Teams & Riders Alberto Contador Discussion Thread

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LaFlorecita

LaFlorecita

May 15, 2011
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karlboss said:
IMHO Contador has all the attributes to be a great classics rider, the only attribute missing is experience. In 11 years he's done 14 1.HC and above one day races, and of those 14, 6 are since his comeback. 14 is matched by Nibali in 3 years. Rodriguez has 18 in 3 years. However for someone relatively inexperienced his results are very good. He'll have a shot at the worlds for sure, but quite a bit depends on the tactics the team employs.
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That is a good point. I think so too.
 
LaFlorecita

LaFlorecita

May 15, 2011
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hrotha said:
As it so happens, there are other stage races after the Tour. Even assuming he could never do anything in the classics (which is a bit silly - is he less well equipped for them than, say, Kreuziger?), there's other races he could do.

Especially considering he should try to make up for his terrible season.
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But he is riding one day races now - what more can you guys want.

It's hard to make up for a terrible season (which would not be terrible for 99% of the peloton) when you're still terrible. In fact I think he's gotten worse. He couldn't even stay with the peloton in Plouay :eek:
 
Red Rick

Red Rick

Feb 20, 2012
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Contador mainly focusses on GT's because they suit him the most. They contain tt's, a lot of real climbing and recovery is important in them. He's just playing to his strenght. I have no doubt he could be a contender in all the really hilly classics. The problem is that he needs either staggering form to drop everyone on a <2km hill (not real climbing) and solo to victory or he'll have to be very lucky to make precisely the right move. A lot of other pure climbers without a sprint preceded him in competed in the ardennes (like the Schlecks and Boogerd). But reaching your first major peak in the ardennes compromises your chances for the GT's you want to win.

I do blame him however for never taking a serious shot at the worlds (mainly in 2009) Oft times he just didn't race La Vuelta cause he was tired from the Tour, even if the worlds was quite hilly.

Also Hitch, you make some great posts, but I think you're overestimating the difficulty of the main climb. It's not a climb where you can just drop everybody never to be seen again untill the medal ceremony. A lot of riders and commentators are now saying it's rather a climb where every lap a few more riders are dropped from the back.

In a perfect scenario however Contador might get away with Nibali for example and they reach the finish together. I've always wandered who's the slower sprinter.:p
 
murali

murali

Nov 26, 2012
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Red Rick said:
Contador mainly focusses on GT's because they suit him the most.

snip

In a perfect scenario however Contador might get away with Nibali for example and they reach the finish together. I've always wandered who's the slower sprinter.:p
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Lions have a less than 1 in 20 kill rate in the wild. My simple question is: how many GTs did AC race to win, and how many times he podiumed. Instead of podiumed, if i ask, how many he won, its still better than lions. Lions are the kings of jungle, and AC is better than them.

Let me ask you a simple question. How much prize money can a rider get by winning all the monuments? Compare that with just the TdF. Contador mainly focuses on TdF because thats what the teams want him to do. In place of Riis, if it was anyone else, they would still like Contador to do the TdF alone, than go for the other set of races he could have won. Contador focuses on GTs, because that is what is expected out of him.

Another problem with classics is that they don't have a definitive result. Cancellara, this year, just got lucky that other teams didn't employ the hundred tactics that they could have applied to stop him from winning. ffs, he sprinted for a win. How can you expect Contador to come in top form to all the classics and win all of them, especially if the trade-off is to lose the chance to compete in a lucrative GT.

I am pretty sure that if he wanted to win the worlds, he will do it. I have never heard him definitively stating that he is going to win a particular worlds. All i have heard so far is "preparing for worlds" as a team mate. You make him team leader fir Spain for three consecutive years, with an appropriate racing and training schedule and a favorable route, and he will win at least one among them.

To those who want him to win worlds to be accepted as a legend, all i can say is go to hell. or as is norm in this thread, accuse of being a fair-weather fan. Even non-AC fans can accept that he is already a once-in-a-lifetime rider.

you didn't say whether it was a 2-man sprint. i was thinking that someone else will win the sprint :rolleyes:
 
Red Rick

Red Rick

Feb 20, 2012
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murali said:
Lions have a less than 1 in 20 kill rate in the wild. My simple question is: how many GTs did AC race to win, and how many times he podiumed. Instead of podiumed, if i ask, how many he won, its still better than lions. Lions are the kings of jungle, and AC is better than them.

Let me ask you a simple question. How much prize money can a rider get by winning all the monuments? Compare that with just the TdF. Contador mainly focuses on TdF because thats what the teams want him to do. In place of Riis, if it was anyone else, they would still like Contador to do the TdF alone, than go for the other set of races he could have won. Contador focuses on GTs, because that is what is expected out of him.

