Teams & Riders Alberto Contador Discussion Thread

[Moose McKnuckles]

i wonder how he made such a big improvement in the tour that year?

Probably the same way Froome went from being pack fodder to superstar. Just trained harder.

 

[Taxus4a]

Do you know more about the spanish championships?

It is not so hard as seems in a glance, but it is enough hard for him...but Valverde and Purito will be as well

 

[Nilsson]

Probably the same way Froome went from being pack fodder to superstar. Just trained harder.

With that difference that Contador already had won a lot of races and showed great promise in both climbing and Time Trialing (from the first day he entered the peloton). Due to circumstances it was only his second GT, although only 24 years of age, but the characteristics have clearly always been there.

 

[Moviefan1203]

With that difference that Contador already had won a lot of races and showed great promise in both climbing and Time Trialing (from the first day he entered the peloton). Due to circumstances it was only his second GT, although only 24 years of age, but the characteristics have clearly always been there.

Don't forget his appetite for steak.

 

[BabylonFell]

He's missing that last few percent of form that takes him to the next level....he has a few weeks to find it

What strikes me is the way he's seemed to miss those few procent all year. Every rider prepares for goals in different ways, sure, but it is striking that Contador seems to have almost the same racing schedule as he did before his ban (which makes me conclude that his training schedule is also largely similar), and yet seems to lack strength in almost every race compared to past efforts. In the past he was always, almost without exception, a force to be reckoned with no matter the race, and this year he's beeing left in the dust by riders who are by no means considered major contenders for the Tour. This, of course, wasn't the case in yesterdays stage.

He has always prepared for a specific goal, and in a rather focused way, whether it was the Giro or Tour de France, but he has never been one to pass on quite a few victories during his preparations. It's not that he hasn't tried to snatch a few during this season, but he's been thoroughly unable to bring it home.

All questions will be answered in a good months time in any case, which I'm looking very much forward to. But if we take this season into consideration as an indicator of what will happen in July, then the famous few procent that Contador is missing isn't a question of building up form, but a general decrease in ability since his ban, as it would be fair to suspect that Contador isn't the only favorite for the tour that hasn't peaked yet...

 

[pdluz7]

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/contador-im-where-i-want-to-be


Anything is possible and writing off Contador at this stage, as every one of his rivals makes clear, is a foolish move. Finally, he's asked what it would mean to win his first Tour de France since 2009, or is it 2010?

"It was 2010, of course. For me this Tour is 100 per cent mine. It might not say so in the books but what's more important to me is how I feel about it, and how others close to me feel about it."

 

[Jelantik]

What strikes me is the way he's seemed to miss those few procent all year. Every rider prepares for goals in different ways, sure, but it is striking that Contador seems to have almost the same racing schedule as he did before his ban (which makes me conclude that his training schedule is also largely similar), and yet seems to lack strength in almost every race compared to past efforts. In the past he was always, almost without exception, a force to be reckoned with no matter the race, and this year he's beeing left in the dust by riders who are by no means considered major contenders for the Tour. This, of course, wasn't the case in yesterdays stage.

He has always prepared for a specific goal, and in a rather focused way, whether it was the Giro or Tour de France, but he has never been one to pass on quite a few victories during his preparations. It's not that he hasn't tried to snatch a few during this season, but he's been thoroughly unable to bring it home.

maybe it got something to do with the arrival of De Jong and Rogers from sky. There's gotta be. I would be shocked if saxo didn't hire them with the mind of getting to know the new method. In the 6 months of Contador's band, sky revolution of training method started to show how the new matra of racing with number can have a great effect. Contador certainly can't just race like the way he used to be. The game is changing now. Everyone got their number based on what their genetics. Maybe now, saxo started looking up more closely of data than it used to be and try to apply different method. Watch rogers movie in saxobank cycling page. http://www.saxobank.com/cycling/. He talked about how if you can squezze 0.5 % or 1 more percent and the next thing you know 1% here, 1% there.. you ended getting more than just 1%.

Contador moved to Lugano also probably part of the reason of the training changes. He said that he can train with more of his teammate (got more motivation) under the direct guidance of Bjarne (Bjarne lives in Lugano). Kerrison in one of his interview said that sky is the only team who offer "one on one" coach to rider ratio. He was surprised that most team let their rider train at their own device. We are all know, sky practically lives in Tenerife. Anyway just offering some observation..

 

[BabylonFell]

maybe it got something to do with the arrival of De Jong and Rogers from sky. There's gotta be. I would be shocked if saxo didn't hire them with the mind of getting to know the new method. In the 6 months of Contador's band, sky revolution of training method started to show how the new matra of racing with number can have a great effect. Contador certainly can't just race like the way he used to be. The game is changing now. Everyone got their number based on what their genetics. Maybe now, saxo started looking up more closely of data than it used to be and try to apply different method. Watch rogers movie in saxobank cycling page. http://www.saxobank.com/cycling/. He talked about how if you can squezze 0.5 % or 1 more percent and the next thing you know 1% here, 1% there.. you ended getting more than just 1%.

