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Wiggins drama ending?

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Anonymous

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BroDeal said:
Bring on FLandis! If no one has a problem with Armstrong racing then no one should have a problem with FLandis racing.

It is a good time to get rid of Wiggins. After a ridiculous TdF course, his stock will never be higher. Next year he will stuggle to get into the top ten, and his value will plummet. There is a team willing to pay big bucks for him right now.

I reckon Lloyd Fandis is going to RadioShackAttack. It would be a good fit for him, ride the Vuelta or something like that.

Spot on with Wiggo. If he stays with Garmin, misses a top ten in the tour, DB will probably go, "well he's 30 yrs old now may as well focus on the young brits", He has to leave now if he wants some $$$
 
Mar 13, 2009
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Runitout said:
I remember him and Kinyah in the Cth Games Road Race for Kenya. Funny that he's now considered a Briton.

Kinyah was working hard in the break all day, but cracked when caught - Froome was in the peloton but lost a few minutes at the end. He ended up in the second or third group behind the winners. I don't remember any fireworks but it was a solid, workmanlike ride.
at 21yo then.

Walker was 20yo, finished in top15.

Cav was 20 also for IoM, was about 11th. George and the late Ryan Cox animated that race by memory, Matt Hayman followed wheels then threw down a big attack. Canucks not to be seen. Where was Heesjedal, making way on Phonak, think he came high up in Catalunya about the same time, before he offed to Healthnet.
 
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BergMann said:
Given their current roster, I seriously can't believe that ANYONE can keep a straight face at Sky's LUDICROUSLY pretentious goal of saying they are going to win the Tour. Ever! I know Brailsford needs to sell his project to sponsors & an "underserved" British cycling fanbase, but he should be honest: they put together a respectable classics team, and if all goes well, they might be as competitive as, say, a continental team like Cervelo.

Even if Astana falls apart at the seams & Sky gets Contador, they don't have a team to support him beyond the first week of the tour.
Look at their roster: they've got a handful of above-average stagehunters - and not a single mountain domestique who can climb as well as a Chris Horner, much less a Kloeden, Leipheimer, or F. Schleck.
Flecha & Arvesen have their best years behind them.
Froome? Froome who?
B.Hoagen has a great prologue & TT potential, but he's no 3 week tour contender. He sprints better than he climbs.
Lövkvist is wise enough to list the Ardennes as a realistic target next season, but beyond 5th at the TdSuisse, he has yet to show the sort of GC potential that would justify Brailsford's hubristic pretense to the podium at next year's tour.

Sky has a boatload of money, which may yet buy them Wiggins, but they do NOT have a Tour team.

Anyone read today's silly article on Sky's "innovative" management approach:
"win or you're fired." Brand new stuff - and it worked so well for Michael Ball at Rock Racing too.

disagree with about everything you said.

Lovkvist was second in Germany in '08. He is a fine talent. Froome has Landis like transformation potential. I can see him on the podium at the Tour. Arvesen is on the up, like Hincapie 5 years back. Always in the moves in races like Paris Tours, and now he can climb like a mtn goat. Flecha is about 31. So you have him wrong. Ogrady was about 33 before he won Roubaix. Frank Schleck is a joke without his gynecologist.
 
Jun 18, 2009
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blackcat said:
disagree with about everything you said.

Lovkvist was second in Germany in '08. He is a fine talent. Froome has Landis like transformation potential. I can see him on the podium at the Tour. Arvesen is on the up, like Hincapie 5 years back. Always in the moves in races like Paris Tours, and now he can climb like a mtn goat. Flecha is about 31. So you have him wrong. Ogrady was about 33 before he won Roubaix. Frank Schleck is a joke without his gynecologist.

I didn't realise Froome was so young back then.

The problem with picking talents is that one is never entirely sure how much talent they have bottled inside them. How much talent is natural, and how much comes from a good programme?

Ricco was doping by 16. So what do we make of late bloomers? (I guess it's a discussion best left to the clinic).

