World Politics

[rhubroma]

The idea that the US is an atheistic society, is patently absurd when one realizes how much the religious right votes in block to get the society it wants. American secularism means the constitutional state of law, not an absence of religion. Nor is it factual that Isis isn't Islam. The Isis goal, which it has made clear in no uncertain terms, is to revive the Caliphate - that is a Muslim theocracy from the Middle Ages - and to wage ware against the so-called infidels.

Religion isn't only religion when it pleases the religious. Religion is also religion when it behaves barbarously, which it often has, and I'm frankly tired of being told by the religious that what is going on has got nothing to do with religion. It absolutely does, regardless if there are other economic and political motives.

Before 1789 people in the West also were killed because they disobeyed the King or God, but the French decided that such hierarchical driven tyranny, which both the secular and religious establishments vehemently supported, caused so much social injustice that it was to be overthrown. Out of this came the first bill of human rights. Certainly the chaos and tyranny which ensued was also the result of the revolution, however, with time (and however imperfectly), the Western World created a system that certainly isn't the worst. One thing is for certain though, had the old aristocracy and the religious order been left to themselves, no such epoch making change would have occurred.

Unfortunately in the Arab world no such revolutionary process happened, where, to the contrary, only the most totalitarian and often theocratic regimes have gotten power. Now you can blame the West for every sort of crime and hypocrisy (a couple of hundred thousand dead Muslims will probably lead to a few dozen terrorists trying to kill you). It can be denounced for imposing a market dominated economic order that has frequently worked unremittingly against human rights in support of the worst regimes, because economically convenient. Yet there still remains a part of the human population that's too enslaved by its religion, which hasn't developed another cultural identity other than its religious identity. This has now evidently become a problem for the rest of humanity, the one which has built an identity beyond its religious heritage. This is what the religious fanatics have targeted, because they can't accept an identity other than the religious one. It isn't surprising, though, that were such religious extremism sets in, is where a culure of empoverishment and ignorance predominates, be it in deep Africa or the Parisian banlieues.

This is why I'd die for the Marseillaise, but I wouldn't die for Christ King. The problem is that the religious system, against the Latin etymological basis of the term, religere "to bind," is not nearly as inclusive and civil as the code of universal rights the French anthem espouses. I'm well aware that such universal rights haven't always been respected, but the fact that they exist is a huge step forward.

It's high time that another step forward is made. This is the one that sees an international agreement to regulate the sale of oil and arms. Isis apparently has the means to sell oil on the black market to buy the arms (often made in the West) to extend its network of terroristic activities. Unfortunately there is probably too much curruption and profit, and profit that curruption generates, and vice versa for this to happen.

 

[blackcat]

The idea that the US is an atheistic society, is patently absurd when one realizes how much the religious right votes in block to get the society it wants. American secularism means the constitutional state of law, not an absence of religion. Nor is it factual that Isis isn't Islam. The Isis goal, which it has made clear in no uncertain terms, is to revive the Caliphate - that is a Muslim theocracy from the Middle Ages - and to wage ware against the so-called infidels.

Religion isn't only religion when it pleases the religious. Religion is also religion when it behaves barbarously, which it often has, and I'm frankly tired of being told by the religious that what is going on has got nothing to do with religion. It absolutely does, regardless if there are other economic and political motives.

but do all the ex-Bathist Sunni(and I think* there are a minority of Shia***) in this Iraqi Daesh, just using religion as a political branding exercise, or, an expedient confluence of branding/messaging, and a strict religious doctrine. The religious salafi/wahhabis coulda upped sticks and headed to numerous Emirati and Saud to practise their primordial version of islam...

or am I just arguing semantics? prolly the latter!

 

[blackcat]

It's high time that another step forward is made.

now, need to make the qualifier, I have not done my reading!

is this what Alain Badiou and Zizek are on about. Does Slavoj talk on this in his tome End Times?

 

[rhubroma]

The idea that the US is an atheistic society, is patently absurd when one realizes how much the religious right votes in block to get the society it wants. American secularism means the constitutional state of law, not an absence of religion. Nor is it factual that Isis isn't Islam. The Isis goal, which it has made clear in no uncertain terms, is to revive the Caliphate - that is a Muslim theocracy from the Middle Ages - and to wage ware against the so-called infidels.

