Will Contador Be Juiced Up Again Upon His Return

[BYOP88]

I got upset

I'm pretty sure no one is shocked or surprised by that!

 

[vedrafjord]

I'm not even a Bertie fan but what a piece of **** this kimmage is. This self righteous kimmage is a confessed doper himself.
Too bad for him he couldn't make it in the pro peloton and has nowhere near the talent of contador.
Kimmages mother should have told him not to cheat too.

I'm definitely not a Paul Kimmage fanboy. If I had a cycling team and he asked me could he be 'embedded' in the team for the 3 weeks of the Tour de France, I'd tell him to eff off, as I know I'd end up punching him in the face before we even got to the mountains.

Your comment is the definition of ad hominem low blows, though. Yes, he's a confessed doper (of speed and caffeine, schoolboy stuff more or less). And he walked away and came clean about what he did, of his own volition, not because he was caught or named by others, vs. almost every other doper who's belatedly earned our respect like Floyd, Tyler, etc.

As for the talent comment, who cares? If he'd never thrown his leg over a bike in his life, would you have made the same observation? If he's not talented enough to ask the hard questions, are you? He was good enough to finish in the top ten of a TdF stage, better than 99.99% of competitive cyclists. If the peloton was more like Kimmage and less like Contador, we'd know who was actually talented and who was just a good responder.

 

[Granville57]

This self righteous kimmage is a confessed doper himself.

Yes. See the difference there?

Too bad for him he couldn't make it in the pro peloton

"Make it"? Um, well, he was in the pro peloton, rode the Tour, Worlds, etc, so...

...and has nowhere near the talent of contador.

Nobody seems to even know what Contador's true, clean, "talent" even is. If you're referring to "results," well then yeah. Safe to say that not many riders in the history of the sport would compare.


My personal take is that Kimmage's remark loses a few points for dragging Alberto's mom into the fray.

 

[The Hitch]

Eh its absolutely a fair comment from Kimmage. Why on earth would it not be

Contador has cheated.
So Kimmage calls him a cheater, (which he is), which very few people have actually done, certainly since his comeback. Even most of the people who were crying about Ricco ruining cycling, have no problem with Contador.

Kimmage didn't do or say anything past that.

That's the price Contador pays for cheating and getting caught.

This isn't ****ing pre school. Wah, teacher teacher, he called me a liar. People need to man up here. The cycling world is full of liars and unsavoury characters, many of whom Contador has sided with and befriended if he isn't one himself, and someone calling you a cheater when you are one, is not something to complain about.

Anyone who takes that decision to cheat, is risking having anti doping people like Kimmage hate them, and call them cheaters to their face.

Its a sad reality for Contador fans to face, I know, but since Clenbuterol, it is what it is, and they really need to move on because the world doesn't stop.

I have more time for Contador than I have for most current cyclists, but the man has some big flaws, and on this in particular, he is not defendable, and certainly not above getting the occasional cry of "cheater".

 

[RobbieCanuck]

Eh its absolutely a fair comment from Kimmage. Why on earth would it not be

Contador has cheated.
So Kimmage calls him a cheater, (which he is), which very few people have actually done, certainly since his comeback. Even most of the people who were crying about Ricco ruining cycling, have no problem with Contador.

Kimmage didn't do or say anything past that.

That's the price Contador pays for cheating and getting caught.

This isn't ****ing pre school. Wah, teacher teacher, he called me a liar. People need to man up here. The cycling world is full of liars and unsavoury characters, many of whom Contador has sided with and befriended if he isn't one himself, and someone calling you a cheater when you are one, is not something to complain about.

Anyone who takes that decision to cheat, is risking having anti doping people like Kimmage hate them, and call them cheaters to their face.

Its a sad reality for Contador fans to face, I know, but since Clenbuterol, it is what it is, and they really need to move on because the world doesn't stop.

I have more time for Contador than I have for most current cyclists, but the man has some big flaws, and on this in particular, he is not defendable, and certainly not above getting the occasional cry of "cheater".

Contador was a cheater. He got caught. Strict liability prevailed. Ignore the fact the amount of clen could not have had a performance enhancing effect at the 2010 TDF. But c'est la vie. Those are the rules and you are correct. He cheated and anyone has a right to call him a "cheater" on one day of his life - July 21, 2010.

But the raison d'etre of this thread is "Will Contador be Juiced Up Again Upon His Return? " The thread was started on June 1, 2012 in anticipation of AC's suspension ending on August 19, 2012. Therefore the real question is AC a cheater today!

And because
a. He is Alberto Contador arguably the best cyclist in the World therefore he must be doping,
b. He is Spanish so he must be doping
c. He has this nauseating pistol habit when he wins so he must be doping
d. He has a passing acquaintance with Celaya and Pepi so he must be doping
e. He "doped" with clen in 2010 so he must be doping
f. He is a confirmed cheater and we know that to be true because Kimmage said so, therefore he must be doping.
g. No one can win a grand tour on talent, therefore he must be doping as were Sastre, Evans, Merckx and LeMond.
h. And because Hitch (noun or verb) says he is doping and Hitch is always right, he must be doping

After almost 2 years of the same old, same old you are no closer to proving the hypothesis of this thread today than in June 2012. It is all speculation and smoke and mirrors. Give it a break and get a life. When you have a case that makes sense come and see me.

