Vuelta a Andalucia (Ruta Del Sol) 2.HC // 18.2 - 22.2

[Publicus]

First round was Contador's one, pretty clear! But Froome was also quite impressive. The way he managed to fight himself back within striking distance.

If Contador hasn't gone with 7 kilometres to go to take advantage of his gap, he wouldn't have distanced Froome imho! And if Froome has decided to follow up Contador instantly he would've blown up like Bardet and Edet did.

[Snip] !

Every indication is that you are absolutely wrong on this point.

EDIT: And I see taxus4a has his Froome-excuse-machine in full effect.

 

[Ataraxus]

First round was Contador's one, pretty clear! But Froome was also quite impressive. The way he managed to fight himself back within striking distance.

If Contador hasn't gone with 7 kilometres to go to take advantage of his gap, he wouldn't have distanced Froome imho! And if Froome has decided to follow up Contador instantly he would've blown up like Bardet and Edet did.

That proves actually that Froome isn't tactically weak at all anymore. He knows how he has to ride to avoid big damages. And as we saw at the Vuelta: He still has the instinct and the courage to attack and fight for the win. Even if he's not the best.

Regarding Contador, it's just an confirmation. He can adapt to a race situation and he has a fantastic race instinct. We know this since 2008 when he won The Giro and the Vuelta with two completely different racing styles.

Kennaugh impressed me. He looked very strong in first instance when he paced the bunch behind Contador. Did he payed that much for his effort later on or did he just eased down to finish 2.15 minutes down?

From my point of view Kennaugh has much more leader potential than waterboy Porte. Maybe he can get a chance at the Vuelta if he stays that strong.

Regarding the Tour: Froome is still the favorite. He showed today once again that against a 100% Contador he isn't that much weaker. No way Contador can handle to beat him if he already has the Giro in his legs. Unless of course Contador can put in a Fuente "Pantani be like" attack to crack him.

I don't see any other possibility Contador is fresh enough in July to be the Tour favorite , unless one we can't discuss here. Reference goes to Majka's super peak last year!

Pretty much agree with you, except the part of the 100% Contador. Nobody here knows at what percentage is Contador riding. To my mind he might be at 80-85%.

 

[staubsauger]

Yeah. It's more like they are both on equal level of about 85% right now. My mistake. But that makes the roundabout 2 minutes on anyone else even more impressive.

And Froome had his first pro win on Pe?a Cabarga. Since when does he prefer long, steady climbs? On peak shape he also has a nice little kick uphill!

 

[Taxus4a]

Ax-3 never happened.

Ax-3 wasn just after a long climb as Pailheres, a perfect climb for him, and almost 200 Km of stage.

Froome was clearly superior or his rivals that day, except Quintana that ataccked froom long and didnt lose much time (I consider he was similar). Ax 3 domaines anyway is an 8 km final, hard, but without very step sections. That stage suit quite well Froome, and it was hot, no so hot as when Lance, Ullrich, Zubeldia,.. but hot.

Purito had a crash the day before (or maybe 2 days before).

If that stage is croix de fer, Galibier, alp D huez, he could have put 3 minutes to his rivals, except Quintana if they dont use him to attack from far thinking in Valverde. Valverde hasnt his best day, we show in 2014 that he is not always a good reference, but anyway he was strong, 1:10 with Froome in his best day is not too much.

It is not a question of the route.

I am comparing Froome with Contador, Valverde, Purito,...if I compare him with Quintana or Nieve, it is the oposite.

 

[Coat-O]

Asked if he was in danger of hitting top form too early in the season, Contador replied that he did not think so, given he was, ?well over his usual race weight, so I was not at all sure of what I could do on this climb, it?s very tough when you?re not in top shape. So this has given me a lot of confidence, because I know there?s still a lot of room for improvement.

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/contadors-test-nets-first-win-of-the-season-in-vuelta-a-andalucia

Contador was just testing his legs according to himself. He still "overweight" and not in that good shape. I'm really fearing that TDF will be the "Ride of the Living Skeletons". An ultra-skinny Froome isn't exactly a pretty sight.

 

[Taxus4a]

Every indication is that you are absolutely wrong on this point.

EDIT: And I see taxus4a has his Froome-excuse-machine in full effect.

There is not any excuse, Contador was superb (not in his numbers of 2009, of course, but at the level of Horner in the Vuelta (and this is february, colder, more clothes and just begining), better that Nibali, Valverde , Purito there (although they said were tired, no as fresh as Horner).

Froome has the level he need thinking in le Tour, I just said this kind of stage suit perfect Contador and it is not the ideal for Froome.

 

[The_Juan]

[...]For me Froome was stronger than Alberto in ancares, but contador was at his wheel in the false flat 3-2 kms to the end, and in the last Km contador could drop him. The same story in farrapona, nobody attacked in San Lorenzo, and that way for Froome is not possible to drop Alberto, but to be at the wheel and to put 15 seconds at the end for me is not to be stronger.[...]

 

[Dr. Juice]

Yeah. It's more like they are both on equal level of about 85% right now. My mistake. But that makes the roundabout 2 minutes on anyone else even more impressive.