Religion isn't only religion when it pleases the religious. Religion is also religion when it behaves barbarously, which it often has, and I'm frankly tired of being told by the religious that what is going on has got nothing to do with religion. It absolutely does, regardless if there are other economic and political motives.

but do all the ex-Bathist Sunni(and I think* there are a minority of Shia***) in this Iraqi Daesh, just using religion as a political branding exercise, or, an expedient confluence of branding/messaging, and a strict religious doctrine. The religious salafi/wahhabis coulda upped sticks and headed to numerous Emirati and Saud to practise their primordial version of islam...

or am I just arguing semantics? prolly the latter!

Probably true, the latter that is. Well it depends, when someone straps a bomb to their chest and with verses from the Koran goes into a bistro to blow themselves up, believing that 17 virgins will be waiting for him in Paradise, then its hard to acquit his religion in this process.

 

[rhubroma]

It's high time that another step forward is made.

now, need to make the qualifier, I have not done my reading!

is this what Alain Badiou and Zizek are on about. Does Slavoj talk on this in his tome End Times?

Zizek's position I'd say falls in line with what I was getting at, though he could relate it much better.

The interesting thing about End Times is that someone is always hoping for them, despite the fact that such expectancy never arrives at the climactic fulfillment hoped for.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ca3SxPGgKJU

 

[red_flanders]

Good article on Molenbeek and assimilation forwarded by my cousin:

http://www.politico.eu/article/molenbeek-broke-my-heart-radicalization-suburb-brussels-gentrification/

Over nine years, as I witnessed the neighborhood become increasingly intolerant. Alcohol became unavailable in most shops and supermarkets; I heard stories of fanatics at the Comte des Flandres metro station who pressured women to wear the veil; Islamic bookshops proliferated, and it became impossible to buy a decent newspaper. With an unemployment rate of 30 percent, the streets were eerily empty until late in the morning. Nowhere was there a bar or café where white, black and brown people would mingle. Instead, I witnessed petty crime, aggression, and frustrated youths who spat at our girlfriends and called them “filthy whores.” If you made a remark, you were inevitably scolded and called a racist. There used to be Jewish shops on Chaussée de Gand, but these were terrorized by gangs of young kids and most closed their doors around 2008. Openly gay people were routinely intimidated, and also packed up their bags.

You can't assimilate people if they don't want to be assimilated. He's of the mind that this isn't representative of all of Molenbeek, but is a completely accurate picture of significant parts of it.

 

[Semper Fidelis]

Good article on Molenbeek and assimilation forwarded by my cousin:

http://www.politico.eu/article/molenbeek-broke-my-heart-radicalization-suburb-brussels-gentrification/

Over nine years, as I witnessed the neighborhood become increasingly intolerant. Alcohol became unavailable in most shops and supermarkets; I heard stories of fanatics at the Comte des Flandres metro station who pressured women to wear the veil; Islamic bookshops proliferated, and it became impossible to buy a decent newspaper. With an unemployment rate of 30 percent, the streets were eerily empty until late in the morning. Nowhere was there a bar or café where white, black and brown people would mingle. Instead, I witnessed petty crime, aggression, and frustrated youths who spat at our girlfriends and called them “filthy whores.” If you made a remark, you were inevitably scolded and called a racist. There used to be Jewish shops on Chaussée de Gand, but these were terrorized by gangs of young kids and most closed their doors around 2008. Openly gay people were routinely intimidated, and also packed up their bags.

You can't assimilate people if they don't want to be assimilated. He's of the mind that this isn't representative of all of Molenbeek, but is a completely accurate picture of significant parts of it.

Very good article. Thanks for the post.

Rhubroma's post also good.

 

[blackcat]

Re: Re:

[quote="Jspear]

lol...wrong on so many levels.

What exactly are the differences between the teachings of fundamentalist Islam and fundamentalist Christianity regarding women/women's rights, homosexuals, science, secularism, religious infallibility, what should be taught in schools, believers in other religions, and so on? Can't say I see much daylight between the two.

