World Politics

[Hugh Januss]

Yes, when I enter the voting booth I have the choice between one side I have huge disagreements with and the other that I have almost nothing in common.

Yippeee.

But no way that could possibly mean that your ideas are just fricken' OUT THERE.

 

[Bala Verde]

I like John Huntsman.

I think he has a good shot at getting the independent vote, if he makes it through the primaries... Educated, well spoken, moderate, "bipartisan" and he doesn't appear to have a lot of baggage (in terms of crazy talk). Let's see how his campaign unfolds.

 

[Anonymous]

But no way that could possibly mean that your ideas are just fricken' OUT THERE.

Eh.. perhaps. Truly though, I don't see a helluva lot of difference between the two parties as I think the overwhelming majority of the political class is absolutely corrupt. So much so it is literally a breath of fresh air to see what (Democrat, yes I'm praising a Dem) Chiang has done with the Cali budget (or lack thereof) and the doofus's that inhabit Sacto.

 

[ChrisE]

Gotta call BS on that one Chrissy.
.

That is your choice what you believe about me. I understand there have to be parameters within an economic model where the consumer is protected, and capitalism left unregulated is inherently destructive because it concentrates wealth on a small portion of society. I argue I am more of a capitalist than you because I understand the need for this protection and the stability a strong middle class provides to a society, which ultimately benefits business. You are just a parrot.

 

[Anonymous]

That is your choice what you believe about me. I understand there have to be parameters within an economic model where the consumer is protected, and capitalism left unregulated is inherently destructive because it concentrates wealth on a small portion of society. I argue I am more of a capitalist than you because I understand the need for this protection and the stability a strong middle class provides to a society, which ultimately benefits business. You are just a parrot.

Well then you should have no problem pointing to where I advocate unregulated capitalism.... where I advocate concentrating wealth with very few.... where I advocate the destruction of the middle class (whomever that is)... that I advocate a system without parameters.

And to be clear, this is the part I called BS on;

"I am purely a capitalist myself but I know there are boundaries that need to be maintained that will ultimately lead to better growth, and dog eat dog won't work long term".

You state that you are "purely a capitalist" then go on to say why you are not purely a capitalist.

Your schtick could use some improvement, in my humble opinion.

 

[ChrisE]

Well then you should have no problem pointing to where I advocate unregulated capitalism.... where I advocate concentrating wealth with very few.... where I advocate the destruction of the middle class (whomever that is)... that I advocate a system without parameters.

And to be clear, this is the part I called BS on;

"I am purely a capitalist myself but I know there are boundaries that need to be maintained that will ultimately lead to better growth, and dog eat dog won't work long term".

You state that you are "purely a capitalist" then go on to say why you are not purely a capitalist.

Your schtick could use some improvement, in my humble opinion.

Your idea of "purely capitalist" is the BS you spew. I don't believe that is the best way, and since the country has been going that way and the economy is on a downward spiral the last 10 years then I will let those facts do the talking.

 

[Alpe d'Huez]

Truly though, I don't see a helluva lot of difference between the two parties as I think the overwhelming majority of the political class is absolutely corrupt.

Which has been my assertion since before this thread's inception. Going back many years. Hell, the Nixon administration was less affected by bribery than what we have today. By far.

Where you and I completely differ is that I don't think our public education system is a disaster. Where it mostly has problems is in the poorest areas. There are problems, yes. But in many ways I think the solution to that is not to cut it, or make the teachers fight for their jobs or impoverish them because of some ill-conceived and often believed notion that the majority teachers are lazy and just want a bunch of hand outs, just because a few of such can be found. I believe the solution is better funding. Better paid teachers, better facilities, etc.

You know the numbers so I won't repeat them on how if we had never declared war on "terror", and spent a few trillion doing so, we'd have a lot more money for other things. Some of it for deficit reduction, some of it for infrastructure, and some for education. I'm even willing to pay more taxes on top of that, if I know it's going to educators and school facilities, and have voted as such (even though I do not have children). Would you?

 

[redtreviso]

Eh.. perhaps. Truly though, I don't see a helluva lot of difference between the two parties as I think the overwhelming majority of the political class is absolutely corrupt. So much so it is literally a breath of fresh air to see what (Democrat, yes I'm praising a Dem) Chiang has done with the Cali budget (or lack thereof) and the doofus's that inhabit Sacto.