And Froome had his first pro win on Pe?a Cabarga. Since when does he prefer long, steady climbs? On peak shape he also has a nice little kick uphill!

Yeah, for me his attack on Pena Cabarga was at least as brutal as the one in the Dauphine. Keep in mind the gradients.

I looked again at the last 8 km. After the corner with that motorbike there wasn't a real gap. It was after that ...when Basso accelerated...that the guy in fifth position lost a couple of bike lenghts. Froome was in about 10-15 th position. He started the climb maybe 5 sec later. He simply chose to look at his powermeter instead of responding and did the climb in progression without looking at the others. He didn't even look at his own team mate.

Contador attacked the climb more aggresively and did the first half full gas to then manage the gap . I think that if Froome had responded it would have been a similar result to the Vuelta 2014 or well...similar to what it has been in the end. With Contador getting clear inside the last 1 - 2 km.
Science vs instinct.

It was beautiful to watch him attack that way. Payback to all those who complained about the Vuelta ( wheelsucking etc) when he had no need to attack early.

 

[The_Juan]

So... no hard feelings here B. U. T. it seems to me that Froome is on the defensive. His only choices now are either 1) go ballistic and drop Alberto, which he now knows does not work or 2) let Alberto go and ride tempo hoping Alberto tires out, which he also now knows does not work.

Either way he loses unless he does something else.

 

[Taxus4a]

I am watching the last 10 Km now, I show just the last 3 Km...why Kenaugh didnt help Froome at the begining? Saxo did very well in the descent and later Basso, Nieve is not explosive and he was at the back of the group.

When Froome got the group of kennaugh he was 32 seconds back from Contador and previulsly he was almost always againts the wind as Contador, and when Froome started the chase of Alberto he was at 40 second at 4 km to go, Froome was impresing in those las 4 kms, taking 21 seconds to Alberto, it was the team who didnt work really well.

 

[peloton]

What a great stage

Great team tactics from Tinkoff, was nice to see Basso blitz the field apart, even though I was worried Contador went too far out.

Sky's tactics on the other hand, why did Kennaugh (who looked great, btw) work when Froome wasn't even on his wheel, that cost Froome energy to get back to the chasing group.
And as much as I dislike the way Froome looks on the bike (and other things), gotta respect his attitude of not giving up and clawing his way back.

Tomorrow will be interesting, there must be some tired legs

 

[Kwibus]

Lots of biased posts again. It's annoying what theories people come up with just to give their rider the advantage over the other.

Contador beat Froome today with 19 seconds, but I've seem 2 very very strong riders that are really close and I'm really looking forward to their duels this year. I hope Contador will win those duels, but I doubt he will win them all.

 

[trevim]

It's so difficult to be a fan of Contador: I would have been miserable if he had lost to Froome, now I'm just worried he's peaking to soon

Great day for me with Valls winning in Oman as well!

 

[Jspear]

What a great stage

Great team tactics from Tinkoff, was nice to see Basso blitz the field apart, even though I was worried Contador went too far out.

Sky's tactics on the other hand, why did Kennaugh (who looked great, btw) work when Froome wasn't even on his wheel, that cost Froome energy to get back to the chasing group.
And as much as I dislike the way Froome looks on the bike (and other things), gotta respect his attitude of not giving up and clawing his way back.

Tomorrow will be interesting, there must be some tired legs

Yes. That seemed odd to me as well. They did the same thing in the Vuelta last year at times...the team plugging away with Froome off the back. But on the flip side I have to give it to Froome; once he did finally catch his own teammate he paced himself very well imo.

 

[staubsauger]

That's why I asked whether Kennaugh blowed up or took it easy once Froome had overtaken him. Because in first instance it looked like Kennaugh would be allowed to ride for himself. Weird that he didn't stuck on Bardet's wheel in that case. If he was about pulling the bunch I agree about the strange tactial strategy. Although Froome gave credits to his teammates publicly.

 

[Taxus4a]

Yes. That seemed odd to me as well. They did the same thing in the Vuelta last year at times...the team plugging away with Froome off the back. But on the flip side I have to give it to Froome; once he did finally catch his own teammate he paced himself very well imo.

Contador and Tinkoff showed today they are more clever and tactical than SKY. This is not track, this is route.

Sky waste anergu in stages like the twoo previous, with the wind, putting froome in the top 20 of flat stages, but that dont make the difference, today tinkoff put his team on the front in a good moment, I dont belive sky has not the legs (I dont mean Nieve, that is similar to basso anyway) , to put frpome always at the wheel of Contador. They must know how is the descent and how is the last corner before the climb, all of us could see that in the Vuelta, with Marzinski in the breakaway. And later, if Nieve is far, Kennaugh must be with Froome.

Of course this is just only a race in the begining of the season, but they show always the same stupid tactics, Contador and Tinkoff has showed much more inteligence on the road, and yes, I admire Contador for that, he is reallystrong is some kind of stages, but he dont impressed me for that, but for his optimitation and race view.