Contador moved to Lugano also probably part of the reason of the training changes. He said that he can train with more of his teammate (got more motivation) under the direct guidance of Bjarne (Bjarne lives in Lugano). Kerrison in one of his interview said that sky is the only team who offer "one on one" coach to rider ratio. He was surprised that most team let their rider train at their own device. We are all know, sky practically lives in Tenerife. Anyway just offering some observation..

You may be right, but in that case the new training methods hasn't worked very well for Contador yet. One of the stunning things about Sky's performances is their riders' ability to perform on a consistently high level for large parts of the season. It isn't just that they use innovative training methods to get to 100% at the Tour. Of course that's part of it is well...

Not to say that Contador hasn't been consistent (apart from his horrible performances at the ardennes classics), he's just been a tad weaker than the 3-5 best riders at each race, consistently. Three years ago that would have been completely unheard of.

And of course I'm not writing off Contador for the Tour de France. I'm sure he will be there and will be a major factor i the mountains. I just fear (or hope, depending on the mood) that he will lack these few procent in the Tour as well. That they are lost forever. I could well be wrong, of course.

In any case, I hope he will ride the Tour like a dog with rabies, but I also sincerely hope that he loses in the end. Not to say that i hope Froome will come out the victor. But if we get an exciting and beautiful race I won't complain either way.

 

[Fatclimber]

maybe it got something to do with the arrival of De Jong and Rogers from sky. There's gotta be. I would be shocked if saxo didn't hire them with the mind of getting to know the new method. In the 6 months of Contador's band, sky revolution of training method started to show how the new matra of racing with number can have a great effect. Contador certainly can't just race like the way he used to be. The game is changing now. Everyone got their number based on what their genetics. Maybe now, saxo started looking up more closely of data than it used to be and try to apply different method. Watch rogers movie in saxobank cycling page. http://www.saxobank.com/cycling/. He talked about how if you can squezze 0.5 % or 1 more percent and the next thing you know 1% here, 1% there.. you ended getting more than just 1%.

Contador moved to Lugano also probably part of the reason of the training changes. He said that he can train with more of his teammate (got more motivation) under the direct guidance of Bjarne (Bjarne lives in Lugano). Kerrison in one of his interview said that sky is the only team who offer "one on one" coach to rider ratio. He was surprised that most team let their rider train at their own device. We are all know, sky practically lives in Tenerife. Anyway just offering some observation..

I don't buy this. The Wiggins of last year was doing exactly what Bertie used to do, winning often starting in P-N. Wiggins even took it to the next level and won an early season sprint.

It is obvious Bertie's doing different preparations, but it is nothing like Sky had done for Wiggins. Bertie is doing just fine, he soft pedaled the TT the other day and was within a few seconds of Dawg on the summit finish when he really tried. They will both improve, but maybe their trajectories are different: Bertie's is sharper with more power to be gained and Dawggie is more shallow with less power to be gained. They'll be working on their high-end stuff now anyway so have no fear, the Tour will be a battle.

 

[BabylonFell]

Bertie is doing just fine, he soft pedaled the TT the other day and was within a few seconds of Dawg on the summit finish when he really tried.

Not to burst your bubble, but Froome didn't try to shake off Contador as such. He was going for the stage win. Taking time on Contador is of no importance to Froome right now, so I hardly think i had any interest in wasting energy in order to really distance Contador.

If I were Contador, I wouldn't like to think about what Froome could have managed had he tried to put the hammer down earlier on the climb. He was obviously stronger than Contador, which was made agonizingly clear by the resignation in Contadors face when he finally had to let go of Froome's wheel. He cracked, simple as that.

But I agree, i think they will be close in the mountains in the tour - and hopefully Contador will have to put in attacks non-stop - but today Froome was obviously stronger by som margin.

 

[LaFlorecita]

Froom is not giving up that yellow jersey any time soon mighty fine.

Contador? I don't really see him as fat but if you say so.

Wait wait wait wait please tell me I didn't understand this correctly. Mighty fine? You're saying he looks mighty fine? What

 

[LaFlorecita]

You may be right, but in that case the new training methods hasn't worked very well for Contador yet. One of the stunning things about Sky's performances is their riders' ability to perform on a consistently high level for large parts of the season. It isn't just that they use innovative training methods to get to 100% at the Tour. Of course that's part of it is well...

Not to say that Contador hasn't been consistent (apart from his horrible performances at the ardennes classics), he's just been a tad weaker than the 3-5 best riders at each race, consistently. Three years ago that would have been completely unheard of.

