Who is a clean rider

[TRDean]

How about Kenn van Hummel. I believe he is clean...fights for his results and does absolutely nothing to make anyone think he is juiced

 

[ElChingon]

I find it odd no one really cares, follows, knows about the supposed Clean Riders, not even the riders themselves. Insert doper in at any time and attention level goes through the roof.

If you're not doping you're just following the rules as you are supposed to do, its when the riders break the rules that is the problem.

All this BikePure rhetoric is like when they give trophies to kids for signing up for the peewee leagues. You're not supposed to break the rules that's the baseline.

 

[Von Mises]

Seriously. Hamilton says he'd be surprised if the percentage of doped riders in the peloton is less than 85%. I think he's being conservative.

And Hamilton also says that Cadel Evans is clean...

 

[xianbr]

Taylor Phinney and Steve Cummings

http://www.velonation.com/News/ID/1...etting-the-pill-culture-out-of-the-sport.aspx

 

[luckyboy]

RE: the 'clean era' and clean cycling..

Rode for Ireland at the Worlds ITT this year.


Also I don't think Cummings even has energy drink during races, only water.

 

[Catwhoorg]

Taylor Phinney and Steve Cummings

http://www.velonation.com/News/ID/1...etting-the-pill-culture-out-of-the-sport.aspx

Well said Phinney

 

[hiero2]

Just searched, and didn't find this linked anywhere in the forum.

It IS about clean riders, even if it isn't exactly data. I think you will find it interesting.

http://www.outsideonline.com/fitness....html?page=all

Waking a necro-thread, but the article is well worth reading.

 

[taiwan]

Well, Leipheimer and Vandevelde have been clean since 2006.

...but in all seriousness, Gustav Larsson, Danny Pate and Alex Kristoff come to mind.

Edit: reading his affidavit now, Levi didn't actually claim to be clean from 2006. But didn't he say something along the lines of cycling being clean for the last six years?

[heavily sarcastic response here]

 

[More Strides than Rides]

Top results are hard to read into as an indicator. I look for human vs non human consistency and resiliency. Clean riders get hurt, tired, and worn out and are then out of commission or under perform for a time. Or, they manage consistency through smart racing rather than brute power. Dirty riders are invincible and always on top of their game (even if their game is domestique-ing).

Credibility through teams and doctors matters, and so does outspokenness, but those are hard to use by in isolation

 

[BroDeal]

RE: the 'clean era' and clean cycling..

Rode for Ireland at the Worlds ITT this year.

Good to know the old TUE scam continues. No wonder Sky needed Lienders.

 

[Dear Wiggo]

Top results are hard to read into as an indicator. I look for human vs non human consistency and resiliency. Clean riders get hurt, tired, and worn out and are then out of commission or under perform for a time. Or, they manage consistency through smart racing rather than brute power. Dirty riders are invincible and always on top of their game (even if their game is domestique-ing).

Credibility through teams and doctors matters, and so does outspokenness, but those are hard to use by in isolation

I think this "does it look human" and the attributes associated with what does look human - getting hurt, tired, worn out, etc, is a very good point.

I would add that peaking used to be art + science, and rarely could you guarantee performance on the day, every day you wanted / needed it.

That was definitely changed with the last Olympics and certain riders seem to have no problem nailing "peak" perfectly. Or riding at 95% of their peak and beating all other riders' peaks in the process.

 

[rainman]

If you can pound out great ITT's when the course is flat but look pathetic every time you hit a speed bump like Phinney... yeah, I think that might be fairly clean.

How about a rider that can climb Galibier smiling but TT's carrying a rucksack full of bricks - Andy Schleck?

sorry Kurtinsk not robbing your quote just poor keyboard skills.

 

[Pentacycle]

If you can pound out great ITT's when the course is flat but look pathetic every time you hit a speed bump like Phinney... yeah, I think that might be fairly clean.

How about a rider that can climb Galibier smiling but TT's carrying a rucksack full of bricks - Andy Schleck?

Since when is Andy Schleck smiling on the bike? That's called grinta fyi.

Perhaps you should ask Riis what he gave Andy over the years.

 

[spalco]

If you can pound out great ITT's when the course is flat but look pathetic every time you hit a speed bump like Phinney... yeah, I think that might be fairly clean.

