Will Contador Be Juiced Up Again Upon His Return

[Tom T.]

Yes, are we seeing what a clean Contador can do against a doped field?

 

[Lanark]

Yes, are we seeing what a clean Contador can do against a doped field?

No, we are seeing what a doped Contador at this point in time is capable of against a doped field.

 

[Zam_Olyas]

Yes, are we seeing what a clean Contador can do against a doped field?

No, the field is clean.

 

[Tom T.]

No, we are seeing what a doped Contador at this point in time is capable of against a doped field.

Please explain. A doped Contador was clearly untouchable in years past. Are you saying he was previously doped against a clean or less-doped field and now they're catching up to him doping-wise? That's not plausible.

 

[Miburo]

Yes, are we seeing what a clean Contador can do against a doped field?

What was the vuelta 2012 then? Don't be idiotic...

I hope he'll visit some doctor. Better a chance getting caught than having this ****.

 

[Lanark]

Please explain. A doped Contador was clearly untouchable in years past. Are you saying he was previously doped against a clean or less-doped field and now they're catching up to him doping-wise? That's not plausible.

Not everything is explained by doping. I do think he had one of the best, maybe the best program during his Bruyneel years, people probably caught up with him a little bit, but the biggest reason I think is that he's just on the physical decline. His best days are behind him, regardless of doping.

 

[the sceptic]

he isnt that old and he was flying in last years vuelta. Something happened this year.

 

[Tom T.]

Not everything is explained by doping. I do think he had one of the best, maybe the best program during his Bruyneel years, people probably caught up with him a little bit, but the biggest reason I think is that he's just on the physical decline. His best days are behind him, regardless of doping.

He's only 29, though.

 

[jilbiker]

He's probably banking blood now.

The Dauphine was always infamous for poor performances.

It is quite possible. he seemed to firing on all cylinders today but yet generating very little power, reminds me of what Hamilton said in his book about 3-4wks to the TDF. But I though in this day and age they would have come out with something new. Well Skyborg has come out with something new, their program is all year round.

 

[Tom T.]

What was the vuelta 2012 then? Don't be idiotic...

I hope he'll visit some doctor. Better a chance getting caught than having this ****.

Hey, I'm not making conclusions, just asking questions, so drop the "idiotic" crap. I think it could be any number of things: he's scared of getting caught and is doping less, he just took a pint out, others are doing it better, he's on a physical decline, or some combination of everything. His form right now is way below what he did at the Vuelta, how do you explain that?

 

[Gregga]

When is the last extraction before the Tour, traditionally, in a transfusion programme? I was looking in the Hamilton thread but couldn't find the info easily.

Edit: worse than his other TT performances this year though: if not extracting blood he could just have stopped riding to falsify the result.

Because the red cells live about 30 days, and because you have to recover from the extraction, they often gave their blood just before or just after the Dauphiné, according to Hamilton.

But that was the old method, more than ten years ago, in 2004 Fuentes started freezing the blood bags, in that case, the BB's can be used months after the extraction, which is no more the cause of underperforming like Contador today.

IMO, he's simply on zero blood doping this week, keeping his blood stocks for the Tour and not able any more to use EPO microdoses because of the new testing protocol. The remaining question is "what the Sky are on" ?

 

[Lanark]

He's only 29, though.

So what? The age that cyclists decline is usually in their 30's, but there are dozens of examples of cyclists who peak early, and decline earlier than average as well.

I don't think today is really indicative for the general level that's he going to have the next couple of years, but the glory days are over.

 

[LaFlorecita]

he's only 29, though.

30*

.......

 

[LaFlorecita]

Today was a perfect example of how impossible it is to gauge natural talent/progression since the arrival of O2 drugs in cycling.

Contador looked very much like Chiappucci pre-1990.

Remember armstrong's at gila?

Posters in the road racing forums are going nuts, can't believe it. And if/when he suddenly rebounds in the tour they will herald that as the "real" Contador.

Clentadopucci...

Yawn......

 

[jilbiker]

He's only 29, though.

29??? That is an athlete's peak!! Unless cycling now has a new peak? 25?

Besides I thought cycling peak is now 32/33? Evans wins at 32, Wiggins wins at 32...so 29 is young.

 

[WillemS]

Contador's performance this season is consistent with riders in post doping suspension era. They can't seem to find that killer touch any more. His win at the Vuelta 2012 was similar to Ivan Basso's Giro win post his suspension. After the Giro we never heard anything significant from Basso. AC is doing his best this season, I don't buy the sick excuse from Saxo, his best doesn't cut it.