And of course I'm not writing off Contador for the Tour de France. I'm sure he will be there and will be a major factor i the mountains. I just fear (or hope, depending on the mood) that he will lack these few procent in the Tour as well. That they are lost forever. I could well be wrong, of course.

In any case, I hope he will ride the Tour like a dog with rabies, but I also sincerely hope that he loses in the end. Not to say that i hope Froome will come out the victor. But if we get an exciting and beautiful race I won't complain either way.

You fear these few procent are lost forever but yet you hope he loses the tour why do you hope he loses?

 

[LaFlorecita]

Not to burst your bubble, but Froome didn't try to shake off Contador as such. He was going for the stage win. Taking time on Contador is of no importance to Froome right now, so I hardly think i had any interest in wasting energy in order to really distance Contador.

If I were Contador, I wouldn't like to think about what Froome could have managed had he tried to put the hammer down earlier on the climb. He was obviously stronger than Contador, which was made agonizingly clear by the resignation in Contadors face when he finally had to let go of Froome's wheel. He cracked, simple as that.

But I agree, i think they will be close in the mountains in the tour - and hopefully Contador will have to put in attacks non-stop - but today Froome was obviously stronger by som margin.

Believe me, in the tour we'll only see one attack by him max. After that Froome will go. So I guess you'll end up disappointed.

 

[Fatclimber]

Not to burst your bubble, but Froome didn't try to shake off Contador as such. He was going for the stage win. Taking time on Contador is of no importance to Froome right now, so I hardly think i had any interest in wasting energy in order to really distance Contador.

If I were Contador, I wouldn't like to think about what Froome could have managed had he tried to put the hammer down earlier on the climb. He was obviously stronger than Contador, which was made agonizingly clear by the resignation in Contadors face when he finally had to let go of Froome's wheel. He cracked, simple as that.

But I agree, i think they will be close in the mountains in the tour - and hopefully Contador will have to put in attacks non-stop - but today Froome was obviously stronger by som margin.

No worries, my bubble was burst near a decade ago. It's still a preparation race and a good opportunity for everybody to get a few hard intervals in and that's about it for the contenders. Sure, Dawggie Dawgg can be pleased to come out on top but be sure that he is aware that Bertie was not far behind. There is still time to hone the engine. I'm not endorsing Bertie, just saying I think his preparation is going fine.

 

[airstream]

"probably?"

BTW It's only profitable if it wins

If I made bets I'd bet on Contador at 4 to 1, because 1.4 to 1 is obvious bookmaker spear, how much luck any contender need in first week. But it doesn't change the fact that the Alien has more chances

 

[BabylonFell]

You fear these few procent are lost forever but yet you hope he loses the tour why do you hope he loses?

I fear these few procent are lost forever for the sake of the tour. I would like to see him put Froome under serious pressure. I wouldn't want to see him as dominant as in 2009, though.

I hope he loses because he's far from my favorite rider, and over the years I've developed an antipathy for the Saxo-Tinkoff team because of the happy-go-lucky coverage of cycling from danish television. I really can't bare the thought of having to listen to idiots from danish television babble endlessly about the Contador and Saxo-Tinkoff whilst forgetting that there's actually a race going on. It's not just that though. Contador has never been my favorite rider.

It's not that I hope the victory goes to Froome as such, but I wouldn't really mind if it did, as long as the race doesn't turn into a dull Sky-march like last year. I sympathize with Froome in some way, probably because I feel he's been robbed of at least one grand tour victory. And despite the fact that he's completely sacrificed his own chances, even when it was clearly tactically moronic, he's had to listen to buttloads of criticism for being disloyal to the team. I somehow feel like he deserves a grand tour victory.

That being said, I will of course be rooting for my favorite riders. First and foremost i will be rooting for Cunego with gullible optimism. Yeah, I know...

Also, I would love to see Valverde finishing in the top 3 in the Tour de France at last. I'm not optimistic, though.

Van Den Broeck and Evans also. Again, I'm not too optimistic, surely not on behalf of Evans. In any case, it would be neat if someone, anyone, could beat both Froome and Contador.

 

[BabylonFell]

No worries, my bubble was burst near a decade ago. It's still a preparation race and a good opportunity for everybody to get a few hard intervals in and that's about it for the contenders. Sure, Dawggie Dawgg can be pleased to come out on top but be sure that he is aware that Bertie was not far behind. There is still time to hone the engine. I'm not endorsing Bertie, just saying I think his preparation is going fine.

Yeah, I agree. What he's shown in the Dauphiné isn't worrying in itself, and certainly not what he showed on yesterdays stage. My point is that he has been performing below par ever since his return, and that is slightly worrying. Not overtly, but slightly worrying..

