2016 Giro d'Italia, Stage 19: Pinerolo - Risoul (162 km MTF)

[Eshnar]

Re:

i've only seen the last hour, was SK with chavez and nibs when he crashed? if so is it not a bit gauche to attack the leader in those circumstances?

he was with them, but they were already attacking and Valverde was dropped. Kruijswijk just crashed in the worst possible situation.

 

[Pricey_sky]

Re:

i've only seen the last hour, was SK with chavez and nibs when he crashed? if so is it not a bit gauche to attack the leader in those circumstances?

Yes he was. They were trying to stay clear of the Valverde/Majka group behind them.

 

[ice&fire]

Re: Re:

How can Nibali be so good all of a sudden? I just don't understand cycling I guess, this is simply bizarre.

Comebacks like that don't happen too often do they...in fact over the past 30+ years I think I only saw it twice, in 2006 with Landis/TDF/doping and in 2012 with Bertie/Vuelta/Tactics.

Well, he put 50'' on Chaves and Nieve, but he was 4th overall bacause of a bad day at ITT. It's not really THAT comeback, He was just a bit better while the others where a little worse, if u put on a graph Valverde and Nibali delay forn the MR, they cross a lot in this giro, it really depends on good days and bad days, without any particular reason.

A bad day at ITT? Didn't you watch the day before? And last Tuesday?

 

[Moviefan1203]

This is why the sport is so exciting. One beautiful stage that is raced hard can change everything. I'm not a huge fan of Nibali, but I respect the hell out of him. He went down swinging, and he landed some massive blows.

 

[jmdirt]

Re:

i've only seen the last hour, was SK with chavez and nibs when he crashed? if so is it not a bit gauche to attack the leader in those circumstances?

Not IMO (in that situation). Bike handling is part of winning. Plus, if they wait for him, they also wait for everyone else that they dropped on the climb.

 

[DFA123]

Re:

This is why the sport is so exciting. One beautiful stage that is raced hard can change everything. I'm not a huge fan of Nibali, but I respect the hell out of him. He went down swinging, and he landed some massive blows.

Exactly this. Kruijswijk was always vulnerable with such a poor team and with his lack of experience. And a true champion like Nibali wasn't going to go lying down.

 

[Irondan]

Re: 2016 Giro d'Italia, Stage 19: Pinerolo - Risoul (162 km

My post expressing the hope that Nibali's performance is looked at closely was removed but it seems i'm not the only person who is expressing some skepticism about his performance.

Obviously you're new to the forum. Doping talk and insinuation of any kind (outside of the clinic) is strictly prohibited. I told you that already in the warning you got. Maybe you ignored it?

Nobody is being skeptical of any performance in this thread because it's PROHIBITED to talk about doping outside of the clinic. Since this thread is in the Professional Road Race subforum, it falls under this rule. To think that every member of this forum feels differently than you is just silly.

Please read all rules and stickies of the forum before posting another comment, and stop with the doping insinuations. Also, when you get a warning from mods, read it!

Cheers

Forum Administrator

 

[kareeem]

Re:

How can Nibali be so good all of a sudden? I just don't understand cycling I guess, this is simply bizarre.

It's not like he didn't show any weakness. He was dropped on Cima Coppi but then Chaves, Kruijswijk and Valverde started looking at eachother and let the others rejoin.

 

[DNP-Old]

Betancur DNF.

 

[Andro]

I just rewatched Chaves cross the line and I have no idea how they clock it at 53".

 

[Akuryo]

Re:

Betancur DNF.

To be honest, he did way more than I expected him to. Better than the last two years. We need to see the positive things and he got better since joining Movistar.

 

[carton]

Re: Re:

"mañana si le puedo ayudar a Esteban Chaves lo haré''

Uran is going to help Chavito tomorrow if needed.

Who pays Urán's wages?

Uran was sick, fought through it, kept a top-10. JV looks pleased. If he would've kept quiet he'd be in a better position to help Chaves, if he was really committed to it. I think it was just an encouragement, a public show of support. He probably won't attack Chaves, but I'm sure if he has the legs he'll go for the win.

I read that Steve said it was a mistake and it was his fault at post race, but his director did him no favors.

You're asking for a lot from one of the lowest-funded teams in the WorldTour.

I just rewatched Chaves cross the line and I have no idea how they clock it at 53".

Me either.

 

[Flat Out]

Re: Re:

How can Nibali be so good all of a sudden? I just don't understand cycling I guess, this is simply bizarre.

Comebacks like that don't happen too often do they...in fact over the past 30+ years I think I only saw it twice, in 2006 with Landis/TDF/doping and in 2012 with Bertie/Vuelta/Tactics.

Well, he put 50'' on Chaves and Nieve, but he was 4th overall bacause of a bad day at ITT. It's not really THAT comeback, He was just a bit better while the others where a little worse, if u put on a graph Valverde and Nibali delay forn the MR, they cross a lot in this giro, it really depends on good days and bad days, without any particular reason.

A bad day at ITT? Didn't you watch the day before? And last Tuesday?