Fundamental Christianity would say "Love your neighbor as yourself."
Violence is antithetical to this statement. I think your problem is you don't understand what fundamental Christianity is. It could of course be discussed further in the religion thread.

It seems fairly obvious that most people understand the basic tenets of Christianity such as the one you quote.

It also seems fairly obvious that violence by religious extremists includes violence perpetrated by fundamentalist Christians who espouse things like "biblical literacy" (as if that's possible) and "biblical inerrancy". "Fundamentalist" is a well understood term describing a certain viewpoint.

You can't change the definition of words to deflect a point.

is market economics and friedman's market that the American's imbibe, is this a religion, what is the chiquita banana company responsible for any wars in South America, Zinn and Smedly Butler n all. oh, and goldmans ceo lloyd blankfein goldman sachs work as God's work, this is America's gods work, the religion of the market. And the market uses a fundamentalism as much as the crusades sought jerusalem.

 

[blutto]

....afraid you are not keeping abreast on the latest on the jihadi terrorist front ?....not aware of the latest fashion trends ?....don't know where to take that "special" girl for a great meal ?....well now we have the following...

"Leading the charge on Wednesday was CNN’s intrepid reporter, Chris Cuomo, who seemed uncomfortably dazzled by a report in the latest English language issue of ‘ISIS Monthly’ aka DABIQ Magazine (image, left), a glossy coffee table rag filled with colorful jihadi lifestyle features and career advice for aspiring young terrorists (if only it were a joke)."

....and who know this may be joke too....anyways the above comes from...

http://21stcenturywire.com/2015/11/20/cnn-media-pushing-ridiculous-isis-propaganda-schweppes-bomb-claims-it-brought-down-russian-airliner/

....where the actual major point was...

"Question: should ‘ISIS’ be considered a credible news source? Sadly, CNN does.

In the wake of the Paris Attacks, a most disturbing trend has suddenly emerged in the mainstream media’s ‘terror’ coverage – where CNN, FOX News, and other majors are now deferring to ISIS press releases as a primary news source."

....I guess if the modern world of journalism is simply paraphrasing official like press releases, one press release is about as real as any other...

Cheers

 

[blutto]

Good article on Molenbeek and assimilation forwarded by my cousin:

http://www.politico.eu/article/molenbeek-broke-my-heart-radicalization-suburb-brussels-gentrification/

Over nine years, as I witnessed the neighborhood become increasingly intolerant. Alcohol became unavailable in most shops and supermarkets; I heard stories of fanatics at the Comte des Flandres metro station who pressured women to wear the veil; Islamic bookshops proliferated, and it became impossible to buy a decent newspaper. With an unemployment rate of 30 percent, the streets were eerily empty until late in the morning. Nowhere was there a bar or café where white, black and brown people would mingle. Instead, I witnessed petty crime, aggression, and frustrated youths who spat at our girlfriends and called them “filthy whores.” If you made a remark, you were inevitably scolded and called a racist. There used to be Jewish shops on Chaussée de Gand, but these were terrorized by gangs of young kids and most closed their doors around 2008. Openly gay people were routinely intimidated, and also packed up their bags.

You can't assimilate people if they don't want to be assimilated. He's of the mind that this isn't representative of all of Molenbeek, but is a completely accurate picture of significant parts of it.

...you also can't assimilate if the native culture doesn't allow assimilation....

Cheers

 

[VeloCity]

Re: Re:

[quote="Jspear]

lol...wrong on so many levels.

What exactly are the differences between the teachings of fundamentalist Islam and fundamentalist Christianity regarding women/women's rights, homosexuals, science, secularism, religious infallibility, what should be taught in schools, believers in other religions, and so on? Can't say I see much daylight between the two.

Fundamental Christianity would say "Love your neighbor as yourself."
Violence is antithetical to this statement. I think your problem is you don't understand what fundamental Christianity is. It could of course be discussed further in the religion thread.

You really should read the Bible sometime.

 

[rhubroma]

Re: Re:

[quote="Jspear]

lol...wrong on so many levels.

What exactly are the differences between the teachings of fundamentalist Islam and fundamentalist Christianity regarding women/women's rights, homosexuals, science, secularism, religious infallibility, what should be taught in schools, believers in other religions, and so on? Can't say I see much daylight between the two.