 

[notrolfsorensen]

Yeah, I agree. What he's shown in the Dauphiné isn't worrying in itself, and certainly not what he showed on yesterdays stage. My point is that he has been performing below par ever since his return, and that is slightly worrying. Not overtly, but slightly worrying..

Well he might have been doing the same races as earlier, but I believe he said before San Luis that he was 3 kg heavier from the beginning of the season, compared to earlier years, and that he would have a slower build up to the tour this year than earlier years in order to have more in the tank for the tour. Can anyone find the link to an article naming that or am I just imagining things?

 

[BabylonFell]

Well he might have been doing the same races as earlier, but I believe he said before San Luis that he was 3 kg heavier from the beginning of the season, compared to earlier years, and that he would have a slower build up to the tour this year than earlier years in order to have more in the tank for the tour. Can anyone find the link to an article naming that or am I just imagining things?

http://velonews.competitor.com/2013...op-a-few-kilos-during-tour-de-san-luis_271946

There you go. There might have been added a few things in your recollection of this interview, though. It doesn't really say that he'll have a slower build up, but it's implied to some extend.

2013 isn't the first time he has downplayed his form coming in to Tour De San Luis, though. This is what he said ahead of the race in 2012:

"I'm giving priority to having more base in order to be fresher during the main objectives of the season. The training data is good and what I intend now is to hone my weight gradually."

Pretty much the exact same thing.

 

[notrolfsorensen]

http://velonews.competitor.com/2013...op-a-few-kilos-during-tour-de-san-luis_271946

There you go. There might have been added a few things in your recollection of this interview, though. It doesn't really say that he'll have a slower build up, but it's implied to some extend.

2013 isn't the first time he has downplayed his form coming in to Tour De San Luis, though. This is what he said ahead of the race in 2012:

"I'm giving priority to having more base in order to be fresher during the main objectives of the season. The training data is good and what I intend now is to hone my weight gradually."

Pretty much the exact same thing.

yeah, but then he got sanctioned and had to change his plans, so we don't know how he would have been in 2012

 

[R0BL4MBT0N]

Not to burst your bubble, but Froome didn't try to shake off Contador as such. He was going for the stage win. Taking time on Contador is of no importance to Froome right now, so I hardly think i had any interest in wasting energy in order to really distance Contador.

If I were Contador, I wouldn't like to think about what Froome could have managed had he tried to put the hammer down earlier on the climb. He was obviously stronger than Contador, which was made agonizingly clear by the resignation in Contadors face when he finally had to let go of Froome's wheel. He cracked, simple as that.

But I agree, i think they will be close in the mountains in the tour - and hopefully Contador will have to put in attacks non-stop - but today Froome was obviously stronger by som margin.

I don't necessarily agree that that's the only conclusion to take away. Contador has conceded time in the final few hundred metres of every race for a long time now. It just seems to be something he does. Not saying he didn't crack, but he certainly has previous form at this kind of time loss even when he's the best climber

 

[BabylonFell]

I don't necessarily agree that that's the only conclusion to take away. Contador has conceded time in the final few hundred metres of every race for a long time now. It just seems to be something he does. Not saying he didn't crack, but he certainly has previous form at this kind of time loss even when he's the best climber

Well, if he loses time, then one can hardly conclude that he's the best climber on the day, right?

 

[airstream]

One of Sky goals as I see is obviusly not to let Contador any stage win prior the Tour at all. In their view the main enemy shouldn't feel full force.

 

[BabylonFell]

yeah, but then he got sanctioned and had to change his plans, so we don't know how he would have been in 2012

Right you are.

It just seems weird to me, that Saxo would even be interested in a significantly slower build up, given Contadors previous efforts, if Contador really is the same rider as he was two years ago. Especially given the importance of the point ranking system and the squads general lack of depth.

My point is that Contador isn't the same rider anymore, and that Saxo-Tinkoff of course knows that, so it is absolutely plausible that they would go for a slower build up.

But his season hasn't been one long build up. Just like all the other competitors, he has had a form-peak (probably not hitting absolute top form, but then again, the same could be said for the other competitors). I still can't see it as anything other than a sign of weakness that he hasn't been able to challenge Froome even once.

Maybe he has just had a bad spring. It happens.

 

[Pulpstar]

Well, if he loses time, then one can hardly conclude that he's the best climber on the day, right?

In the Vuelta he was pipped by Jrod (Steep gradients) (And Froome early on (Shallow gradients/flat/descents). His climb 'finishing' is not the best but he retained alot of strength the whole way through the 3 week tour and has the guts and balls to keep attacking throughout. I fully expect Froome to be pipping Contador even if he gets himself to top shape through most of the Tour De France. The question is will he gain enough time if/when he does a long range attack to make up his losses in the TT (Will not be as much as the Dauphine TT I think) and the various mountain 'pips' by Froome.
If Froome does a long one that sticks at any point the Tour is of course completely over.