I am pretty sure that if he wanted to win the worlds, he will do it. I have never heard him definitively stating that he is going to win a particular worlds. All i have heard so far is "preparing for worlds" as a team mate. You make him team leader fir Spain for three consecutive years, with an appropriate racing and training schedule and a favorable route, and he will win at least one among them.

To those who want him to win worlds to be accepted as a legend, all i can say is go to hell. or as is norm in this thread, accuse of being a fair-weather fan. Even non-AC fans can accept that he is already a once-in-a-lifetime rider.

you didn't say whether it was a 2-man sprint. i was thinking that someone else will win the sprint :rolleyes:
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1. prize money is completely irrelevant
2. There very few WRR routs that truly favour Contador. In top shape he'll drop anyone one a selective climb. However, it takes other quality's to drop everyone on a 1km hill, no matter how steep. If he doesn't drop everyone, he'll have to make solo attacks or be lucky enough that the guy that's able to follow him is even a worse sprinter than him. Spain has just too much riders that are at least equal on the hills and have a way better chance of winning a group sprint. WRR's alway's finish on a circuit, and it's really hard to make a circuit through a city if you want to include a steep 5km climb (which would make Contador a big favourite in his prime years).
3. that was an example of getting away with someone against whom he has a chance of winning a sprint
 
The Hitch

The Hitch

Jun 14, 2010
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LaFlorecita said:
Of course not. Even with Contador in 2011 form there would be Purito, Valverde and Moreno from his own team who would outsprint him any day of the week. So would some of the Colombians for example Uran and Betancur. Nibali would maybe not outsprint him but would certainly a better bet. Cance and Phil would outsprint him.
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Cav can also outsprint Contador. So can Greipel. Degenkolb. Kittel. Pettachi even though he is retired. Rojas. Ventoso. Sagan of course. Coquard, Demare, Bouhanni, EBH. etc.

And, what does any of that have to do with the 2013 worlds?

To try and explain this to you in races you might recollect. Contador rode the 2012 GDL. THat race was won by J Rodriguez who you say is a favourite because he can sprint a little. Purito won solo after attacking on the hill 9k out from the finish. In Firenze its not 9k to the finish from the final hill but 5km. If Rodriguez can win solo a race which has 9k of flat at the end, how is a harder race with less flat at the end a guaranteed bunch sprint?
 
LaFlorecita

LaFlorecita

May 15, 2011
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The Hitch said:
Cav can also outsprint Contador. So can Greipel. Degenkolb. Kittel. Pettachi even though he is retired. Rojas. Ventoso. Sagan of course. Coquard, Demare, Bouhanni, EBH. etc.

And, what does any of that have to do with the 2013 worlds?

To try and explain this to you in races you might recollect. Contador rode the 2012 GDL. THat race was won by J Rodriguez who you say is a favourite because he can sprint a little. Purito won solo after attacking on the hill 9k out from the finish. In Firenze its not 9k to the finish from the final hill but 5km. If Rodriguez can win solo a race which has 9k of flat at the end, how is a harder race with less flat at the end a guaranteed bunch sprint?
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It's not. But Contador has never shown to be able to solo to the finish in a one day race. He has no experience riding for the win in classics. So the chance of him winning a one day race is very, very small. You have to take into account that this is not the Contador who could ride away from everyone whenever he wanted to. If anything he'll dropped when, for example, Nibali makes a move. How in hell is he gonna win? The only possible scenario I can see is him going in a breakaway with a fre laps to go and outclimbing his breakaway companions.
 
N

notrolfsorensen

Oct 2, 2012
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LaFlorecita said:
Wowzers. :(
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Don't worry. The secret pro only spills BS. He is way off mark on the wage thing of Contador and seemingly think's Tinkoff is ok to spew the sh*t he did, so I wouldn't think too much of him. In fact, I don't understand why we should believe him in anything. So far he have been off the mark everytime.
 
LaFlorecita

LaFlorecita

May 15, 2011
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notrolfsorensen said:
Don't worry. The secret pro only spills BS. He is way off mark on the wage thing of Contador and seemingly think's Tinkoff is ok to spew the sh*t he did, so I wouldn't think too much of him. In fact, I don't understand why we should believe him in anything. So far he have been off the mark everytime.
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That is true
 
jyhjyh

jyhjyh

Oct 10, 2011
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notrolfsorensen said:
.... and seemingly think's Tinkoff is ok to spew the sh*t he did, so I wouldn't think too much of him. In fact, I don't understand why we should believe him in anything. So far he have been off the mark everytime.
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What :confused:

The Secret Pro says:
Oleg Tinkoff came into pro cycling again thinking that they were going to clean up and dominate everything. They didn’t and he pulls his sponsorship. And what kind of message does it send when he says things on twitter like:

Twitter @olegtinkov
'His salary doesn't match his performance. Too rich and isn't hungry, that's my opinion, and I deserve it. He must work harder'

Twitter @olegtinkov
'Conta performance wasn't good. He need to change many things in his preparation and be more PRO. Will he do that? That's the question...'