Fundamental Christianity would say "Love your neighbor as yourself."
Violence is antithetical to this statement. I think your problem is you don't understand what fundamental Christianity is. It could of course be discussed further in the religion thread.

It seems fairly obvious that most people understand the basic tenets of Christianity such as the one you quote.

It also seems fairly obvious that violence by religious extremists includes violence perpetrated by fundamentalist Christians who espouse things like "biblical literacy" (as if that's possible) and "biblical inerrancy". "Fundamentalist" is a well understood term describing a certain viewpoint.

You can't change the definition of words to deflect a point.

is market economics and friedman's market that the American's imbibe, is this a religion, what is the chiquita banana company responsible for any wars in South America, Zinn and Smedly Butler n all. oh, and goldmans ceo lloyd blankfein goldman sachs work as God's work, this is America's gods work, the religion of the market. And the market uses a fundamentalism as much as the crusades sought jerusalem.

All of this is true and points I have brought up many times in the past. There are market fundamentalists too. David Gray has also compared such pundits with being guided by a similar "theological" worldview as the religious parties.

The problem is greed and corruption. Then there is the fact that under today's financialization, the relationship between wealth and actual work wages has become so asymmetrical that if there is a recrudescence in barbarism and obscurantism, this too is partly to blame.

 

[blackcat]

Re: Re:

All of this is true and points I have brought up many times in the past. There are market fundamentalists too. David Gray has also compared such pundits with being guided by a similar "theological" worldview as the religious parties.

The problem is greed and corruption.

i was cheating, just riffing, extrapolating with a lack of originality and rigor on a previous post of yours on the page above

 

[red_flanders]

Good article on Molenbeek and assimilation forwarded by my cousin:

http://www.politico.eu/article/molenbeek-broke-my-heart-radicalization-suburb-brussels-gentrification/

Over nine years, as I witnessed the neighborhood become increasingly intolerant. Alcohol became unavailable in most shops and supermarkets; I heard stories of fanatics at the Comte des Flandres metro station who pressured women to wear the veil; Islamic bookshops proliferated, and it became impossible to buy a decent newspaper. With an unemployment rate of 30 percent, the streets were eerily empty until late in the morning. Nowhere was there a bar or café where white, black and brown people would mingle. Instead, I witnessed petty crime, aggression, and frustrated youths who spat at our girlfriends and called them “filthy whores.” If you made a remark, you were inevitably scolded and called a racist. There used to be Jewish shops on Chaussée de Gand, but these were terrorized by gangs of young kids and most closed their doors around 2008. Openly gay people were routinely intimidated, and also packed up their bags.

You can't assimilate people if they don't want to be assimilated. He's of the mind that this isn't representative of all of Molenbeek, but is a completely accurate picture of significant parts of it.

...you also can't assimilate if the native culture doesn't allow assimilation....

Cheers

Agreed, and I mention both several posts back. What I'm trying to point out, because the conversation seems to be all about how the native culture isn't allowing assimilation, but it's clearly a two way street.

 

[Jspear]

Re: Re:

[quote="Jspear]

lol...wrong on so many levels.

What exactly are the differences between the teachings of fundamentalist Islam and fundamentalist Christianity regarding women/women's rights, homosexuals, science, secularism, religious infallibility, what should be taught in schools, believers in other religions, and so on? Can't say I see much daylight between the two.

Fundamental Christianity would say "Love your neighbor as yourself."
Violence is antithetical to this statement. I think your problem is you don't understand what fundamental Christianity is. It could of course be discussed further in the religion thread.

You really should read the Bible sometime.

Everyday.