I say this is a bread and water AC and the truth is that it doesn't cut it, the peleton is still on PED. Will he risk it and juice for TDF? I doubt it, its way too late.

Well, here's a theory, well to not degrade the word any further, let's call it speculation.

After the recent doping busts of several low-level riders caught with GW-501516 in their samples, we can safely assume that at least part of the peloton has changed gear[1] from traditional blood doping, such as EPO, to metabolic modulators, such as GW-50, Telmisartan and Aicar. We also know that different people react differently to different medication, adding at least one additional factor to the genetic predisposition to do well in cycling and other sports. What if this alone might cause a shift in dominance between top riders. It might not be unreasonable to think that the odds are that there is no single rider that benefits the most from every variety of PEDs.

From what I've read on fora related to the use of doping (e.g., bodybuilding fora), GW-50 seems a great drug to enhance overall endurance, but, if used to enhance endurance maximally, might actually inhibit sudden bursts of high power needed in heavy weight lifting or, for instance, pure anaerobic sprints. In the bodybuilding community, this is mainly explained by a shift of metabolism to and increase in aerobic mechanisms, such as fat burning (main reason for bodybuilders to use the drug)[2]. In short, it might favor those riders with a riding style of continuous high watts (ala Sky-train) in stead of those with the ability to maintain high anaerobic attacks for a greater period of time than the rest (ala attacking with two to three km's to go, like Contador used to do).

Remarks
[1] "Gear" is often used on fora discussing the use of PEDs as a term for those PEDs, such as steroids and, more recently, SARMS and other peptides. Might those "gear problems" given so often these days after a bad performance be a euphemism for selecting the wrong drugs? I think not, but I can't help thinking that every time a rider is quoted saying something like that.
[2] Some anecdotal evidence, stories from GW-50 users on steroid websites, seem to suggest that the user might maintain aerobic metabolism at higher heart rates than usual, but were sometimes unable to use glucose as a fuel. This remind me of De Gendt saying that he was getting dropped on a climb with a very high heart rate, but not feeling very much pain or a feeling of being wasted. Oh, well, speculation. There are so many possible explanations...

 

[LaFlorecita]

No, the field is clean.

and Alberto is doped

 

[Tom T.]

So what? The age that cyclists decline is usually in their 30's, but there are dozens of examples of cyclists who peak early, and decline earlier than average as well.

I don't think today is really indicative for the general level that's he going to have the next couple of years, but the glory days are over.

You could be right but I think for the majority, 29 or 30 is still peak.

 

[the sceptic]

sir brad didnt peak until he was 32

 

[Lanark]

You could be right but I think for the majority, 29 or 30 is still peak.

You are right, I certainly can't prove that Contador is on the physical decline, but I think that's the most likely scenario at this point (allongside some reduction in doping due to the passport and improved tests).

 

[jilbiker]

Because the red cells live about 30 days, and because you have to recover from the extraction, they often gave their blood just before or just after the Dauphiné, according to Hamilton.

But that was the old method, more than ten years ago, in 2004 Fuentes started freezing the blood bags, in that case, the BB's can be used months after the extraction, which is no more the cause of underperforming like Contador today.

IMO, he's simply on zero blood doping this week, keeping his blood stocks for the Tour and not able any more to use EPO microdoses because of the new testing protocol. The remaining question is "what the Sky are on" ?

Unless AC panicked after the Spring races and only decided then to go with a BB program, so a later extraction. I am convinced that Sky is on a Balco-like custom juice. Remember they may never have caught Marion Jones and all the other Balco folks if some disgruntled man in circle did not send a syringe.

 

[coinneach]

You are right, I certainly can't prove that Contador is on the physical decline, but I think that's the most likely scenario at this point (allongside some reduction in doping due to the passport and improved tests).

Don't forget the added incentive NOT to dope.....he could/should be looking at lifetime ban if he's done again.

 

[Fearless Greg Lemond]

Very imformative Willem, thanks. Its a whole new ballgame out there.

 

[Galic Ho]

He's only 29, though.

He is 30 not 29. 31 in December.

Same age Evans was in 2007. Think about that for a second people. He's got plenty of years filled with GT wins ahead of him.

 

[Fearless Greg Lemond]

Guys who underperform like this should be target tested at the finishline.

Not normal.