That doesn’t help anyone. It’s a shame that Bjarne needs his money to keep running.
 
murali

murali

Nov 26, 2012
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Red Rick said:
1. prize money is completely irrelevant
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you left my comparison with lion's kill rate. The point i was making was that contador hasn't won, simply because he had never actually targeted such races. my point was that he is very dedicated; and if he set his mind to it, then he will achieve all the things.

regarding prize money, you can always take it as a reflection of the returns expected from the races. high paying races have a larger following and get a larger sponsorship. in essence, the prize money can be looked as a valid metric for comparing the relative significance of a race. (eff the exceptions)

i get your reference to the actual number of winnable races, but a race suited for AC will come. Also, no one knows when a lady luck shines on the brave. Bravery is one attribute that you can never deny wrt AC.
 
The Hitch

The Hitch

Jun 14, 2010
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LaFlorecita said:
You have to take into account that this is not the Contador who could ride away from everyone whenever he wanted to.
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Ummm

LaFlorecita said:
Of course not. Even with Contador in 2011 form there would be Purito, Valverde and Moreno from his own team who would outsprint him any day of the week. .
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:cool:
 
LaFlorecita

LaFlorecita

May 15, 2011
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The Hitch said:
Ummm



:cool:
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You are confused I think. I believe Contador would have a decent chance in great form, but I don't believe he would be top favorite as you claimed. He isn't in great form though, his form is outrageous so he only has a very very small chance.
 
Race Radio

Race Radio

Aug 13, 2009
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Riis and Tinkof are not the only partners having troubles with Contador. Have to wonder if people are less willing put up with things if he isn't winning?

Back in 09 Bruyneel and his buddies were ruthless in smearing Contador. Seems to be a pattern developing
 
Netserk

Netserk

Apr 30, 2011
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The Hitch said:
Cav can also outsprint Contador. So can Greipel. Degenkolb. Kittel. Pettachi even though he is retired. Rojas. Ventoso. Sagan of course. Coquard, Demare, Bouhanni, EBH. etc.

And, what does any of that have to do with the 2013 worlds?

To try and explain this to you in races you might recollect. Contador rode the 2012 GDL. THat race was won by J Rodriguez who you say is a favourite because he can sprint a little. Purito won solo after attacking on the hill 9k out from the finish. In Firenze its not 9k to the finish from the final hill but 5km. If Rodriguez can win solo a race which has 9k of flat at the end, how is a harder race with less flat at the end a guaranteed bunch sprint?
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Did you just compare the final hill of Lombardia with the one in Firenze? :confused: :eek:
 
LaFlorecita

LaFlorecita

May 15, 2011
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Race Radio said:
Riis and Tinkof are not the only partners having troubles with Contador. Have to wonder if people are less willing put up with things if he isn't winning?

Back in 09 Bruyneel and his buddies were ruthless in smearing Contador. Seems to be a pattern developing
Click to expand...

:D Sorry :D
 
Red Rick

Red Rick

Feb 20, 2012
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The Hitch said:
Cav can also outsprint Contador. So can Greipel. Degenkolb. Kittel. Pettachi even though he is retired. Rojas. Ventoso. Sagan of course. Coquard, Demare, Bouhanni, EBH. etc.

And, what does any of that have to do with the 2013 worlds?

To try and explain this to you in races you might recollect. Contador rode the 2012 GDL. THat race was won by J Rodriguez who you say is a favourite because he can sprint a little. Purito won solo after attacking on the hill 9k out from the finish. In Firenze its not 9k to the finish from the final hill but 5km. If Rodriguez can win solo a race which has 9k of flat at the end, how is a harder race with less flat at the end a guaranteed bunch sprint?
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Hitch, you're don't realise that the hill at the worlds is only 6% average for 4km. GdL had a HC climb in the beginning and Muro di Sormano 50km from the finish, which is enough to make sure there are only climbers left. The final hill (3km at 9% or something close to that) is also much more suited to drop the competition.

I still agree he should give it a serious shot though;)
 
Netserk

Netserk

Apr 30, 2011
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