Vuelta a España Vuelta a España 2020: Stage 7 (Vitoria-Gasteiz > Villanueva de Valdegovia, 159,7 km)

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Am I the only one who is suddenly reminded of stage 5 of the 2018 Paris-Nice? Cousin away with Politt, Cousin refused to work, in the end attacked and won. I don't seem to have noticed any indication that Cousin is super unpopular with everyone in the peloton...

I thought you would run him over.
He doesn't deserve to die. Just doesn't deserve any respect and sure as heck doesn't deserve "my rider" do any work if he won't.
Oh, come on! In the Vuelta you run your own rider over, and then he wins!
 
Am I the only one who is suddenly reminded of stage 5 of the 2018 Paris-Nice? Cousin away with Politt, Cousin refused to work, in the end attacked and won. I don't seem to have noticed any indication that Cousin is super unpopular with everyone in the peloton...
Naesen must be lucky they didn't catch Van der Poel on the queen stage of BinckBank Tour, otherwise nobody would ever work with him again! ;)
 
Johnny Hoogerland wasn't doing any work in that TdF stage, and the organizers just banged him out of the race with a car, there is a risk in what Woods is doing, I think from now on he should be looking over his shoulder in the peloton!
And when that plan didn't work - because Johnny just blatantly refused to give up - they quickly gave him (and Flecha, the innocent guy who got caught in the middle) the red number after the stage, just so it wouldn't be too obvious what they'd been trying.
 
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And when that plan didn't work - because Johnny just blatantly refused to give up - they quickly gave him (and Flecha, the innocent guy who got caught in the middle) the red number after the stage, just so it wouldn't be too obvious what they'd been trying.
And also to make it easier for their cars to spot them the next day, if they hadn't learned their lesson.
 
Nobody attacked on the final climb in the GC group? Hardly Roglic' fault.

And seriously the only day Roglic should've attacked in hindsight was Plateau de Glieres which was a tricky descent finish and 25 solo when the race was already in the bag barring an act of Vino. Maybe Marie Blanque but riders get incentivized not to because frigging bonus seconds. Peyresourde he got Poglstomped, same for Grand Colobmier. Dropped Poggers on Col de La Loze, did most of the work on Puy Marie. I

In my opinion Roglic gets a lot of backfitted criticism for riding boring while obviously the strongest in Tour de l'Ain and Dauphine than in the Tour, where the teams tactics were basically solid apart from one mountain stage.

Froome, in all his years of GT wins has barely made any attacks without simply having the goods, when the race was looong in the bag, or when forced to by circumstances. I remember like one dig on Col d'Izoard in 2017 but that's about it. Put peak Froome against Poggers or like 2009 Contador and see how aggressive he is.
:rolleyes: I don't know why I periodically Quixotically tilt at this assessment, but you don't know you have the goods unless you attack. We know Froome had the goods because he attacked. Before he attacked, no one knew. By the way, Froome attacked in the 2011 Vuelta and 2012 Tour that he didn't win on the road, and he attacked in the 2014 Vuelta only to get Contastomped, to use your lingo. I guess in your assessment, that gets covered by "forced to by circumstances?"
 
:rolleyes: I don't know why I periodically Quixotically tilt at this assessment, but you don't know you have the goods unless you attack. We know Froome had the goods because he attacked. Before he attacked, no one knew. By the way, Froome attacked in the 2011 Vuelta and 2012 Tour that he didn't win on the road, and he attacked in the 2014 Vuelta only to get Contastomped, to use your lingo. I guess in your assessment, that gets covered by "forced to by circumstances?"
100% because he had no other option.

The Tour was basically the equivalent of the 2017 Tour except Uran randomly putting a minute into Froome.
 
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For all we know Ineos told guys like Sosa to just knock it off and chill today too.
And that wouldn't make sense because if Carapaz had a mechanical problem, he would have only had one teammate (Amador, I believe) to pull him back in the final 15/20 km. The truth is this Vuelta is one of the most open Tours in recent times. Jumbo are definitely weaker than during the Tour, but Ineos aren't aren't that good either. They struggled to control the race today.

Whatever happens it'll be fun for the spectacle on TV that's for sure (starting with tomorrow's climb finish).
 
Great win by Woods. Well deserved. Gutsy: He took the chance of attacking in the uphill and rode alone for around 10K. And Smart: He covered the attacks and counter at the end. All while defending his teammate in the GC.

BTW, I think Valverde made a huge mistake attacking the breakaway with more than 50Kms to go. If I were in such position, it would have been better to rally Bennett, Elizonde, G. Martin (Nieve was alone) and get all teammates to work until the bottom of the last climb. That would have finished Ineos and put some strain on ICA and EF.
Instead, they barely won some seconds
 
Man, Sepp looks so easy climbing with Peters like he is out for a Sunday group ride... :tearsofjoy:
Great win by Woods. Well deserved. Gutsy: He took the chance of attacking in the uphill and rode alone for around 10K. And Smart: He covered the attacks and counter at the end. All while defending his teammate in the GC.

BTW, I think Valverde made a huge mistake attacking the breakaway with more than 50Kms to go. If I were in such position, it would have been better to rally Bennett, Elizonde, G. Martin (Nieve was alone) and get all teammates to work until the bottom of the last climb. That would have finished Ineos and put some strain on ICA and EF.
Instead, they barely won some seconds
Valverde gained 54 secs on leaders— is that your definition of “barely won some”?
 