 

[Granville57]

How do you say STFU in Canadian?

 

[martinvickers]

I thought it was an unnecessarily mean and personal comment.

Were you saying that about Bossen Hagen? I rather doubt it.

 

[martinvickers]

Its a cheap shot. There should be enough material out there for Kimmage to avoid doing things like this. But whatever, its not really a big deal. If Contador fans get upset by this then they need to relax.

Thanks. I've now got pepsi max all over my keyboard.

The circus is clearly in town.

 

[the sceptic]

Contador was a cheater. He got caught. Strict liability prevailed. Ignore the fact the amount of clen could not have had a performance enhancing effect at the 2010 TDF. But c'est la vie. Those are the rules and you are correct. He cheated and anyone has a right to call him a "cheater" on one day of his life - July 21, 2010.

But the raison d'etre of this thread is "Will Contador be Juiced Up Again Upon His Return? " The thread was started on June 1, 2012 in anticipation of AC's suspension ending on August 19, 2012. Therefore the real question is AC a cheater today!

And because
a. He is Alberto Contador arguably the best cyclist in the World therefore he must be doping,
b. He is Spanish so he must be doping
c. He has this nauseating pistol habit when he wins so he must be doping
d. He has a passing acquaintance with Celaya and Pepi so he must be doping
e. He "doped" with clen in 2010 so he must be doping
f. He is a confirmed cheater and we know that to be true because Kimmage said so, therefore he must be doping.
g. No one can win a grand tour on talent, therefore he must be doping as were Sastre, Evans, Merckx and LeMond.
h. And because Hitch (noun or verb) says he is doping and Hitch is always right, he must be doping

After almost 2 years of the same old, same old you are no closer to proving the hypothesis of this thread today than in June 2012. It is all speculation and smoke and mirrors. Give it a break and get a life. When you have a case that makes sense come and see me.

so by your logic, everyone is cleans all the time except for the day they test positive?

 

[martinvickers]

Contador was a cheater. He got caught. Strict liability prevailed. Ignore the fact the amount of clen could not have had a performance enhancing effect at the 2010 TDF. But c'est la vie. Those are the rules and you are correct. He cheated and anyone has a right to call him a "cheater" on one day of his life - July 21, 2010.

But the raison d'etre of this thread is "Will Contador be Juiced Up Again Upon His Return? " The thread was started on June 1, 2012 in anticipation of AC's suspension ending on August 19, 2012. Therefore the real question is AC a cheater today!

And because
a. He is Alberto Contador arguably the best cyclist in the World therefore he must be doping,
b. He is Spanish so he must be doping
c. He has this nauseating pistol habit when he wins so he must be doping
d. He has a passing acquaintance with Celaya and Pepi so he must be doping
e. He "doped" with clen in 2010 so he must be doping
f. He is a confirmed cheater and we know that to be true because Kimmage said so, therefore he must be doping.
g. No one can win a grand tour on talent, therefore he must be doping as were Sastre, Evans, Merckx and LeMond.
h. And because Hitch (noun or verb) says he is doping and Hitch is always right, he must be doping

After almost 2 years of the same old, same old you are no closer to proving the hypothesis of this thread today than in June 2012. It is all speculation and smoke and mirrors. Give it a break and get a life. When you have a case that makes sense come and see me.

 

[RobbieCanuck]

so by your logic, everyone is cleans all the time except for the day they test positive?

As I said - when you have a case that makes sense come and see me.

 

[RobbieCanuck]

I love it!!!!!!

 

[martinvickers]

I love it!!!!!!

Sorry, RC, couldn't resist.

Can't buy into the "cheated one day" rubbish, I'm afraid. He cheated, full stop. AS far as I'm concerned, he's only back at all on sufference and he'll just have to take this.

Nobody minded when Armstrong took it; hell nobody minded when it was sarcastic remarks at Sky who hadn't even popped at that point. It's the Kimmage MO, always has been.

Juvenile, yes, but it's how he plays.

p.s. feel free to use/steal the image - it is a cracker, and I could imagine terribly useful in the clinic on a repeated basis.

I also heartily recommend the following

 

[Ripper]

So - does anyone here actually, truly believe, that Bertie is not doping? Not I don't know or any other mamby pamby wishy washy non-opinion (I've been waiting a while to bring out the mamby pamby), but truly believes Bertie is not doin' the dope.

I mean, it should not make a difference to whether you like his riding or not.

 

[The Hitch]

How do you say STFU in Canadian?

I think it's : fermez la bouche

 

[The Hitch]

And because Hitch (noun or verb) says he is doping and Hitch is always right, he must be doping

Obviously I think I am right, because if I thought I was wrong I would change my opinion.

But I think the sentence has more credibility if phrased this way.