I did, nevertheless i wouldnt say being 4' behinf the MR (but way less behind Chaves) was that bad, he wasnt top form but not that bad. A comeback would be like 10', today the effect was amplified by MR crash and difficulties

 

[DNP-Old]

Re: Re:

Betancur DNF.

To be honest, he did way more than I expected him to. Better than the last two years. We need to see the positive things and he got better since joining Movistar.

True. Although, when you're this close to Turin, you should finish imo (assuming he isn't ill or fell or w/e). I guess his tank is just empty. The man rode a lot of races in a span of two months. He'll be ready for la Vuelta!

 

[Carols]

Re:

I've been following cycling since 1997 when I was 10 years old and still waiting for a Dutch GT win, oh well...

I've been following cycling since 1961 when I was 11 years old. I think the last Dutch GT winner was Joop Zoetemelk in 1980, so you should be due soon .

 

[Eyeballs Out]

Ifs buts and maybes but if SK had ridden more aggressively in the final kms of Colle dell'Agnello (it looked like he was the strongest again there) then he could have bought himself some time to descend a bit more carefully - take his own lines up till the less technical sections

 

[Libertine Seguros]

Wow, I jokingly made the suggestion Nibali would win this stage and put 5 minutes on a lonely Kruijswijk thanks to differences made with descending in a parody copy of the 2005 Pajáres stage with Nibali as Heras and Kruijswijk as Menchov (obviously competing for the same lineage team). That prediction proved waaaaaay closer to the truth than I anticipated!

 

[Flat Out]

Re: Re:

How can Nibali be so good all of a sudden? I just don't understand cycling I guess, this is simply bizarre.

It's not like he didn't show any weakness. He was dropped on Cima Coppi but then Chaves, Kruijswijk and Valverde started looking at eachother and let the others rejoin.

He wasn't dropped at all in Cima Coppi!!!!
Chaves attacked, SK followed with Valverde, then Valverde dops and Nib crawl back pacing his tempo, it's the best strategy because every other time he tried to follow, he was dropped...
When they arrived at Cima Coppi, he was with Chaves and SK with Valverde 40'' behind

 

[More Strides than Rides]

I missed most of the discussion, but who was the Garmin rider that flew past Kruiswijk on the descent? Kruiswijk didn't even try to keep in contact.

 

[carton]

Re:

I missed most of the discussion, but who was the Garmin rider that flew past Kruiswijk on the descent? Kruiswijk didn't even try to keep in contact.

Clarke

 

[Flat Out]

Re:

Ifs buts and maybes but if SK had ridden more aggressively in the final kms of Colle dell'Agnello (it looked like he was the strongest again there) then he could have bought himself some time to descend a bit more carefully - take his own lines up till the less technical sections

He said he was at his limit there, Nbali was pacing really high to drop Valverde.

 

[Volderke]

Re:

Ifs buts and maybes but if SK had ridden more aggressively in the final kms of Colle dell'Agnello (it looked like he was the strongest again there) then he could have bought himself some time to descend a bit more carefully - take his own lines up till the less technical sections

I was thinking exactly the same. You know the descent can be tricky, so just make sure when you are better, that you cross first and you take the first steep high altitude curves (the most tricky ones) in your own pace until dropped riders join (or not).

 

[Carl0880]

Re: Re:

"mañana si le puedo ayudar a Esteban Chaves lo haré''

Uran is going to help Chavito tomorrow if needed.

Who pays Urán's wages?

Uran was sick, fought through it, kept a top-10. JV looks pleased. If he would've kept quiet he'd be in a better position to help Chaves, if he was really committed to it. I think it was just an encouragement, a public show of support. He probably won't attack Chaves, but I'm sure if he has the legs he'll go for the win.

I read that Steve said it was a mistake and it was his fault at post race, but his director did him no favors.

You're asking for a lot from one of the lowest-funded teams in the WorldTour.

I went to more detail in another post, but I am not referring to the quality of riders, I was referring to not getting someone in a 28 man break. When you know your own team is not strong, and such a big gap in GC, and a rider like Nibali who is willing to gamble, you should have figured that a longer range attack was possible. So if something happened to SK like a crash, then a guy in the break would have been an essential insurance policy. Did any of us think what happened to SK today would? Of Course not, but in their position, you got to plan for all possibilities. If it was only a 4-6 man break, considering the terrain, then I would not be as critical. But a 28 man break, someone should have been there.

 

[Valv.Piti]

Re:

Wow, I jokingly made the suggestion Nibali would win this stage and put 5 minutes on a lonely Kruijswijk thanks to differences made with descending in a parody copy of the 2005 Pajáres stage with Nibali as Heras and Kruijswijk as Menchov (obviously competing for the same lineage team). That prediction proved waaaaaay closer to the truth than I anticipated!

Scary similiaries... all we needed was a blizzard to make it one for the ages!

 

[BullsFan22]

Re:

Wow, I jokingly made the suggestion Nibali would win this stage and put 5 minutes on a lonely Kruijswijk thanks to differences made with descending in a parody copy of the 2005 Pajáres stage with Nibali as Heras and Kruijswijk as Menchov (obviously competing for the same lineage team). That prediction proved waaaaaay closer to the truth than I anticipated!

Yes, but I don't think Menchov crashed.