 

[blutto]

Good article on Molenbeek and assimilation forwarded by my cousin:

http://www.politico.eu/article/molenbeek-broke-my-heart-radicalization-suburb-brussels-gentrification/

Over nine years, as I witnessed the neighborhood become increasingly intolerant. Alcohol became unavailable in most shops and supermarkets; I heard stories of fanatics at the Comte des Flandres metro station who pressured women to wear the veil; Islamic bookshops proliferated, and it became impossible to buy a decent newspaper. With an unemployment rate of 30 percent, the streets were eerily empty until late in the morning. Nowhere was there a bar or café where white, black and brown people would mingle. Instead, I witnessed petty crime, aggression, and frustrated youths who spat at our girlfriends and called them “filthy whores.” If you made a remark, you were inevitably scolded and called a racist. There used to be Jewish shops on Chaussée de Gand, but these were terrorized by gangs of young kids and most closed their doors around 2008. Openly gay people were routinely intimidated, and also packed up their bags.

You can't assimilate people if they don't want to be assimilated. He's of the mind that this isn't representative of all of Molenbeek, but is a completely accurate picture of significant parts of it.

...you also can't assimilate if the native culture doesn't allow assimilation....

Cheers

Agreed, and I mention both several posts back. What I'm trying to point out, because the conversation seems to be all about how the native culture isn't allowing assimilation, but it's clearly a two way street.

....yeah theoretically it is a two way street but generally that two way path is very very asymmetrical with the native culture holding most if not all the power cards....successful assimilation usually means becoming a total "traitor" to your home culture by the third generation....short of some small bits of folk culture not much is allowed to be carried across the assimilation divide ( like Italians eating pasta and Ukrainians eating perogies and Irish drinking Guinness ) ..

.....take as an example the Irish immigration into the USA which started in the 1840's, where the election of JFK in 1960 was a very big deal, in some minds a breakthrough not unlike the election of Obama ( heck even the idea of a Catholic being elected president was a major topic of discussion )... and the Irish had the advantage of sharing the dominant language and being Christian...

......its a very slow march to acceptance which can take generations/decades and the frustration can be high especially when that frustration is punctuated by "race" riots where some of your race are hung from lamp-posts and your neighborhoods get firebombed and you are always under the threat of being beat up by the natives or mistreated by the native authorities ....

....I mean look how well the assimilation of descendants of African slaves is going in the USA as another example....

Cheers

 

[bp92]

Just read a rumor about Anonymous finding some ISIS plans for terrorist attacks this sunday. Possibly not very reliable, but worth keeping an eye on I'd say...
(source)

 

[jmdirt]

I wish that terrorists would just kill each other, and disappear from earth.

OK, back to reality.

 

[Semper Fidelis]

Re:

I wish that terrorists would just kill each other, and disappear from earth.

OK, back to reality.

good luck ...that's not deployment ready.

 

[frenchfry]

Good article on Molenbeek and assimilation forwarded by my cousin:

http://www.politico.eu/article/molenbeek-broke-my-heart-radicalization-suburb-brussels-gentrification/

Over nine years, as I witnessed the neighborhood become increasingly intolerant. Alcohol became unavailable in most shops and supermarkets; I heard stories of fanatics at the Comte des Flandres metro station who pressured women to wear the veil; Islamic bookshops proliferated, and it became impossible to buy a decent newspaper. With an unemployment rate of 30 percent, the streets were eerily empty until late in the morning. Nowhere was there a bar or café where white, black and brown people would mingle. Instead, I witnessed petty crime, aggression, and frustrated youths who spat at our girlfriends and called them “filthy whores.” If you made a remark, you were inevitably scolded and called a racist. There used to be Jewish shops on Chaussée de Gand, but these were terrorized by gangs of young kids and most closed their doors around 2008. Openly gay people were routinely intimidated, and also packed up their bags.

You can't assimilate people if they don't want to be assimilated. He's of the mind that this isn't representative of all of Molenbeek, but is a completely accurate picture of significant parts of it.

...you also can't assimilate if the native culture doesn't allow assimilation....

Cheers

Nothing personal Blutto, but this comment is almost totally irrelevant. France, for example, has a history of assimilating immigrants af all origins. The parents of those who are referred to in the article are better assimilated than their kids.

The problem isn't the "native culture", but the politically correct who would like to make all of us feel guilty by victimising those who are the real problem.

 

[python]

Nothing personal Blutto, but this comment is almost totally irrelevant. France, for example, has a history of assimilating immigrants af all origins. The parents of those who are referred to in the article are better assimilated than their kids.