Truly though. that is not surprising..Your randite, kick the steps out of the ladder climbing ideals fit all your GOP heroes.. The dems only put up resistance until they get paid too.. The bad guys or the bad guys who sit back and watch. You go with the former not the latter. The thug or the non cooperative witness of the thug's crime.. You are with the thug.

Here you go scott...After your nightly reading aloud from Shrugged read this to prepare for another day..Get out there and blenderize some kittens.. yeaaaaaa

http://www2.tech.purdue.edu/cg/courses/cgt411/covey/48_laws_of_power.htm

 

[Anonymous]

Your idea of "purely capitalist" is the BS you spew. I don't believe that is the best way, and since the country has been going that way and the economy is on a downward spiral the last 10 years then I will let those facts do the talking.

Gee Chrissy, let's recap shall we?

You said "I am purely a capitalist myself"

Definition of PURELY
1a : to a full extent : totally <purely by accident> b : wholly, exclusively <a selection based purely on merit>
2: without admixture of anything injurious or foreign


Definition of CAPITALIST
1: a person who has capital especially invested in business; broadly : a person of wealth : plutocrat
2: a person who favors capitalism

cap·i·tal·ism noun
\ˈka-pə-tə-ˌliz-əm, ˈkap-tə-, British also kə-ˈpi-tə-\
Definition of CAPITALISM
: an economic system characterized by private or corporate ownership of capital goods, by investments that are determined by private decision, and by prices, production, and the distribution of goods that are determined mainly by competition in a free market

Definition of FREE MARKET
: an economic market operating by free competition


Then you followed by saying, "but I know there are boundaries that need to be maintained that will ultimately lead to better growth, and dog eat dog won't work long term. I know some things are left best to the govt instead of the free market. Your type of BS is only good for a small %, but they control the strings of the dolts and you happily spew the gospel."

Which states that you are not remotely close to a pure capitalist. What you are is confused... hey man, it happens sometimes but that does not mean you have to spew your vitriol in my direction.

 

[Anonymous]

Which has been my assertion since before this thread's inception. Going back many years. Hell, the Nixon administration was less affected by bribery than what we have today. By far.

Where you and I completely differ is that I don't think our public education system is a disaster. Where it mostly has problems is in the poorest areas. There are problems, yes. But in many ways I think the solution to that is not to cut it, or make the teachers fight for their jobs or impoverish them because of some ill-conceived and often believed notion that the majority teachers are lazy and just want a bunch of hand outs, just because a few of such can be found. I believe the solution is better funding. Better paid teachers, better facilities, etc.

You know the numbers so I won't repeat them on how if we had never declared war on "terror", and spent a few trillion doing so, we'd have a lot more money for other things. Some of it for deficit reduction, some of it for infrastructure, and some for education. I'm even willing to pay more taxes on top of that, if I know it's going to educators and school facilities, and have voted as such (even though I do not have children). Would you?

Where you and I completely differ is that I don't think our public education system is a disaster. Where it mostly has problems is in the poorest areas. There are problems, yes. But in many ways I think the solution to that is not to cut it, or make the teachers fight for their jobs or impoverish them because of some ill-conceived and often believed notion that the majority teachers are lazy and just want a bunch of hand outs, just because a few of such can be found. I believe the solution is better funding. Better paid teachers, better facilities, etc.

Well, we are going to disagree on this. I think there is volumes of data to suggest public education is failing our kids, paricularly in the inner city. I don't think the problem with public education has much to do with "lazy" teachers.

Have you looked at education? Why, specifically, do you feel it's a funding issue?

I'm even willing to pay more taxes on top of that, if I know it's going to educators and school facilities, and have voted as such (even though I do not have children). Would you?

Yes, if I had confidence that funding is a problem.

How much more are you willing to pay? Are you confident it's a funding problem? Is there a lmit to how much education should cost? Are you confident public education is being run as efficiently as possible? Do you want to know or is it just the path of least resistance to just throw more money at education?