One certainty is that riders' carers are far more extended than they were. There are far more late-thirties age riders doing well than in former times. (Riders like Poupou are the obvious exceptions to prove the rule). So yes - Arveson, Wiggins, etc maybe just finding his niche! It makes it hard to pick how solid a team is before they race, however.
 
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pedaling squares said:
This is a good fit for everyone. Garmin can focus on VDV, who if healthy may be the better bet for the 2010 TDF. Besides, it's good for an American team to have an American star. Wiggins capitalizes on his '09 accomplishments at the perfect time, with a rich new team salivating at the thought of a British GC contender. I didn't like the way Wiggins went about it, but I guess you have to sell out a bit to get what you want.

im still confused what brad has done thats so wrong.. he did the one bbc interview where he mention in jest the wigan thing that backfired on him..

what else has brad actually said on the matter.. ???

hes never twittered on it, said very little to the press about it..

hes kept it private, behind closed doors, its just all been the press.. and on the whole its been the telegraph, almost every single story has originated there.. unless of course we are suggesting that brad is the telegraphs source..

in fact the latest "brad wants to leave" quotes are coming from JV.. makes me think the switch is about to happen and the garmin press effort is now going into making brad too bad..
 
Oct 29, 2009
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Mountain Goat said:
Sorry, by sub-par tour I meant that was because of the season injuries and what not. He rode darn well given his horribly unlucky season

I figured that's what you meant but wanted clarify.

By the way, love that quote from two and a half men....hilarious show.
 
Mar 17, 2009
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blackcat said:
disagree with about everything you said.
Lovkvist was second in Germany in '08. He is a fine talent. Froome has Landis like transformation potential. I can see him on the podium at the Tour. Arvesen is on the up, like Hincapie 5 years back. Always in the moves in races like Paris Tours, and now he can climb like a mtn goat. Flecha is about 31. So you have him wrong. Ogrady was about 33 before he won Roubaix. Frank Schleck is a joke without his gynecologist.

Come on, Jens Voigt has won the ToGermany - QED the race has little to no predictive value relative to Grand Tour contention. Lövkvist has class as a rider, but I'll believe his development curve has Tour podium potential when I see him win the Dauphine or TdSuisse in the presence of geniune Tour contenders.
As for Froome, let him win ONE meaningful race and then get back to me.
Arvesen? He's a 3rd tier sprinter, for god's sake. Anyone who has won 2 grand tour stages can be considered a successful stagehunter, but "climb like a goat"? Please. Go watch footage of this year's Tour: it was the two Sorensons pacing the Schleck bros onto the final climb. Arvesen? He DNSed in the 2nd week.
Flecha? Look at his biggest results: they're all 2-6 years back. He's still got what it takes to top-10 at Roubaix, but he's like Hincapie: eternal bridesmaid. He'll always get outwitted by someone smarter, or outkicked by someone stronger.
As for Schleck, suspicion of performance enhancement = joke, huh?
I guess the joke's on us for following this farce of a sport. Show me one man in the Tour top-10 who you believe is beyond suspicion, and I'll jog your memory of his memorable past "punchlines."

I don't blame the British for getting caught up in a whirlwind of nationalistic enthusiasm - I was once young and naive enough to get excited about American prospects like Julich, Hamilton, Landis, and a certain young Texan.
No amount of hype is going to transform a stable of one-day-racing clydesdales into grand tour thoroughbreds though.

I loved watching Wiggins & the "joker" factor he broght to this year's tour, but even if Sky gets him, let's remember the "transformations" of other prologue riders who got GC aspirations like McGee & Millar.
The fact that Wiggins is dim enough to diss the Garmin team that delivered him a 2-3 minute advantage in the TTT - the entire reason he was in the top 7 in the first place -- does not bode well for his tactical future on the bike, nor his political future within a team that won't let him go.
Garmin = Wigan?
Then Sky = LA Galaxy.
 