The problem isn't the "native culture", but the politically correct who would like to make all of us feel guilty by victimising those who are the real problem.

the way i see it, assimilation is not the key issue here, though intuitively, it does seem that an an assimilated immigrant or a refugee should be expected to behave outside the radicalized militant mindset.

but it aint necessarily so. we've heard many stories to the contrary when well educated, fluent in a local language 'non-natives' and natives had tried to join the dark side..

it is the virus of burning resentment for a real or imagined misdeeds that destroys human brain and sole into a wicked desire for blind revenge. it is a sickness that can speak perfect french or english.

i reckon this virus (unfortunately it infected some muslims) breeds and spreads not much different than other extreme ideologies. we humans are yet to understand why some of us can behave like animals and why radicalization and militancy can infect even the civilized and 'cultured' en mass. the nazi past and its spread into the minds of millions may serve as an example.

 

[rhubroma]

Good article on Molenbeek and assimilation forwarded by my cousin:

http://www.politico.eu/article/molenbeek-broke-my-heart-radicalization-suburb-brussels-gentrification/

Over nine years, as I witnessed the neighborhood become increasingly intolerant. Alcohol became unavailable in most shops and supermarkets; I heard stories of fanatics at the Comte des Flandres metro station who pressured women to wear the veil; Islamic bookshops proliferated, and it became impossible to buy a decent newspaper. With an unemployment rate of 30 percent, the streets were eerily empty until late in the morning. Nowhere was there a bar or café where white, black and brown people would mingle. Instead, I witnessed petty crime, aggression, and frustrated youths who spat at our girlfriends and called them “filthy whores.” If you made a remark, you were inevitably scolded and called a racist. There used to be Jewish shops on Chaussée de Gand, but these were terrorized by gangs of young kids and most closed their doors around 2008. Openly gay people were routinely intimidated, and also packed up their bags.

You can't assimilate people if they don't want to be assimilated. He's of the mind that this isn't representative of all of Molenbeek, but is a completely accurate picture of significant parts of it.

...you also can't assimilate if the native culture doesn't allow assimilation....

Cheers

Nothing personal Blutto, but this comment is almost totally irrelevant. France, for example, has a history of assimilating immigrants af all origins. The parents of those who are referred to in the article are better assimilated than their kids.

The problem isn't the "native culture", but the politically correct who would like to make all of us feel guilty by victimising those who are the real problem.

There are, at the same time, problems that were victims of the system. Political correctness is hypocritical, but so is the system which doesn't know the value of auto-criticism.

We read, today, that these criminals want to make war against our "lifestyle," and we the people of Europe and the West declare war to defend them. Innocent deaths, massacres, young kamikazes, Israeli raids, bombardments, proclamations of war: all in the name of a "lifestyle." This lifestyle would then be connected with (just) leisure and (legitimate) pleasure: the aperitif at the cafe, dinner in a restaurant, a rock concert, a football match. The real threat is having to renounce these things. Thus the Marseilles becomes Europe's anthem of the "défense de la terasse." However, when we sing the Marseilles do we, or do we not, defend its values of liberty, equality and fraternity? That is when we sing are we making a serious reflection on what is meant by a responsible exercise of those values, or to the contrary are we merely being hypocritical (the opposite of politically correct)? Perhaps, then, rather than the enth call to arms, we should rethink "us," our history, the mistakes that the West has made.

This reflection is important, because our West has made many mistakes, in the historical past and recently. These days in Italy Oriana Fallaci's writings are frequently being reevaluated. Her anti-Islam rhetoric is, however, not being set against her fervent support of Bush's war in Iraq, which is at the origin of many of our actual troubles. It's also being forgotten that a strong economic interest was behind the motivation of France's military intervention in Libya and the subsequent ousting of Gheddafi and the cycle of violence this created. The West, in other words, liberated itself from two bloody dictators, but at a super high cost, without considering in the least the repercussions for eliminating them. Question: why weren't those consequences evaluated? One suspects that other, even stronger, interests gained the upper hand for their elimination, no matter how sinister.