I remember that one with Pollitt and Cousin, and I can tell you that was so blatant that spanish comentator Carlos de Andrés has mentioned more than once since then sometimes when Pollitt is on the spotlight.
About Woods, the truth is the guy is not a wheelsucker and even today wasnt a wheelsucker. More than that, the guy attacked, worked hard on the climb and close many attacks until the end. And I even say the man is a very attacking rider.
And Id add that when Valverde won Worlds, Woods did ALL the work on the last superhard climb, with Valverde all the way at his wheel.
 
TJV never rode today for Roglic to attack, it was clear for me during the stage the way Bennett and Kuss treated the stage. Kuss confirmed after the stage was ended that their intention was to gain time for Bennett.

Lots of headwind today, nobody from GC would've attacked given Amador's pace. At some point there was an attack when Ineos suddenly disappeared from the front and TJV was the front for a bit. We don't know what happened because today the cameras director was off.

But as always it has to be Roglic's fault. When no GC rider attacks it has to be Roglic who is to blame. This happened during TdF as well. Mas also had people in the front, even higher gap than Rog and no TT advantage for him to come.
He clearly needs to attack if he wants to win but I'm not gonna complain about it or starting to like Mas less. Valverde said at the end “I was up there in a possible support role, too, to see if any of my teammates [Mas and Soler] bridged across from the main group.”
Well I just assumed Valverde was riding in part for his own gc position so I thought Mas attacking would have been a shot in their own foot. If Valverde was really there for Mas, then sure, I'll criticize him as well.
Concerning Amador's pace though, it really didn't look that high and besides, you who could beat a single one domestique in a train battle? The two JV domestiques who were up front.

Anyway, don't want to claim not attacking today was a historically huge mistake or anything, it's just that I'm starting to think the attacks have to come at one point and I'm having my doubts there will ever be a better opportunity than today.
 
Great win by Woods. Well deserved. Gutsy: He took the chance of attacking in the uphill and rode alone for around 10K. And Smart: He covered the attacks and counter at the end. All while defending his teammate in the GC.

BTW, I think Valverde made a huge mistake attacking the breakaway with more than 50Kms to go. If I were in such position, it would have been better to rally Bennett, Elizonde, G. Martin (Nieve was alone) and get all teammates to work until the bottom of the last climb. That would have finished Ineos and put some strain on ICA and EF.
Instead, they barely won some seconds
No it wasn't. It was disgusting and totally undeserved. Woods is now a full blown wheel sucker, lost his reputation in the peloton and made enemies.
 
I remember that one with Pollitt and Cousin, and I can tell you that was so blatant that spanish comentator Carlos de Andrés has mentioned more than once since then sometimes when Pollitt is on the spotlight.
About Woods, the truth is the guy is not a wheelsucker and even today wasnt a wheelsucker. More than that, the guy attacked, worked hard on the climb and close many attacks until the end. And I even say the man is a very attacking rider.
And Id add that when Valverde won Worlds, Woods did ALL the work on the last superhard climb, with Valverde all the way at his wheel.
Bardet and Valverde did lot more work than Woods did in the 2018 Worlds. Woods is nothing more than a wheel sucker who can't win if works.

Valverde gained 54 secs on leaders— is that your definition of “barely won some”?
No. He wasted too much energy for literally nothing. He's been consistently losing 1 minute on mountain top finishes, so he'll lose that and possible more tomorrow due to wasting the energy he did today for literally nothing.

Well I just assumed Valverde was riding in part for his own gc position so I thought Mas attacking would have been a shot in their own foot. If Valverde was really there for Mas, then sure, I'll criticize him as well.
Concerning Amador's pace though, it really didn't look that high and besides, you who could beat a single one domestique in a train battle? The two JV domestiques who were up front.

Anyway, don't want to claim not attacking today was a historically huge mistake or anything, it's just that I'm starting to think the attacks have to come at one point and I'm having my doubts there will ever be a better opportunity than today.

From what Valverde said after the stage he was expecting Mas or Soler to attack and join him. He wasn't expecting to be racing for the stage win until neither of them showed up on the final climb. Also interestingly enough usually he'll congratulate a winner, but he not only didn't congratulate Woods he was semi critical of Woods, which is unusual for him. Obviously he didn't buy the BS Woods was spewing about can't work because of Carthy.
 
Woods was the fastest to the line. There was no bad luck for any other rider. He simply outsmarted them. He deserved the win.

The person who does the most work doesn't necessarily deserve the win
Because he REFUSED to work. If he had worked he obviously would have lost. He did NOT deserve the win. He did NO WORK AT ALL. Then came up with a BS excuse that no one believes. He earned the reputation today as a wheel sucker that can't win if he does any work.
 
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Because he REFUSED to work. If he had worked he obviously would have lost. He did NOT deserve the win. He did NO WORK AT ALL. Then came up with a BS excuse that no one believes. He earned the reputation today as a wheel sucker that can't win if he does any work.
Why would he work if that meant he would lose? It would have zero benefit.
He raced smart and did what was necessary to win.
 

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