Will Contador Be Juiced Up Again Upon His Return

[Parrulo]

i don't know what you are at with that last post but ok . . .

an example for you, why was the last week of the 2011 tour so interesting and why were the mountain stages so open?

because no team was capable of controlling the race.

why was gardeccia the best stage in years? because saxo wasn't strong enough to control the race.

why was the tour so boring last year? because sky was so unbelievably strong that they controlled the race at will and even had men to spare.

put sky on the gardeccia stage it would have been a 6k uphill sprint on val di fassa. Put sky on the galibier stage and andy schleck would have been brought back easily without wiggins even having to work

 

[Lanark]

Give that man a juicy steak. This was a bit sad.

 

[Vino attacks everyone]

i don't know what you are at with that last post but ok . . .

an example for you, why was the last week of the 2011 tour so interesting and why were the mountain stages so open?

because no team was capable of controlling the race.

why was gardeccia the best stage in years? because saxo wasn't strong enough to control the race.

why was the tour so boring last year? because sky was so unbelievably strong that they controlled the race at will and even had men to spare.

put sky on the gardeccia stage it would have been a 6k uphill sprint on val di fassa. Put sky on the galibier stage and andy schleck would have been brought back easily without wiggins even having to work

Why is there only AC that is attacking from far out? because of........
Fact is if there where a little bit more drugs, i could watch this race and have high hopes that attacks from 8km ++ could stay in. I cant do that now can I?

 

[hrotha]

Why is there only AC that is attacking from far out? because of........
Fact is if there where a little bit more drugs, i could watch this race and have high hopes that attacks from 8km ++ could stay in. I cant do that now can I?

This has been debunked countless times already.

With the spread of scientific doping, cycling has only become MORE conservative, not less. Even in the days of Indurain people complained that the riders didn't attack enough, compared to cycling before the 90s, and it's only gone downhill since then.

 

[Miburo]

Why is there only AC that is attacking from far out? because of........
Fact is if there where a little bit more drugs, i could watch this race and have high hopes that attacks from 8km ++ could stay in. I cant do that now can I?

lol i like it

Drugs are no good though but your argument is funny

Then again which rider did a long range attack on armstrong in the tour during 99 and 05 and succeeded?

I can only remember Pantani. Maybe vino in 2003? not sure

 

[Vino attacks everyone]

lol i like it

Drugs are no good though but your argument is funny

Then again which rider did a long range attack on armstrong in the tour during 99 and 05 and succeeded?

I can only remember Pantani. Maybe vino in 2003? not sure

The point was not exactly 50km long attacks. You need a AC or pantani for that. But Ullrich, Armstrong, Vino, Mayo, Mancebo, Beloki all tried and often succseded with attacks from 6-8km long attacks in one way or another. Not like this UK freaking borefest.

 

[Miburo]

The point was not exactly 50km long attacks. You need a AC or pantani for that. But Ullrich, Armstrong, Vino, Mayo, Mancebo, Beloki all tried and often succseded with attacks from 6-8km long attacks in one way or another. Not like this UK freaking borefest.

The only time they succeeded was in 2003. When else?

I can only remember that besides that year ullrich cracked armstrong one time but it wasn't so bad.

 

[Parrulo]

and here we go again, were they attacking from further away because they were doped or because no other guy had team mates left to close the gap?

just like hrotha said, this has been debunked so many times it's not even funny anymore. . .

sky controlled the tour for 2 weeks with 8 man 1 being cavendish and the other his joke body for mountain stages. . .

anyway back to contador.

what i don't understand is, assuming he will be on the program in july and was last August/September, why is he so bad right now?

is he afraid of being caught, because if he is afraid of being caught now in july it will be even harder to get away with it. . . . or is he simply planing some sort of super program à lá tour 2009/giro 2011?

 

[Vino attacks everyone]

and here we go again, were they attacking from further away because they were doped or because no other guy had team mates left to close the gap?

just like hrotha said, this has been debunked so many times it's not even funny anymore. . .

sky controlled the tour for 2 weeks with 8 man 1 being cavendish and the other his joke body for mountain stages. . .

anyway back to contador.

what i don't understand is, assuming he will be on the program in july and was last August/September, why is he so bad right now?

is he afraid of being caught, because if he is afraid of being caught now in july it will be even harder to get away with it. . . . or is he simply planing some sort of super program à lá tour 2009/giro 2011?

why would he be afraid? He can just look at the Sky train and see that he can do whatever he likes. It is not like he is not protected by some spansih federation like Sky is protected by the british in some way or another

 

[Vino attacks everyone]

The only time they succeeded was in 2003. When else?

I can only remember that besides that year ullrich cracked armstrong one time but it wasn't so bad.

Sorry succeed is perhaps the wrong word. It is more that Armstrong rarely had 3 guys infront of him while only 5 of his rivals is left on his wheel

but enough about that

 

[sniper]

contador is one of the most talented riders vaughters ever saw.
the cleaner the peloton, the more dominant contador should be.

 

[blackcat]

really silly thread.

see Floyds results in New Zealands Tour of Southland.


no dope

grupetto

 

[Parrulo]

contador is one of the most talented riders vaughters ever saw.
the cleaner the peloton, the more dominant contador should be.

however is the peloton clean at the moment? you can't go to sky thread and call sky dopers and then come here saying that contador has no talent because the peloton is cleaner and he isn't winning anymore.