Our West, however, still has an advantage over the Islamic world as a whole: it has developed a culture beyond the supernatural domain of religious dogma. Daryush Shayegan, Iranian philosopher and author of Cultural Schizophrenia: Islamic Societies Confronting the West, asked 24 Arab intellectuals about the status of Islamic society. All were unanimous in agreeing that it's simply no longer possible, in the contemporary world, to live by a private and public "lifestyle" that's fifteen centuries old. In other words it's appalling to categorically reject every civil and social conquest since the Middle Ages, which isn't little.

In any case, what this world soarly needs is objectivity.

 

[Amsterhammer]

I am traveling to Antwerp today,and will be spending the night there - with eyes wide open, though I refuse to become fearful or paranoid. Will report on security, etc.

 

[Echoes]

The Islamophobes are betraying themselves.

They claim that the Molembeek area of Brussels did not assimilate** to our culture because you don't easily get beers there, as if that was something negative.

However the Abdeslam brothers owned a pub in Molenbeek where alcohol was pumping out, where you smoked fags or weed, where you could listen to rap music, etc. So the conclusion is, according to these Islamophobes' standards, terrorists are perfectly assimilated to our culture. That is actually what I have always claimed and been laughed at on these boards. The liberal education and environment that Europe has evolved to, because of Enlightenment philosophers and May '68 thinking, produced decerebrated individuals without any notion of social duties and respect for the neighbourhood. Props to this poster for betraying himself.

Worth pointing out as well that these terrorists did not commit their acts to serve God or whatever but strictly for the money, like any good atheists. But I guess I did not have to repeat that, you all knew it of course.

You can't easily get beers in Molenbeek (which is factually wrong by the way, I'm in Brussels), that would be a blessing, of course. It actually reminds me of an analysis that Luiza Narvaez, the former Duchess of Valencia, made about Belgium when she wrote a biography of Leon Degrelle. Marxism has transformed respectful Catholic feasts into mere carousals in which beer was pumping out. And that is still true today. The Marxist/Trotskyist ideology damaged the working class in such a way that it turned it into consumers (of beer for example) instead of responsible family people. In other words, Marxism made them dépendent on capitalism instead of being rebels. In other words, they became useful idiots. And this is still absolutely true today...

**The so-called French assimilation model is actually not French, it's Jacobine/Republican. The pre-1789 monarchs never cared to "assimilate". You had to be a Catholic, that's all. The Baron of Saint-Castin (1652-1707) married the daughter of an Amerindian chief and she came to the court of Louis XIV. No problem of integratiopn and of racism whatsoever.

In the secularist era, however, you had to "assimilate" which, as Eric Zemmour pointed out (in his opinion, it's positive but he's just insane), it means "to make the same". It means that we should all be the same people, think the same way, etc. This very much looks like the school of the Republic of the late 19th century, the one which colonized all Africa because Africans had to be like us, because "the superior races had duties towards the inferior races" (said the leading Republican leader Jules Ferry in that era), the Republican school that presented the pre-1789 as "Dark Ages", etc. etc.*** Of course, these people do not respect family values. Assimilation is a way for the Republicans to make sure that second generation migrants disavow their families and become atomised individuals without any roots, without any environment, without any social duties. Pure consumers, fitting in the liberal/libertarian system.

***It all reminds me of the clip of Pink Floyd's Another Brick in the Wall (long time I haven't heard it ) with all the pupils wearing the same masks and then crushed by a factory machine. The mask motive definitely epitomises the will to conformism, the make the pupil look all alike. It's scary.

These days in Italy Oriana Fallaci's writings are frequently being reevaluated. Her anti-Islam rhetoric is, however, not being set against her fervent support of Bush's war in Iraq, which is at the origin of many of our actual troubles.

Truly amazing that all these Iraq War advocates in Europe are leftist and die-hard Islamophobes. I don't believe in coïncidences. Always consolidâtes my theories of course.

 

[frenchfry]

On my way home from Sunday morning ride I skirted the neighborhood that made national news for having a curfew (which was lifted last night by the way). Saw women in niqabs going to Carrefour. WTF, so they are really athiests hiding behind Islamic smokescreen clothing! Only an athiest would participate in such an unholy act as shopping on a Sunday morning. Even I, confirmed athiest if ever there was one, don't do that.

Echos, what is your take on these Islamo/Athiests?