Teams & Riders Alberto Contador Discussion Thread

[Ricco']

Re:

From FB:
https://www.facebook.com/tinkoffsport/videos/vb.121540094614638/844411122327528/?type=2&theater&notif_t=live_video&notif_id=1467453627261090

Anyone to translate what he says?
I can probably understand that the wounds are just superficial (?)

Journo: Alberto, how did you get up today?

Contador: Well bad. In truth, I could sleep a little more than yesterday but on the other day was the right side, yesterday was the left. I don't have superficial wounds but I'm very sore, especially on ??? and we have a long day ahead of us, tomorrow another and I hope that little by little the body can stabilize and I hope that I can get better before the Pyrenees. On one side, I'm motivated, I'm in very good shape and with little weight but it's that that this Tour is putting my morale to test. It is many months of work, to get here and start this way but this is cycling and I want to thank everyone for their support, they are the ones who keep me motivated and we have to cross our fingers to have a calm day.

Journo: What do you think about the claims that if the team didn't set up Sagan you would have lost less time?

Contador: Yesterday was a difficult situation to control because it was in the last moments. It's good to achieve victories in the team and that type of things ??? (probably, doesn't matter).

 

[Miburo]

Sky will definitely go insane on wednesday to test Alberto, if they can eliminate him then they won't hesitate. But if he survives it, i think he'll be fine

 

[The Hitch]

Re: Re:

From FB:
https://www.facebook.com/tinkoffsport/videos/vb.121540094614638/844411122327528/?type=2&theater&notif_t=live_video&notif_id=1467453627261090

Anyone to translate what he says?
I can probably understand that the wounds are just superficial (?)

Journo: Alberto, how did you get up today?

Contador: Well bad. In truth, I could sleep a little more than yesterday but on the other day was the right side, yesterday was the left. I don't have superficial wounds but I'm very sore, especially on ??? .

Calf muscle

 

[CheckMyPecs]

Re: Re:

Journo: Alberto, how did you get up today?

Contador: Well bad. In truth, I could sleep a little more than yesterday but on the other day was the right side, yesterday was the left. I don't have superficial wounds but I'm very sore, especially on [my hamstring] and we have a long day ahead of us, tomorrow another and I hope that little by little the body can stabilize and I hope that I can get better before the Pyrenees. On one side, I'm motivated, I'm in very good shape and with little weight but it's that that this Tour is putting my morale to test. It is many months of work, to get here and start this way but this is cycling and I want to thank everyone for their support, they are the ones who keep me motivated and we have to cross our fingers to have a calm day.

Journo: What do you think about the claims that if the team didn't set up Sagan you would have lost less time?

Contador: Yesterday was a difficult situation to control because it was in the last moments. It's good to achieve victories in the team and that type of things [nothing, just mumbling] (probably, doesn't matter).

 

[buchanan]

Re: Re:

I'll still give Contador a chance to come back, or maybe quintana can hurt Froome's legacy, but if it happens. all the arguments about how Contador is better because in the least important gt he beat froome twice, while Froome's been dominating the one that actually matters, need to take a back seat[/quote]

7 GTs over 3 Tours any day[/quote]
Its 5, not 7 and 2 are asterixed[/quote]

5? I already discounted 2010 and 2011

Nvm, just read that you're only talking about this decade, in which case I agree with your original post[/quote]
Who looks at only one decade? Murray is about on par with Federer this decade. See how much it matters?[/quote]

We all know (though can't say it) that Froome was "different" before 2011.

Obviously Contador's domination prior to that puts him over Froome career wise.

But Contador and Froome clearly have a rivalry and if Froome wins this Tour, then we can say he has absolutely dominated the rivalry. Even though Contador won gts back when Froome couldn't finish in the autobus, so he may retire the better rider, Froome dominated the rivalry (if he wins this tour).

Since you use a tennis example, well its like Nadal and Federer was in 2011. Federer had more grand slams and was the better all time player, but Nadal was dominating the rivalry and making Federer cry.

Only its even more one sided when it comes to Contador vs Froome.[/quote]

Agree with this. You can only really discuss their rivalry in the timeframe they're both at or near the top, actually competing against each other trying to win the same GC's. It makes no sense to highlight results before Froome was even a GC contender. We know he had problems with bilharzia, etc. prior to 2011.
You might as well say "where was Nadal in 2003-2006 when Federer was dominating tennis and easily winning Slams?"
The answer would be that Nadal was still very young and climbing the ladder.

