Vuelta a España Vuelta a España 2023, stage 9: Cartagena - Collado de la Cruz de Caravaca, 184.5k

[Valv.Piti]

Yes, weather happens outdoors, which is why you can't always expect races to be held exactly like planned. Sometimes... you gotta improvise. Sometimes, the decision might later turn out to not be the best, but when decisions need to be made on the fly, stuff like that just happens.
I'm not saying that what happened today was the perfect solution, all I'm saying is that it was what happened, and let's jus get on with the racing.

Gosh, what nonsense. Its the second time in a row that the organizers have deemed (and be pressured to) neutralize a stage, yet it wasn't bad enough that the break and people who wanted to win the stage could actually go for it. Doesn't that tell you something? It tells me that it wasn't bad enough that these guy could ride, and if they could do that, so could everybody else. It should be really, really simple.

 

[RedheadDane]

Gosh, what nonsense. Its the second time in a row that the organizers have deemed (and be pressured to) neutralize a stage, yet it wasn't bad enough that the break and people who wanted to win the stage could actually go for it. Doesn't that tell you something? It tells me that it wasn't bad enough that these guy could ride, and if they could do that, so could everybody else. It should be really, really simple.

Yeah, they made a mistake. It happens...

 

[Valv.Piti]

Yeah, they made a mistake. It happens...

No, its not a one-off, its a trend and its a trend that potentially in the long run can kill cycling. At the very least, it will put lots and lots of people off. Watching neutralized racing, especially on the weekends, is possibly the worst advertisement for cycling.

 

[RedheadDane]

No, its not a one-off, its a trend and its a trend that potentially in the long run can kill cycling. At the very least, it will put lots and lots of people off. Watching neutralized racing, especially on the weekends, is possibly the worst advertisement for cycling.

When people think back at the 2023 Vuelta, do you think this is what they'll remember?

 

[Valv.Piti]

When people think back at the 2023 Vuelta, do you think this is what they'll remember?

What kind of question is that? Are you trying to legitimize the organization playing a major part in ruining 2-3 stages in the first week?

But yes, I do think lots of people (esp. on this forum) will look back on this monstrosity as a reminder of just how bad it can get. I know I will remember, just as the 2010 stage with Cancellara is often referenced, the Giro stage in 2020 etc.

 

[RedheadDane]

But yes, I do think lots of people (esp. on this forum) will look back on this monstrosity as a reminder of just how bad it can get. I know I will remember, just as the 2010 stage with Cancellara is often referenced, the Giro stage in 2020 etc.

Yeah, I have noticed that some people around here are stuck talking talking about stuff that happened long ago.

 

[Libertine Seguros]

Yeah, I have noticed that some people around here are stuck talking talking about stuff that happened long ago.

You just literally asked people to consider what they will remember.

You don't think the stuff that people remember from previous races plays a role in considering what people will remember from current races?

 

[staubsauger]

Yeah, I have noticed that some people around here are stuck talking talking about stuff that happened long ago.

And none of them is actually Karsten Migels of German Eurosport!

 

[RedheadDane]

You just literally asked people to consider what they will remember.

You don't think the stuff that people remember from previous races plays a role in considering what people will remember from current races?

A few people being stuck in the past is hardly an indicator of everyone.
Also, maybe... stop referring to it all the time, and will naturally forget it.

 

[Valv.Piti]

Yeah, I have noticed that some people around here are stuck talking talking about stuff that happened long ago.

How weird, in a place to discuss cycling, we also discuss races we watched years ago. Lol, what?..

 

[Salvarani]

I have a headache from reading the official results and the timings.

 

[Libertine Seguros]

A few people being stuck in the past is hardly an indicator of everyone.
Also, maybe... stop referring to it all the time, and will naturally forget it.

Those that do not learn from the past are doomed to repeat it.

 

[Salvarani]

Yeah, I have noticed that some people around here are stuck talking talking about stuff that happened long ago.

