserk]

You can have a non-mountain stage that will be a pure breakaway stage, but of high quality, by using the same roads as in P-N:

Isola > Biot

161.0 km, +2816 m. Bike ride in Roure, Provence-Alpes-Côte d'Azur

ridewithgps.com

 

[gavia88]

You can have a non-mountain stage that will be a pure breakaway stage, but of high quality, by using the same roads as in P-N:

Isola > Biot

161.0 km, +2816 m. Bike ride in Roure, Provence-Alpes-Côte d'Azur

ridewithgps.com

would be a good option to give all kind of riders a last chance of winning before the final weekend

 

[gavia88]

not everything make sense here. That means at least 5 GC days in a row. With Mont Ventoux before as they suggest in the article even 6 days. And risk of riders preparing for the olympics will leave early as well as riders that have nothing more to fight for. Besides Moissieres make no sense in a stage to Barcelonette.

So:

1. 17-07 Noyer + Super-Dévoluy, not super hard, but a nice final of the stage
18-07 Gap - Barcelonette (with the three colls, Allos, Champs, Cayolle)
19-07 transistion stage
20-07 Nice - Couillole
21-07 ITT

2. 17-07 Noyer + Super-Dévoluy, not super hard, but a nice final of the stage
18-07 Gap - Barcelonette as a transistion stage
19-07 Embrum - Aulon/Isola (Vars and Bonette)
20-07 Nice - Couillole
21-07 ITT

3. The super-devoluy stage is not at the end of the tour, but in the beginning.
stage 4: Mont-Cenis - Valloire/Vallmeir
stage 5: Briancon/Embrun - Super Devoluy

Is there actually space at the top of the Moutiere for a Granon style finish? Could be Vars, Bonette, Moutiere

 

[Ulle97]

Is there actually space at the top of the Moutiere for a Granon style finish? Could be Vars, Bonette, Moutiere

I don't know anything about the Moutiere climb...... afaik it has never been used in the Tour so I don't have anything to go on...... there are some on the forum here who have probably ridden the climb or nearby area.

 

[gavia88]

There could be, but that wouldn't fit with the rumours of the article in question.

Once again, this time not translated:

"Trois jours ou plus dans les Hautes-Alpes et l'Ubaye


Reste donc à imaginer le scénario: cela pourrait prendre cette forme par exemple


Mercredi 17 juillet : Une arrivée à Super-Dévoluy en provenance du pied du Mont ventoux?


Jeudi 18 juillet : Une étape Gap-Barcelonnette? Certains espèrent voir le Tour franchir pour la première fois le col de Moissières...


Vendredi 19 juillet : Une étape Embrun-Isola 2000 (ou Auron) via les cols de Vars et de Restefond/ la Bonette ?"

The col de Moissieres only makes sense actually in the stage to super devoluy, just before the col de Noyer. Not so much in a stage to Barcelonnettes

 

[Red Rick]

 

[ice&fire]

Is there actually space at the top of the Moutiere for a Granon style finish? Could be Vars, Bonette, Moutiere

It's on Google Street View. There's nothing like the parking at Granon. It looks like there's plenty of flattish or very shallow sloped but somewhat rough terrain at the side of the road until 200m before the summit, but I'm not sure if the wide angle lens perspective is deceiving me and that's not really usable

 

[Gigs_98]

Just because I went down that rabbit hole again, when do we expect La Tougnete to be included in a Tour route? And maybe more importantly, does anyone have any knowledge on when the Meribel side might be built and what the exact route might be? All the things you could play around with combining Loze and Tougnete have made my mouth water ever since I first heard about it.

 

[Red Rick]

Just because I went down that rabbit hole again, when do we expect La Tougnete to be included in a Tour route? And maybe more importantly, does anyone have any knowledge on when the Meribel side might be built and what the exact route might be? All the things you could play around with combining Loze and Tougnete have made my mouth water ever since I first heard about it.

Col de La Loze was in l'Avenir the year before IIRC? I feel we may see it used like that before we see it in the Tour.

It also had the benefit of of having the backside, Courchevel, paved already.

Plus I don't think they would introduce it without being the focal marketing point of the route.

 

[ChiefMasterPro]

Well, after the Tour visited Col de la Loze this year, the earliest we can expect a stage there is in 2025, yet more likely 2026. If this would be connected with the Tougnete, a Val Thorens MTF also seems improbable until then.

 

[Andy schleck]

Well, after the Tour visited Col de la Loze this year, the earliest we can expect a stage there is in 2025, yet more likely 2026. If this would be connected with the Tougnete, a Val Thorens MTF also seems improbable until then.

Personally, i'm more interested in a return to col du granon, even if tougnete is great.

 

[Ulle97]

Is Tougnete a hard climb........ distance and gradient wise??