 

[redtreviso]

"I'm a CAPITALIST" That's pretty much PROFOUNDLY STUPID!



uhhhhh I truly believe Teach a man to fish for a lifetime and he'll give a feed for today, Won't get fooled again...ehhckkkkkkk

 

[rhubroma]

Which has been my assertion since before this thread's inception. Going back many years. Hell, the Nixon administration was less affected by bribery than what we have today. By far.

Where you and I completely differ is that I don't think our public education system is a disaster. Where it mostly has problems is in the poorest areas. There are problems, yes. But in many ways I think the solution to that is not to cut it, or make the teachers fight for their jobs or impoverish them because of some ill-conceived and often believed notion that the majority teachers are lazy and just want a bunch of hand outs, just because a few of such can be found. I believe the solution is better funding. Better paid teachers, better facilities, etc.

You know the numbers so I won't repeat them on how if we had never declared war on "terror", and spent a few trillion doing so, we'd have a lot more money for other things. Some of it for deficit reduction, some of it for infrastructure, and some for education. I'm even willing to pay more taxes on top of that, if I know it's going to educators and school facilities, and have voted as such (even though I do not have children). Would you?

Throwing money into the system, however, won't do much good if the teachers themselves aren't better prepared and if the students aren't pushed to really study, to understand that what they think is there limit is far from it, that intellectual processing is work and that it doesn't happen through osmosis.

Don't mistake what I mean, of course the state needs to finance the public schools adequately and pay the teachers well, but there also needs to be a cultural shift that gives more value to public education and critical learning in general. This is talked about a lot, however, the talk needs to be followed by real and not merely simulated actions.

In other words standardized tests won't do it (neither will tax cuts, especially for the corporate world) and competing to get the scores up in terms of which schools get more funding and which don't is just a superficial way of assessing merit, when there is often an abysmal level of critical thinking in the humanistic spirit being done, which is also something that has been progressively phased out because deemed superfluous and thus isn't even being taught. I know, because I see how most of my students have been prepared before they enter the classroom.

School, especially the primary and secondary institutions, is not merely a place to develop young minds in the direction of the sciences and economic sectors, but a place to develop the critical thinking skills in the humanities that make us all better citizens and that constructs a foundation upon which democracy is sustained and functions.

At least this is what, from my point of view, any public school system should provide students before they become lazy and incompetent (in the mental sense) grown-ups. What I find particularly appalling is that this type of intellectualism gets often branded as elitist and thus the message society is sent from the market, and often by the ruling class too, is one that conditions the masses to aspire to no more than the lowest common denominator. Materially no, but culturally absolutley yes. And it shows. That this is congenial to consumerism and hence their interests is without a doubt, but it also is dumbing down the democracy (something which Tocqueville already warned about as being lethal to it) and demonstrates how these establishments think so little of the citizenry, who are basically treated as clientele to be exploited or discarded according to the interests.

Finally, when they get to the university level, students above all need to stop being pampered. It as if everything revolves around them, every service imaginable has been invented to address all of their so called needs (with universities selling themselves to prospective tuition payers by how many 3 star restaurants they have on campus and how many high tech gyms, or therapy centers since all apparently suffer from one type of fragility or another), so that the students don't think they have to do much of anything to pass and even have a misguided sense of entitlement that they all deserve an A. Worse they frequently have a false concept about what is good work and what's merely mediocre, which has also been reinforced by their past teachers.

They have been stuffed on so much superfluous and superficial crap, that they don't have that hunger that drives the starving (or at least the not over-fed) to make themselves become disciplined in their academic lives. Well there are millions of young people in China and India who really are starving and will stop at nothing to learn everything they can to improve their lot in life.

There are, of course, some very quality institutions and very serious students, don't mistake me on this one either. Yet they are in an ever restricted (and often privileged) minority, whereas there is a sea of magma flowing where ever it finds an outlet within an intellectual culture that has become increasingly banalized by a whole slew of ideological and commercial reasons, such that the general flavor of what's in the pot has become rather insipid.

How this cultural change is to come about, I don't know, only that it must, if further decline isn't to become inevitable. But so long is their is a class of uber-capitalists like Scott getting the upper hand on how the country is to be conceived and directed (or rather managed like a business), there is little hope for the public schools in America, which is of course tragic.

 

[Anonymous]

To Keynesian or not to Keynesian. That appears to be the question.