Excuse our good memory. I guess it is a good thing that we are not old enough that dementia has started to occur for us.

 

[RedheadDane]

How weird, in a place to discuss cycling, we also discuss races we watched years ago. Lol, what?..

But, why? There have been 1000s of racing-days since 2010, so why constantly bring bad stuff up?

Excuse our good memory. I guess it is a good thing that we are not old enough that dementia has started to occur for us.

I just don't see a point in remembering the less-than-great races.

And just to be clear, I do vaguely recall it, I just don't consider it worth spending time on.

 

[Valv.Piti]

I have a headache from reading the official results and the timings.

I have decided not to bother. I was sleeping, waking up when Almeida attacked, then I realized they would neutralize the last part when they stopped riding and immediately switched off. Really couldn't be arsed to look at results or even watch Kamna cross the line.

RHD: You also have a very, very weird definition of staying and living in the past. Referencing prior races, prior elections or and what not to try to predict and discuss something is very normal. I really do think you are in the minority here - people don't just forget stuff and go on with their lives, usually we remember stuff that have had a profound impact on us, whether our favorite rider won, lost or the organization completely lost it on this occasion. Thats.. just normal behavior. We then use these references to discuss future races and events, contrast and compare etc. For the life of me, I don't understand why thats weird.

 

[Netserk]

If only I had dementia so that I wasn't stuck in the past. What a liberation.

 

[RedheadDane]

RHD: You also have a very, very weird definition of staying and living in the past. Referencing prior races, prior elections or and what not to try to predict and discuss something is very normal. I really do think you are in the minority here - people don't just forget stuff and go on with their lives, usually we remember stuff that have had a profound impact on us, whether our favorite rider won, lost or the organization completely lost it on this occasion. Thats.. just normal behavior. We then use these references to discuss future races and events, contrast and compare etc.

None of the examples you cited had profound impact on me...

 

[Salvarani]

If only I had dementia so that I wasn't stuck in the past. What a liberation.

Ignorance is bliss they say.

And dementia is worse for those around them, than the person affected by it.

 

[Samu Cuenca]

I just don't see a point in remembering the less-than-great races.

So you've completely wiped out the bad editions of the Tour de Pologne from your memory? Or the Stig Broeckx crash? Or the car that got on to the race route in Paris-Nice? Or some obscure Michael Rasmussen quotes?

Fact is you're probably just as stuck in the past, but you simply remember different things than many other people do.

 

[Libertine Seguros]

Ignorance is bliss they say.

And dementia is worse for those around them, than the person affected by it.

 

[RedheadDane]

Ignorance is bliss they say.

And dementia is worse for those around them, than the person affected by it.

Aren't people with dementia often stuck in the past? Thinking they have to "go home to their parents", when in reality they live at a retirement home, and their parents are long-dead?
I wouldn't know, being a very young person.

So you've completely wiped out the bad editions of the Tour de Pologne from your memory? Or the Stig Broeckx crash? Or some obscure Michael Rasmussen quotes?

See, that's the kind of things that needs to not be repeated. Stages/races getting altered is significantly less problematic.

 

[Valv.Piti]

So we can only remember when people literally die or gets hurt very badly.

 

[gunara]

When people think back at the 2023 Vuelta, do you think this is what they'll remember?

My guess so far: an easy yes. It can improve itself in the remaining days, maybe it's going to turn into the greatest race ever. But it hasn't happened, and there's no guarantee it will, while all the stupidity have, on too many days, so for now: yes.

 

[Red Rick]

This thread has taken some turn.

Not for the better, but definitely a turn.

 

[RedheadDane]

So we can only remember when people literally die or gets hurt very badly.

Of course people can remember, but there's no need to act as if it "had some profound impact". Why would a random race result from 10+ years ago have had a profound impact?

My point was the people dying - or getting seriously injured - is something that needs to be done a lot of to make sure doesn't happen. Races getting slightly altered, really isn't such big deal.