 

[phanatic]

Re:

i'll say this.
IF Froome wins this TOur, there is no argument for Cotnador as far as 2010's go. Its a wash.

I'll still give Contador a chance to come back, or maybe quintana can hurt Froome's legacy, but if it happens. all the arguments about how Contador is better because in the least important gt he beat froome twice, while Froome's been dominating the one that actually matters, need to take a back seat

Bertie was better in 2010 and 2011. He was arguably better in 2012. He was clearly better in 2014. He was not far behind in 2015 and one day he may even get the recognition he deserves for beating Aru/Landa. I do like the Tennis comparison though: both Nadal and Froome dominate in France. If the Giro and Vuelta can be compared to the US and Australian Opens, and the Classics to Wimbledon, it is clear which unmentionable rider really dominates the 2010's. Disclaimer: I hate Team Sky. :lol:

 

[Gigs_98]

Looks as if the 2nd crash was a bigger problem than I first thought. On the other hand it's actually a good sign that he said that this night his left side was the one which hurt, because that probably means his right side is already getting better and we don't have to fear that his injuries won't really get better during the tour. Wednesday will be a huge challenge, but I don't know if sky dares to already put the hammer down on the first two climbs since that's still quite far away from the finish, and the 3rd one should be possible to survive for Alberto. And tbh, if he drops on that 3rd category climb, all hope for the Pyrenees is lost anyway.

 

[PremierAndrew]

The 2014 vuelta was the exception. It's not just the grand tours that froome has been better than contador in, but his record against contador in other week long stage races also has to be considered when discussing the dominant stage racers of the decade

 

[The Hitch]

Re: Re:

[quote="buchanan"We know he had problems with bilharzia, etc. prior to 2011.[/quote]
Actually, we know for a fact that he didn't.

 

[Miburo]

Re:

The 2014 vuelta was the exception. It's not just the grand tours that froome has been better than contador in, but his record against contador in other week long stage races also has to be considered when discussing the dominant stage racers of the decade

Not as bad as it looks though.

Froome won the dauphine in '13 and '16 over Contador. Then Oman '13. And was also better in TA '13

In the latest 3 editions of catalunya Contador was far superior than Froome.

And we all know Froome will never show himself in PV

 

[Pricey_sky]

Re: Re:

The 2014 vuelta was the exception. It's not just the grand tours that froome has been better than contador in, but his record against contador in other week long stage races also has to be considered when discussing the dominant stage racers of the decade

Not as bad as it looks though.

Froome won the dauphine in '13 and '16 over Contador. Then Oman '13. And was also better in TA '13

In the latest 3 editions of catalunya Contador was far superior than Froome.

And we all know Froome will never show himself in PV

I'd be worried if a GC guy didn't beat Froome in Catalunya to be honest, he only treats the race as a leg stretcher.

 

[Miburo]

Same can be said about Contador in the dauphine

Freaking brajkovic beat him

 

[Pricey_sky]

Re:

Same can be said about Contador in the dauphine

Freaking brajkovic beat him

Pretty sure Contador said in the Dauphine this year that he wanted to keep the yellow jersey though.

 

[Miburo]

Re: Re:

Same can be said about Contador in the dauphine

Freaking brajkovic beat him

Pretty sure Contador said in the Dauphine this year that he wanted to keep the yellow jersey though.

Pretty sure Contador's level in the tour is way higher than in the dauphine.

What do you think Froome will say if he's in the lead in catalunya? And he tried to be competitive this year and in 2014

 

[PremierAndrew]

Re: Re:

Same can be said about Contador in the dauphine

Freaking brajkovic beat him

Pretty sure Contador said in the Dauphine this year that he wanted to keep the yellow jersey though.

Pretty sure Contador's level in the tour is way higher than in the dauphine.

What do you think Froome will say if he's in the lead in catalunya? And he tried to be competitive this year and in 2014

You say that as if froome tour level isn't much higher than dauphine level. Last year he was struggling against TeJay in the dauphine and then a few weeks later he's absolutely destroying the peloton on psm.

Catalunya can't be ignored, but in general froome has been superior to contador in stage races since his transformation. (Not to mention that froome could easily have been sitting on a vuelta and a tour before the start of 13 as well if it wasn't for sky)

 

[LaFlorecita]

Re: Re:

Same can be said about Contador in the dauphine

Freaking brajkovic beat him

Pretty sure Contador said in the Dauphine this year that he wanted to keep the yellow jersey though.

Of course, it would have been odd if he'd said "I'm not even going to try to keep the jersey".