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Anonymous

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i need to make a file with the best of the "sky will do nothing" quotes and hold onto them for the "told you so" day. :D
 
As Maltiv says, Arvesen dropped out of the tour this year because he broke his collarbone. I remember watching that stage and he was a few metres off the back for the rest of the stage - i assume that he didnt want to have to risk a sharp braking maneouvre.

http://www.cyclingnews.com/races/96th-tour-de-france-gt/stage-10/results

Sounds like a tough cookie. He was also Saxobank's captain out on the road so sounds like he will have a lot of experience and quick thinking to pass onto the younger riders.
 
thehog said:

The ongoing soap opera surrounding the 2010 plans of Bradley Wiggins continued today with the confirmation from Thomas Lövkvist that Team Sky are in negotiations with the Briton.

Lövkvist, who is moving to Sky from Columbia HTC, will today meet up with his new team-mates in Manchester prior to spending several days together on their first official team camp.

Right now, he could not predict if Wiggins will be there. “I do not know,” he told the Nettavisen newspaper. “I do not know if things will be more clear when we arrive in Manchester. The only thing I know is that there are ongoing negotiations.”
 
Jun 28, 2009
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Do not see what Garmin really gives up if they let Wiggins go. I doubt he will finish fourth or higher at the tour again.
Principal, here they take a mediocre road cyclist (who was a good TTist) and turn him into a contender. The next thing they know he is trying to leave for bigger money while he is still under contract.
 
On the flip side, sounds like Sky is willing to pay top dollar (Euro?) for Wiggins. If I were Vaughters, I would negotiate the highest price and cut him loose. Seems to me that Garmin is really not shooting for a GT win with any of their current riders. Their best bet is to continue to show well at the Tour winning a stage or two with Farrar and having a guy like VDV high on the GC then focus on smaller stage races the rest of the year.
 
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Clemson Cycling said:
Principal, here they take a mediocre road cyclist (who was a good TTist) and turn him into a contender. The next thing they know he is trying to leave for bigger money while he is still under contract.

Well that's all well and good.

But it's kind of a situation baseball teams face when determining if they should trade a player before the trading deadline.

They can force Wiggins to ride out his contract. If they do... he'll leave at that point and they'll get nothing in return other then his results this year.

Or they can "trade" him for a boat load of cash now, but not have his services this season.

They need to determine if the results he'll bring this season outweigh the cash they'd get. With Astana/Contador... it's clear they would. He's the favorite for the TDF, and there isn't a dollar amount that surpasses that. Astana is completely right in not letting him go. With Garmin/Wiggins... you probably aren't talking about the same loss. Maybe a 4th or 5th place Tour finish. Still a great result... but there's a dollar amount that makes sense for Garmin to let him go... especially when VDV can put up nearly the same result (maybe 7th instead of 5th).


It would be different if there was any chance of keeping Wiggins after this year... but that seems very unlikely.
 
dimspace said:
i need to make a file with the best of the "sky will do nothing" quotes and hold onto them for the "told you so" day. :D

They will get wins but to be honest they don't have a GC team in my opinion. I think they'd be better sending a team capable of contesting stage victories rather than sacrificing everything to get wiggo top 10. They do have a good classics team, however, so maybe Brailsford is relying on that part of the season to make Mr Murdoch happy and slowly develop a tour team over the next few years.
 
Jul 23, 2009
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dimspace said:
im still confused what brad has done thats so wrong.. he did the one bbc interview where he mention in jest the wigan thing that backfired on him..

what else has brad actually said on the matter.. ???

hes never twittered on it, said very little to the press about it..

hes kept it private, behind closed doors, its just all been the press.. and on the whole its been the telegraph, almost every single story has originated there.. unless of course we are suggesting that brad is the telegraphs source..

in fact the latest "brad wants to leave" quotes are coming from JV.. makes me think the switch is about to happen and the garmin press effort is now going into making brad too bad..

Yes, that Wigan comment was what I was referring to. Wiggins had a fantastic tour, and all credit to him for that. VDV was not able to lead the team due to his prior injury, but gave his all for Wiggins. Wiggins rode very well for Garmin, in turn they have obviously done a lot to help him achieve his potential as a GC rider. This comment did not seem in jest to me, he qualified it by saying how his Tour performance had changed things. "Times have changed... we'll see what happens" doesn't seem like a man eager to honour the final year of his contract. Who knows what occurs behind closed doors, and I agree that Vaughters's comments are designed to make the team look as good as possible if they lose Wiggins. They are probably also meant for the ears of any other top riders whose 2010 plans are not finalized.