And because Michael Ashenden says he is doping and Michael Ashenden is always right, he must be doping

Ps, it's a noun.

And the t is silent

 

[LaFlorecita]

Were you saying that about Bossen Hagen? I rather doubt it.

I have no idea what you mean.

 

[neineinei]

I have no idea what you mean.

Kimmage had a swing at Sky via EBHat their press conference prior to last years TdF. The English language press barely mentioned it, so no wonder people haven't heard of it.

 

[LaFlorecita]

Kimmage had a swing at Sky via EBHat their press conference prior to last years TdF. The English language press barely mentioned it, so no wonder people haven't heard of it.

Ah, thanks.

 

[Arnout]

Eh its absolutely a fair comment from Kimmage. Why on earth would it not be

Contador has cheated.
So Kimmage calls him a cheater, (which he is), which very few people have actually done, certainly since his comeback. Even most of the people who were crying about Ricco ruining cycling, have no problem with Contador.

Kimmage didn't do or say anything past that.

That's the price Contador pays for cheating and getting caught.

This isn't ****ing pre school. Wah, teacher teacher, he called me a liar. People need to man up here. The cycling world is full of liars and unsavoury characters, many of whom Contador has sided with and befriended if he isn't one himself, and someone calling you a cheater when you are one, is not something to complain about.

Anyone who takes that decision to cheat, is risking having anti doping people like Kimmage hate them, and call them cheaters to their face.

Its a sad reality for Contador fans to face, I know, but since Clenbuterol, it is what it is, and they really need to move on because the world doesn't stop.

I have more time for Contador than I have for most current cyclists, but the man has some big flaws, and on this in particular, he is not defendable, and certainly not above getting the occasional cry of "cheater".

It's a fair comment no doubt. However, comments like that are loose cannons, they don't clean up cycling, they don't expose dopers, they don't expose a rotten system. It's just scoring points with things we already know. There is no doubt in my mind that Contador needs to be asked again and again why he doped and why he refuses to acknowledge that, but a comment like the one Kimmage made is about the least productive way to go about it. In fact, I'd be inclined to say that it's more about getting a bit of attention than it is about anything else.

 

[Ventoux Boar]

It's a fair comment no doubt. However, comments like that are loose cannons, they don't clean up cycling, they don't expose dopers, they don't expose a rotten system. It's just scoring points with things we already know. There is no doubt in my mind that Contador needs to be asked again and again why he doped and why he refuses to acknowledge that, but a comment like the one Kimmage made is about the least productive way to go about it. In fact, I'd be inclined to say that it's more about getting a bit of attention than it is about anything else.

What do potential whistle-blowers look for in a campaigning journalist? Mutual respect, and a track-record of protecting sources, must be high on anyone's list. Unstable tantrums - where names are named, and passengers helped under the bus - are more characteristic of self-serving demagogues.

Who would go near the guy with any valuable information?

 

[del1962]

What do potential whistle-blowers look for in a campaigning journalist? Mutual respect, and a track-record of protecting sources, must be high on anyone's list. Unstable tantrums - where names are named, and passengers helped under the bus - are more characteristic of self-serving demagogues.

Who would go near the guy with any valuable information?

I can't think of a time when Kimmage (or Walsh for that matter) have thrown any of their sources under the bus, Kimmage may be occasionally crass but he does not seem the sort to betray a confidence

 

[Ventoux Boar]

I can't think of a time when Kimmage (or Walsh for that matter) have thrown any of their sources under the bus, Kimmage may be occasionally crass but he does not seem the sort to betray a confidence

I didn't claim specific knowledge about outed sources.

The track record shows that it's quite likely that any disagreement you have with Kimmage demands - exclusivity, access etc - will appear in print a la O'Driscoll. Why trust a character like this with career-risking information?

 

[martinvickers]

So - does anyone here actually, truly believe, that Bertie is not doping? Not I don't know or any other mamby pamby wishy washy non-opinion (I've been waiting a while to bring out the mamby pamby), but truly believes Bertie is not doin' the dope.

I mean, it should not make a difference to whether you like his riding or not.

Until this year, I felt it was a possibility, yes. Absolutely no more than that, but I felt the drop off in his results that co-incided with his return, plus in particular, the reduction in his flat TT performance, made it possible he was worried about a possible life ban, and was therefore not on the hot sauce. It was one explanation, not the only one. But, hell, you have to be hopeful.

As you might guess, I'm less than happy about his link up with De Jongh.

None of which detracts from the fact that I would have preferred a life ban in the first place.

 

[LaFlorecita]

Until this year, I felt it was a possibility, yes. Absolutely no more than that, but I felt the drop off in his results that co-incided with his return, plus in particular, the reduction in his flat TT performance, made it possible he was worried about a possible life ban, and was therefore not on the hot sauce. It was one explanation, not the only one. But, hell, you have to be hopeful.

As you might guess, I'm less than happy about his link up with De Jongh.

None of which detracts from the fact that I would have preferred a life ban in the first place.

So is Sky's link with De Jongh not suspicious then?

Contador is cleans after all, cycling is clean now.

Go Bertie