 

[sniper]

however is the peloton clean at the moment? you can't go to sky thread and call sky dopers and then come here saying that contador has no talent because the peloton is cleaner and he isn't winning anymore.

i do agree.
my (slightly simplistic) point was: either contador doesn't have the talent vaughters attributes to him, or the peloton isn't as clean as vaughters says it is. which ever ioption you choose, it goes to show that vaughters is full of it.

to be sure, i personally do think Dertie is among the most talented. perhaps he's going to peak later.

 

[Parrulo]

i agree.
either contador doesn't have the talent vaughters attributes to him, or the peloton isn't as clean as vaughters says it is. which ever ioption you choose, it goes to show that vaughters is full of it.

with this i can agree

 

[blackcat]

i do agree.
my (slightly simplistic) point was: either contador doesn't have the talent vaughters attributes to him, or the peloton isn't as clean as vaughters says it is. which ever ioption you choose, it goes to show that vaughters is full of it.

to be sure, i personally do think Dertie is among the most talented. perhaps he's going to peak later.

so is Hesjdal, he is going for a top 5 in July, or a podium at a stretch

who knew he was so talented? only jonny vee

 

[ElChingon]

Does anyone still honestly belive that a clean peloton is better than an juiced one (or whatever this is)? JRod is the new long distance attacker.

Doping tests ruined my sport

Better how and better for who/whom?

 

[airstream]

Sorry succeed is perhaps the wrong word. It is more that Armstrong rarely had 3 guys infront of him while only 5 of his rivals is left on his wheel

but enough about that

Armstrong's train of 2002 and 2004 at least was much stronger than what we've seen today. When the train will flip Contador, Nibali and others, we will be able to do a more precise comparison.

 

[Pentacycle]

Armstrong's train of 2002 and 2004 at least was much stronger than what we've seen today. When the train will flip Contador, Nibali and others, we will be able to do a more precise comparison.

But it's impossible to get a train at that level in current cycling, because it would require some more serious doping violations and bribing to achieve it. For the level of cleanliness we're seeing now this is the best dominance you can get.

 

[airstream]

But it's impossible to get a train at that level in current cycling, because it would require some more serious doping violations and bribing to achieve it. For the level of cleanliness we're seeing now this is the best dominance you can get.

Honestly I don't know. Say, Levi said that according his info 95% of peloton used doping in the TdF in the beginning of 2000's. If domination could be in an extremely dirty peloton, I don't understand why it is impossible in the peloton which became cleaner to a certain extent (one'd like to hope). Yes, distribution of doping was always different and some teams always have doping edge, but it is difficult to judge about that.

If I had understood that others are clean and Sky win because of doping, I would have hated them. But others use it too. So doping here and doping there. I handle them neutrally.

 

[peterst6906]

... For the level of cleanliness we're seeing now...

What level would that be? Not much evidence of cleanliness at the moment (or rather,there is a lot to show and suggest continued widespread doping in the pro tour).

 

[Pentacycle]

Honestly I don't know. Say, Levi said that according his info 95% of peloton used doping in the TdF in the beginning of 2000's. If domination could be in an extremely dirty peloton, I don't understand why it is impossible in the peloton which became cleaner to a certain extent (one'd like to hope). Yes, distribution of doping was always different and some teams always have doping edge, but it is difficult to judge about that.

If I had understood that others are clean and Sky win because of doping, I would have hated them. But others use it too. So doping here and doping there. I handle them neutrally.

Ok, I see your point, but I meant putting a train together that has the same max speed as USP had. But it's now very likely that some teams have a more advanced system, causing them to dominate.

Judging about doping is very difficult, although some teams make themselves a better target by saying they're the prime example of teams winning big races clean. Firing a certain suspicious doctor a few months after winning le Tour. There's no such thing as equality in doping between teams. For example Saxo have gone down seriously concerning the use of PED's. Kreuziger, Contador, Rogers, they're not at all on their best levels yet, which would be expected when they ride for Riis.

What level would that be? Not much evidence of cleanliness at the moment (or rather,there is a lot to show and suggest continued widespread doping in the pro tour).

The avg. power has gone down over the last few years, that's a widely accepted conclusion. The way doping is used has changed, but of course it's not clean at all out there. What I meant was we probably won't see speeds like in the early 2000's.

 

[peterst6906]

The avg. power has gone down over the last few years, that's a widely accepted conclusion. The way doping is used has changed, but of course it's not clean at all out there. What I meant was we probably won't see speeds like in the early 2000's.

Yeah, fair summary.

What I am concerned about at the moment, is that with Sky looking to head for a second dominant year (whether clean or doped), other riders may be tempted to increase the doping again to bridge the gap.

Could be an end to the 'truce' that apparently occurred in 2006.

Winners don't like to be losers for long.

As a result, Contador may be one of the first tempted (if not already across that line).

 

[Franklin]

Could be an end to the 'truce' that apparently occurred in 2006.

There never was a truce, or did you forget Ricco, Rasmussen, Mencov etc.

And these guys were bowled over in the TdF in those years by people who are still winning now.

It's amazing isn't it? And yet somehow a clean angelic team descends from the Pico del Teide and just clobbers these riders.

Some would say that warrants a lot of scrutiny

 

[Parrot23]

Bertie is still racing as if he's still on a full program (burning matches that don't stick). Don't mean to be rude, but this guy doesn't t exactly have a lot of lightbulbs on at the moment in the grey tissue. How long does it take for his brain to adjust? It's been a few years now. How long does it take?

He's a great rider obviously, and is worshipped and given a complete free pass (all of this garbage about the "return of the king", etc., after his banning) by those who justifiably hated Lance and who now also hate Sky right now, but the above is just calling a spade a spade.