"It's a bit like trying to win the Champions League and to win the Champions League you go to Manchester United and I'm probably playing at Wigan at the moment. I'll probably have to make that step to do it," Wiggins told the BBC. He added: "I've had a good time this year at Garmin but times have changed. I don't know, the Tour changed everything for me really so we'll see what happens."
 
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pedaling squares said:
Yes, that Wigan comment was what I was referring to. Wiggins had a fantastic tour, and all credit to him for that. VDV was not able to lead the team due to his prior injury, but gave his all for Wiggins. Wiggins rode very well for Garmin, in turn they have obviously done a lot to help him achieve his potential as a GC rider. This comment did not seem in jest to me, he qualified it by saying how his Tour performance had changed things. "Times have changed... we'll see what happens" doesn't seem like a man eager to honour the final year of his contract. Who knows what occurs behind closed doors, and I agree that Vaughters's comments are designed to make the team look as good as possible if they lose Wiggins. They are probably also meant for the ears of any other top riders whose 2010 plans are not finalized.

"It's a bit like trying to win the Champions League and to win the Champions League you go to Manchester United and I'm probably playing at Wigan at the moment. I'll probably have to make that step to do it," Wiggins told the BBC. He added: "I've had a good time this year at Garmin but times have changed. I don't know, the Tour changed everything for me really so we'll see what happens."


you've also got to remember the majority of work wiggo did was with coaches/doctors who are now working with team sky-steve peters, shane sutton, the doctor whose name escapes me, etc. its a tricky situation. youve got to remember, its a big thing to be the lead rider for your national country (and brad is very proud to be british) first pro team. there have been no quotes from sky or wiggo really, its all been the press, although no one has denied it. but the speculation is nothing like football. in the summer, if you believed all speculation aston villa would have had a squad of 60 this year!
 
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**Uru** said:
On the flip side, sounds like Sky is willing to pay top dollar (Euro?) for Wiggins. If I were Vaughters, I would negotiate the highest price and cut him loose. Seems to me that Garmin is really not shooting for a GT win with any of their current riders. Their best bet is to continue to show well at the Tour winning a stage or two with Farrar and having a guy like VDV high on the GC then focus on smaller stage races the rest of the year.

+1. JV should take the money and run. Wiggo will have a harder time in next year's TdF anyway with no TTT, fewer overall TT kms, and more climbing.
 
Jul 23, 2009
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stefrees said:
you've also got to remember the majority of work wiggo did was with coaches/doctors who are now working with team sky-steve peters, shane sutton, the doctor whose name escapes me, etc. its a tricky situation. youve got to remember, its a big thing to be the lead rider for your national country (and brad is very proud to be british) first pro team. there have been no quotes from sky or wiggo really, its all been the press, although no one has denied it. but the speculation is nothing like football. in the summer, if you believed all speculation aston villa would have had a squad of 60 this year!

Yes, there has certainly been a huge amount of help from people who weren't wearing argyle. But none of the doctors helped Wiggins in the mountains or helped him ride up the standings during the TTT. Any rider who finishes top ten in the tour has to be pretty grateful to his team. Exception being Jan Ullrich in 2003, now there was a man who nearly did it on his own. Which leads back to your point about the doctors...
 
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Got to agree with most everyone here, wiggins will go and thats the best thing for most everyone. Garmin gets the money for a buy out, loses a top 5 chance (but still has one), wiggins gets more money and a team (in all respects) that won't hurt his GT aspirations, and Sky get the best current British GT rider. He won't win, but Brailsford has given himself 5 years, and there are talents to develop for 5 years down the track.

The downside is all this annoying posturing, but its necessary to make sure everyone gets the best deal.

The interview, brad was trying to be funny and was insulting instead, I'm sure he had good intentions.
 

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