 

[sir fly]

Yes. That seemed odd to me as well. They did the same thing in the Vuelta last year at times...the team plugging away with Froome off the back. But on the flip side I have to give it to Froome; once he did finally catch his own teammate he paced himself very well imo.

Maybe they're not easing off, while Froome's letting, 'cause they can't handle pace changes.

 

[ray j willings]

Nice win for Bertie, Once again putting Froome and Sky on the back foot with some clever tactics and making it easy for the greatest rider of his generation.
Bertie looked well in control. Froome really only has one pace and bit of a dig at the end. The old days of Sky dominating shows just how weak the competition was. Last year Froome and Sky took a beating and this year will be the same. Fu%% knows how Wiggins ever won a tour .The worst tour winner ever. Long live Bertie with his flair and talent.
Just like to give a big shout to the Sky fans boys on the BR Forum

 

[Electress]

Nice win for Bertie, Once again putting Froome and Sky on the back foot with some clever tactics and making it easy for the greatest rider of his generation.
Bertie looked well in control. Froome really only has one pace and bit of a dig at the end. The old days of Sky dominating shows just how weak the competition was. Last year Froome and Sky took a beating and this year will be the same. Fu%% knows how Wiggins ever won a tour .The worst tour winner ever. Long live Bertie with his flair and talent.
Just like to give a big shout to the Sky fans boys on the BR Forum

So wish there was a 'like' button on here!

 

[Ataraxus]

Yeah. It's more like they are both on equal level of about 85% right now. My mistake. But that makes the roundabout 2 minutes on anyone else even more impressive.

And Froome had his first pro win on Pe?a Cabarga. Since when does he prefer long, steady climbs? On peak shape he also has a nice little kick uphill!

IMHO Froome is lagging in form with respect to Contador. An equal form would mean more or less Froome gaining 5-10sec in stage 1b.
Which i think would have resulted in a mano-a-mano today as well.
The most ideal medium of comparison between them was the Dauphine 14. Too bad it lasted only two days. And too bad we probably won't see them race in their best possible shape in 2015 as well.

 

[Angliru]

What a great stage

Great team tactics from Tinkoff, was nice to see Basso blitz the field apart, even though I was worried Contador went too far out.

Sky's tactics on the other hand, why did Kennaugh (who looked great, btw) work when Froome wasn't even on his wheel, that cost Froome energy to get back to the chasing group.
And as much as I dislike the way Froome looks on the bike (and other things), gotta respect his attitude of not giving up and clawing his way back.

Tomorrow will be interesting, there must be some tired legs

Contador mentioned that there was some interference that messed with his power meter making it difficult to get accurate readings. Maybe like last year at the Vuelta, Sky's radios weren't working and Kennaugh didn't know that Froome had been gapped-wasn't on his wheel. Seems odd though, I agree that they don't bother to take a glance behind considering what they experienced at the Vuelta.

 

[Bushman]

Contador mentioned that there was some interference that messed with his power meter making it difficult to get accurate readings. Maybe like last year at the Vuelta, Sky's radios weren't working and Kennaugh didn't know that Froome had been gapped-wasn't on his wheel. Seems odd though, I agree that they don't bother to take a glance behind considering what they experienced at the Vuelta.

That's what you get with riders used to riding purely on wattage and DS orders, a bunch of robots. I don't get how a professional rider like Kennaugh can just ride on and on and setting a brutal pace for more than a kilometre (can't remember exactly for how long) without making sure he had Froome in his wheel.

 

[Angliru]

That's what you get with riders used to riding purely on wattage and DS orders, a bunch of robots. I don't get how a professional rider like Kennaugh can just ride on and on and setting a brutal pace for more than a kilometre (can't remember exactly for how long) without making sure he had Froome in his wheel.

It's rather comical for it to happen again. Once is a mistake. Twice or more makes you question WTH is going on with their race tactics. You see leadouts for sprinters amongst the chaos of final km's of mass sprint, glancing back to make sure their sprint train is still intact or that their leader is still on the wheel. Puzzling.

 

[ray j willings]

IMHO Froome is lagging in form with respect to Contador. An equal form would mean more or less Froome gaining 5-10sec in stage 1b.
Which i think would have resulted in a mano-a-mano today as well.
The most ideal medium of comparison between them was the Dauphine 14. Too bad it lasted only two days. And too bad we probably won't see them race in their best possible shape in 2015 as well.[/QUOTE
.
A scientific analysis of wishful thinking.

Hers my own analysis. Bertie is King

 

[Ataraxus]

IMHO Froome is lagging in form with respect to Contador. An equal form would mean more or less Froome gaining 5-10sec in stage 1b.
Which i think would have resulted in a mano-a-mano today as well.
The most ideal medium of comparison between them was the Dauphine 14. Too bad it lasted only two days. And too bad we probably won't see them race in their best possible shape in 2015 as well.[/QUOTE
.
A scientific analysis of wishful thinking.

Hers my own analysis. Bertie is King

Hello Mr. Mindreader. Very bad analysis on the wishful thinking part
Very good statement on the king part. I agree with you.