Dems call for stimulus in debt deal as CBO offers warnings

http://thehill.com/blogs/on-the-money/budget/167965-dems-call-for-stimulus-in-debt-deal-as-cbo-offers-warnings


Senate Democrats want the deal to include a payroll tax cut, more money for highway construction and clean-energy subsidies to bring down the 9.1 percent unemployment rate.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/06/22/usa-debt-idUSN1E75L0GC20110622




More of the same. I don't think there is a single serious person in Washington DC. Not one.

 

[usedtobefast]

To Keynesian or not to Keynesian. That appears to be the question.

Dems call for stimulus in debt deal as CBO offers warnings

http://thehill.com/blogs/on-the-money/budget/167965-dems-call-for-stimulus-in-debt-deal-as-cbo-offers-warnings


Senate Democrats want the deal to include a payroll tax cut, more money for highway construction and clean-energy subsidies to bring down the 9.1 percent unemployment rate.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/06/22/usa-debt-idUSN1E75L0GC20110622




More of the same. I don't think there is a single serious person in Washington DC. Not one.

seriously lame

 

[ChrisE]

Eh.. perhaps. Truly though, I don't see a helluva lot of difference between the two parties as I think the overwhelming majority of the political class is absolutely corrupt. So much so it is literally a breath of fresh air to see what (Democrat, yes I'm praising a Dem) Chiang has done with the Cali budget (or lack thereof) and the doofus's that inhabit Sacto.

So why do you keep voting for them? I touched on this upthread. Until enough of us get fed up with the bs it will remain the same. I will vote for a viable 3rd candidate when they emerge. Until then, I'm on the sidelines.

Red posted pix of scary wingnuts to make me continue to vote dem. It had no effect on me. Why don't you stop listening to wingnut radio/mass media and think for yourself instead of parroting Norquist talking points?

 

[Anonymous]

So why do you keep voting for them? I touched on this upthread. Until enough of us get fed up with the bs it will remain the same. I will vote for a viable 3rd candidate when they emerge. Until then, I'm on the sidelines.

Red posted pix of scary wingnuts to make me continue to vote dem. It had no effect on me. Why don't you stop listening to wingnut radio/mass media and think for yourself instead of parroting Norquist talking points?

Until then, I'm on the sidelines.

I've thought about doing this but I'm not sure electing not to participate is the solution. If the sane sit it out the insane will elect the "wingnuts".

Although at this stage I'm not sure if that hasn't already happened.

think for yourself instead of parroting Norquist talking points

Hugh thinks I am a lunatic and you think I parrot Norquist. You two need to get on the same page.

 

[Alpe d'Huez]

That is pretty lame. Might create a few jobs. Could otherwise slice a small part of the deficit.

No changes to defense budget.
No further health care reform.
No SS reform.

That's where all the money is.

As to funding education. It's obviously a large topic, and I don't have time to write detail now. But money can take care of better school facilities, smaller class sizes, field trips, etc. I don't know about CA or other states, but in my state we have entire schools closing due to lack of funding. We also had a very old school that needed repairs catch on fire and close. Students are being bussed or having to use mass transit to travel a long way to the nearest school, and ending up in classrooms the size of lecture halls. No administration shuffling can fix such a giant hole. But money, if properly managed, can. We recently voted on two bond measures here in OR. One to pay teachers more, one to fix schools. I voted for both, but largely supported the second one. Only the first one passed. The second was very close though.

 

[redtreviso]

State Supreme Court Justice..Republican and Koch w***e

""Madison Wisconsin -- Breaking News -- It is being reported that Supreme Court Justice David Prosser put both his hands around the throat of fellow Justice Ann Walsh Bradley in an argument in her chambers last week, according to several knowledgeable sources. It is apparent that Prosser has a lack of temper control as this will be the second alleged instance of his violence against women in chambers.""

http://www.politiscoop.com/component/content/article/35-last-24h-news/364-prosser-allegedly-chokes-justice-bradley.html

another source

""Sources say authorities are looking into altercation in Supreme Court chambers
By Bill Lueders
Wisconsin Center for Investigative Journalism
June 25, 2011 Wisconsin Supreme Court Justice David Prosser allegedly grabbed fellow Justice Ann Walsh Bradley around the neck in an argument in her chambers last week, according to several knowledgeable sources.