How about a rider that can climb Galibier smiling but TT's carrying a rucksack full of bricks - Andy Schleck?

sorry Kurtinsk not robbing your quote just poor keyboard skills.

It sounds reasonable on first glance that specialists are more credible than riders who are good at every aspect of cycling, but I'm not sure cycling history shows that hypothesis to be true. All sorts of cyclists have been caught doping in the past, leaders, domestiques, rouleurs, sprinters, TTers, climbers, etc.

I'm not sure you can draw any conclusions from that, but it would be interesting if someone could make a somewhat comprehensive list about that that is not just anecdotal, if some "disciplines" of cycling are dirtier than others. Personally, I have to admit I'm too lazy for that.

 

[diorgen]

Here's one I haven't seen yet....

No Body

Seriously. Hamilton says he'd be surprised if the percentage of doped riders in the peloton is less than 85%. I think he's being conservative.

I'd be shocked if anybody is clean.

Remember, these guys, naturally, are way closer in conditioning than any of your buddies are to you. They are the best of the best, in tip-top shape. The differences among them are relatively small. If one is doping and another is not, that tiny difference grows several times in magnitude. That means the clean rider can't even stay on the doped rider's wheel.

If we learned nothing else from Armstrong, it's that even with all of them doping, the one on the best doping program can still blow the other dopers away, with seven Tour wins in a row. That's how much doping matters.

Also, think about omerta. Now why would someone clean be part of that? Why wouldn't they be expressing outrage at all the doping right and left, complaining to the press, ratting out (anonymously) other riders, etc., etc.? The only explanation is because they are all in on it - they are all doping. Still. To this day. I'm convinced it is that bad. That's why they all can justify the doping so easily to themselves. Like Coyle says, in their minds, their own doping just makes it fair to compete with the cheaters.

I simply cannot imagine how anyone could hang on with these guys clean.

agree with this, anyone riding clean will then never be good enough to become a pro in my opinion.

 

[timmers]

agree with this, anyone riding clean will then never be good enough to become a pro in my opinion.

Do you ride/race with pro riders? Are you friends with any? If not then it's the same as saying all lawyers are bottom dwelling scum suckers! Some are but a lot ain't. As a caveat I know and ride with some pro's and the evidence I have seen suggests to me that a lot are clean. But then if clean is never having taken a draft after a puncture then who is?

 

[spalco]

Do you ride/race with pro riders? Are you friends with any? If not then it's the same as saying all lawyers are bottom dwelling scum suckers! Some are but a lot ain't. As a caveat I know and ride with some pro's and the evidence I have seen suggests to me that a lot are clean. But then if clean is never having taken a draft after a puncture then who is?

As far as the latter; no of course not, as much as people whinge about Cavendish or Cancellara doing that, that's just gamesmanship.

Regarding the first part though: Being a nice guy is no indicator of being clean for cyclists either unfortunately. I think diorgen's comment is nonsense, but yours doesn't prove anything either.

 

[peterst6906]

agree with this, anyone riding clean will then never be good enough to become a pro in my opinion.

Thankfully though, for the clean riders good enough to become and remain a pro, these opinions don't mean anything.

 

[diorgen]

Every rider is keeping their t:e ratio artificially high

 

[spalco]

Evidence please.

 

[Vino attacks everyone]

Kash, Iglinsky, Grivko, Kessiakoff, Nibali

 

[armchairclimber]

Kash, Iglinsky, Grivko, Kessiakoff, Nibali

Hmm. Speaking to a member of the BC set up who is clean and who is vehemently anti-doping. He said that he saw no evidence of a doping programme and no recent evidence of anyone doping off their own back.

Either he is a fibber (I doubt it very much), he's blind (definitely not) or there isn't much going on.

That's not to say that SKY are clean of course or anyone else, it just presents a different picture from the one Hamilton's 85% paints.
Also Ashenden made an estimate (IIRC) of 33% of teams still at it.

 

[86TDFWinner]

Is there such a thing nowadays? W/Wonderboy admitting it & tons of others, not sure who's currently clean and who isn't.

 

[Zam_Olyas]

Ivan Basso.

 

[melkemugg]

Thomas Voeckler