 

[Red Rick]

Is Tougnete a hard climb........ distance and gradient wise??

This is the same as Val Thorens until Les Menuires. Must be noted that you can take a harder profile of Val Thorens for the first ~15km or whatever it is.

I think if you descend the other way they don't go all the way until 2410m but it's like 2360 so they take half of that huge ramp.

 

[Devil's Elbow]

Is Tougnete a hard climb........ distance and gradient wise??

It's basically Super Planche des Belles Filles on top of the first three-quarters of Val Thorens. So not far off Loze overall, but as an MTF it has the same issue as Super Planche des Belles Filles in that the brutal ramp to the line is a likely deterrent of earlier attacks.

 

[Red Rick]

Personally, i'm more interested in a return to col du granon, even if tougnete is great.

Granon is just a stage likely to be about the HC MTF. And there's a lot of good, hard climbs for that. Especially in the Alps.

 

[Escarabajo]

This is the same as Val Thorens until Les Menuires. Must be noted that you can take a harder profile of Val Thorens for the first ~15km or whatever it is.

I think if you descend the other way they don't go all the way until 2410m but it's like 2360 so they take half of that huge ramp.

That looks a lot harder than Val-Thorens. Group of riders will be reduced dramatically before they even touch the hard part. Just put in perspective that Pogacar was detached before they even got to the hard part in Loze.

 

[fbjim]

Here's something trendy that I hope they drop - these mixed semi-climb ITTs. The problem is that the riders who are good at them are just the GC guys anyway, so I think it doesn't really have much more effect than just exploding the time gaps that already exist, rather than give guys a chance to make up time. It's basically a "rich get richer" stage where the riders most likely to win are the ones most suited to them.


Flat ITTs are a different skill than "GC rider" so the results can be much more interesting.

 

[Andy schleck]

Here's something trendy that I hope they drop - these mixed semi-climb ITTs. The problem is that the riders who are good at them are just the GC guys anyway, so I think it doesn't really have much more effect than just exploding the time gaps that already exist, rather than give guys a chance to make up time. It's basically a "rich get richer" stage where the riders most likely to win are the ones most suited to them.


Flat ITTs are a different skill than "GC rider" so the results can be much more interesting.

If the TT was flat, the result would be the same.

 

[Gigs_98]

If the TT was flat, the result would be the same.

It might not be next year. It's not that I think Remco can challenge Pog and Vingo for an entire Tour, but I could definitely see him taking a lead if there is a proper flat TT.

 

[Gigs_98]

It's basically Super Planche des Belles Filles on top of the first three-quarters of Val Thorens. So not far off Loze overall, but as an MTF it has the same issue as Super Planche des Belles Filles in that the brutal ramp to the line is a likely deterrent of earlier attacks.

Well, I think it's a climb so hard that it couldn't help but create gaps larger than SPdBF. Those kind of rankings are always debatable but cyclingcols has this climb as their 2nd hardest in all of France, behind only Telegraphe+Galibier and in front of Col de la Loze. I think an entire km at 11%, at that altitude and after that much climbing could do enormous damage, even if there is an even steeper ramp still to come.

That said, I think the much more interesting question is what Tougnete East will eventually look like. That's gonna be another 1900m altitude gain climb with really steep ramps towards the end. For what we know it might be harder than the Col de la Loze, though I fear they will only connect Tougnete to Meribel Mottaret in which case the first 6 km starting from Meribel would be rather flat. But even then, Tougnete via Meribel, descending down to Les Menuires before another small climb up to Val Thorens either via the usual route or the new cycling road, would be a wet dream. It's what everyone always wants with the Col de la Loze, using it as the penultimate climb before an easier final climb, but so obvious even the ASO couldn't possibly ignore it.

And really, no matter how they'll end up using Loze and Tougnete together, it's gonna be an iconic combination of climbs for decades to come, and I'm simply looking forward to seeing it in action.

 

[roundabout]

If the TT was flat, the result would be the same.

The time differences would have been significantly smaller.

 

[Andy schleck]

The time differences would have been significantly smaller.

Probably van aert would lose 1 min and half instead of 2 min and 51 s, probably cavagna would lose 1 min and half, instead of 3 min, probably kung would lose 1 min instead of 3 min, but the winner would be the same. The gaps are too high and specially vingegaard and also pogacar can do very well in a flat TT.

 

[Andy schleck]

It might not be next year. It's not that I think Remco can challenge Pog and Vingo for an entire Tour, but I could definitely see him taking a lead if there is a proper flat TT.

Maybe with a TT in the first week he could gain a little advantage( and i have some doubts about that), but in the third week it would be very difficult.

Obviously during the year, remco is a better TTer than pogacar and vingegaard. During the tour, things are different.