Details of the incident, investigated jointly by Wisconsin Public Radio and the Wisconsin Center for Investigative Journalism, remain sketchy. The sources spoke on the condition that they not be named.

They say an argument that occurred before the court’s release of a decision upholding a bill to curtail the collective bargaining rights of public employees culminated in a physical altercation in the presence of other justices. Bradley purportedly asked Prosser to leave her office, whereupon Prosser grabbed Bradley by the neck with both hands.

Justice Prosser, contacted Friday afternoon by the Center, declined comment: “I have nothing to say about it.” He repeated this statement after the particulars of the story — including the allegation that there was physical contact between him and Bradley — were described. He did not confirm or deny any part of the reconstructed account.
""

 

[usedtobefast]

http://www.peaceandfreedom.org/home/

i have been a member of The Peace and Freedom Party since we got the right to
vote as 18 year olds. the big 2 are different sides of the same coin.

 

[ChrisE]

http://www.businessinsider.com/15-charts-about-wealth-and-inequality-in-america-2010-4#

OK Scott. You want to pick apart my post about being "purely a capitalist" so let's discuss this.

Are the things shown in this article a good thing? Is this sustainable? What do you propose to reverse these trends, and what are their root cause?

Unfortunately I don't have the answer on how to reverse this. The barn door is long open.

 

[ChrisE]

http://www.peaceandfreedom.org/home/

i have been a member of The Peace and Freedom Party since we got the right to
vote as 18 year olds. the big 2 are different sides of the same coin.

Wow, what a bunch of loons.

I lol'd at the parts about "we believe in free...." lol.

 

[Anonymous]

http://www.businessinsider.com/15-charts-about-wealth-and-inequality-in-america-2010-4#

OK Scott. You want to pick apart my post about being "purely a capitalist" so let's discuss this.

Are the things shown in this article a good thing? Is this sustainable? What do you propose to reverse these trends, and what are their root cause?

Unfortunately I don't have the answer on how to reverse this. The barn door is long open.

This can be reversed with another great depression, big terrorist attack... really any huge economic disruption. We could also just have a one-time wealth confiscation.

Interesting thing with your link though, I noticed the really fast acceleration for the top marginals happened in the 1990's. Did you see that? It also pulled back in the aftermath of 9/11...

So raising the top tax rates to Clinton levels won't stop this trend, or so it would seem. I guess the best way to combat this trend is just good old fashion economic destruction.

Maybe a good sports analogy could be used here... not every baseball team is going to win the world series, not every quarterback can have kids with a super-model.

 

[redtreviso]

This can be reversed with another great depression, big terrorist attack... really any huge economic disruption. We could also just have a one-time wealth confiscation.

Interesting thing with your link though, I noticed the really fast acceleration for the top marginals happened in the 1990's. Did you see that? It also pulled back in the aftermath of 9/11...

So raising the top tax rates to Clinton levels won't stop this trend, or so it would seem. I guess the best way to combat this trend is just good old fashion economic destruction.

Maybe a good sports analogy could be used here... not every baseball team is going to win the world series, not every quarterback can have kids with a super-model.

hmmmm.. Sounds like you subscribe to the idea that making losers helps the cream rise further. How would that steak taste if you didn't detour by that bridge with the starving homeless living under it?

 

[redtreviso]

""Bachmann cites wrong John Wayne, praises notorious serial killer | Rep. Michele Bachmann (R-MN) has a thing for John Wayne. In an interview yesterday with Newsmax, she said she wants to live in “John Wayne’s America.” And in the Iowa town of Waterloo today, where she announced her presidential candidacy, Bachmann told Fox News, “John Wayne was from Waterloo, Iowa. That’s the kind of spirit that I have, too.” But unfortunately for historically challenged Bachmann, as the Washington Times points out, the John Wayne born in Waterloo is John Wayne Gacy, the notorious serial killer who murdered 33 teenage boys and young men, not the iconic Western actor""

 

[Anonymous]

hmmmm.. Sounds like you subscribe to the idea that making losers helps the cream rise further. How would that steak taste if you didn't detour by that bridge with the starving homeless living under it?

You could probably use some new material.