 

[ILovecycling]

Looks as if the 2nd crash was a bigger problem than I first thought. On the other hand it's actually a good sign that he said that this night his left side was the one which hurt, because that probably means his right side is already getting better and we don't have to fear that his injuries won't really get better during the tour. Wednesday will be a huge challenge, but I don't know if sky dares to already put the hammer down on the first two climbs since that's still quite far away from the finish, and the 3rd one should be possible to survive for Alberto. And tbh, if he drops on that 3rd category climb, all hope for the Pyrenees is lost anyway.

True,we can be pretty sure about that as he said his biggest problem is the calf (which I believe was hurt in the 2nd crash - freakin idiot Tony Martin! )


OTOH its pretty sure that Froome and Quintana will be on the monster form which complicates things for Wednesday and mainly Aspin. We knew before Tour that Quintana and Contador will hang onto Froome wheel for dear life during his first attack in Pyrenees...we probably all know whats gonna happen when AC is not 100% healthy...

 

[lenric]

If he only has muscle soreness, he will be ok in the next 2/3 days. No problemo, especially with all the fancy massages he gets.

 

[Carols]

The other rivals will put him under as much pressure as possible, at every opportunity, in order to negate him as a threat. It is the way of cycling, take advantage of weakness when it exists. He is hurting, they will make sure he hurts as much as possible. Stage 5 will be critical if he manages to make it that far as they will all be gunning for his scalp. We just have to wait and see how he comes along.

Hopefully today he at least stays on the bike! I think Tinkoff will support Sagan to keep yellow and assign Alberto a wing man to nurse him through the stage as well as possible.

 

[Mongolian Mayhem]

Someone earlier said that Froome would crash and lose a tonne of time...well, I think they jinxed Contador... :surprised:

 

[SafeBet]

It's crazy to think he's done for this Tour. He's one of the biggest cycling talents we've ever witnessed and he's just 50 seconds down with a dozen hard stages still to ride.
I guess fans never learn. We learnt that anything can happen in a GT not longer than 40 days ago.

 

[rune1107]

Re:

It's crazy to think he's done for this Tour. He's one of the biggest cycling talents we've ever witnessed and he's just 50 seconds down with a dozen hard stages still to ride.
I guess fans never learn. We learnt that anything can happen in a GT not longer than 40 days ago.

I completely agree with you! I have been on vacation so I have only heard about the crashes after the first 2 stages. But it is comforting to hear that the side he crashed on, on stage 1, is already getting better. If he survives stage 5, he still has a good shot of making the podium, and possibly winning the tour.

 

[Gigs_98]

Btw, I don't really get why people say Froome will be the winner of their rivalry if Contador doesn't win because of his injuries. Up to this point Froome hasn't won more gt's against Contador than Contador against Froome, so it's pretty even and I don't really understand why another gt win with uneven circumstances should be the crucial victory for Froome. They have just never faced each other when both were in top shape, and if Contador looses this tour because of his early crashes the situation stays the same.

And about the race, if Contador is less than 6 minutes behind Froome after the ITT he will at least cause fireworks because then he will be in top shape and has absolutely nothing to loose. He has basically no chance to win with such a disadvantage but we would at least get a good show and he will make it extremely difficult for whoever is leading at the time.

 

[vedrafjord]

Agreed - after all he fell twice in the 2011 Tour and finished 5th. Arguably the Giro took more out of him than the crashes did.

 

[jmdirt]

Re: Re:

I think this will prove to be Contrador's undoing. Road rash injuries take energy and loss of sleep, which leads to less power, especially in the mountains. He's tough but you can't beat someone who's 100 percent healthy. Sorry. I see third place as the best he can do.

So you are assuming that nothing bad will happen to any of the other GC guys?

He's got a point. And there's no reason to think that others will fall. Their chance of having something bad tomorrow or during any stage is the same as Contador. Except that today he fell, and they didn't.

Showing up at the Pyrenees after bad nights vs. rested guys can make a difference.

Now, for the "it's his fault" or "bad placement" argument, we should all know by now that the first week of the TdF always sets the stage for this. Everybody is nervous, all make small mistakes, but some pay the mistakes cash. It's luck. Be in the right place at the right time. It has nothing to do with skills,tactics. It's luck. Ask Froome: Defending champion, tons of crap the following year, comes back and wins.

Every Tour, some get lucky, some don't. The following year, somehow, flies harass a different donkey...no need for second guessing, judging...it's racing.

What happened to Porte today is exactly what I was talking about. A lot can happen in three weeks of racing: crashes, flats, mechanicals, bonks, etc.