Armstrong statement imminent! Email exchanges to be revealed

[Anonymous]

Everybody keep calm, please. Both sides are entitled to air their views, but it must be done politely and reasonably.

Ssuan

Sorry Ssuan

 

[kurtinsc]

What an odd e-mail chain.

Not sure how to read it at all. Floyd is obviously using a heavy dose of sarcasm (such as the part where he mocks the ToC for being sponsored by a drug company that made EPO while trying to get a spot).

But there's nothing directly damaging for Floyd either... it's no great win for Lance.

 

[Anonymous]

Everybody keep calm, please. Both sides are entitled to air their views, but it must be done politely and reasonably.

Ssuan

Susan....did you deliberately misspell Susan just to **** with us?

 

[pkreed71]

Agree. Just from these emails, Haters are looking at contents. Lovers are looking for motives. Hopefully when Armstrong retires, they both go away. Long live cycling!

What really bothers me most is that I am disappointed. I have spent untold amount of time watching races and cheering on many of them because they can do what I cannot. I love the tactics and the mind games and the sheer force of will they bring to each stage.

Now I ask, why bother? Why should I believe that anyone who claims "I'm clean" truly is clean?

 

[pkreed71]

i do wish they had published them in chronological order.. its really annoying having to read from the bottom of the page, upwards.

Ok, that point we both can agree on. I'll allow it this once.

 

[kurtinsc]

What really bothers me most is that I am disappointed. I have spent untold amount of time watching races and cheering on many of them because they can do what I cannot. I love the tactics and the mind games and the sheer force of will they bring to each stage.

Now I ask, why bother? Why should I believe that anyone who claims "I'm clean" truly is clean?

You can take my approach.

I just look at guys racing on bikes and find it entertaining. To be perfectly honest... I'm okay with whatever level of doping is going on... I don't care if they're clean.

I just want to see a good race.



The only reason I follow the doping stuff is I do like to know who will actually be eligible to race... and doping suspensions are a part of that now.

 

[Moose McKnuckles]

You can take my approach.

I just look at guys racing on bikes and find it entertaining. To be perfectly honest... I'm okay with whatever level of doping is going on... I don't care if they're clean.
I just want to see a good race.
The only reason I follow the doping stuff is I do like to know who will actually be eligible to race... and doping suspensions are a part of that now.

Watching 7 guys from the same jacked team hammer up a climb when everyone else has 1 maybe 2 teammates left isn't a "good race". It's garbage, and even Chris Horner called it out a couple of years ago. Everyone knows it's bs. That's not bike racing.

 

[perico]

Boy it's pretty one-sided here. Lance fanboys on other sites and only Lance haters here. No one in the middle.

I doubt anyone these days is going to fake/edit emails. It's too easy to get copies from various points in the food chain. And particularly not ones that copy in Steve Johnson. So the first page of posts in this thread is silly Lance hating.

As for the rest of it, I do have sympathy for Dr. Kay, though the ride on Radioshack thing is kind of weird. TOC and Radioshack don't come out looking great, but I suspect they are feeling like disclosing everything short of actual dopiing is their best policy.

I'm in the middle. I don't have a nagging hatred for Armstrong, nor do I subscribe to the theory of a saint who could do no wrong.

 

[kurtinsc]

Watching 7 guys from the same jacked team hammer up a climb when everyone else has 1 maybe 2 teammates left isn't a "good race". It's garbage, and even Chris Horner called it out a couple of years ago. Everyone knows it's bs. That's not bike racing.

I haven't seen races like that much in the last 10 years.

If I did, I might feel otherwise... but right now the doping seems spread out enough that there are only ever 2-3 top guys per team.

10 guys juiced up racing against each other is pretty much the same as 10 guys clean racing against each other. It's 10 guys racing either way.

 

[perico]

I see there are two threads on this.

My take is the emails are polite and courteous, but they do appear to show that Landis was suggesting he be allowed to ride the TOC or he would make public his claims about Armstrong. There is passive aggression. It's not like an argument on a forum.

That's my take on it as well. I too get the sense of passive aggressiveness. They don't read as all that d--ning the first go around, but I do get the sense that when you read between the lines, it can come across that way.

 

[richwagmn]

Everybody keep calm, please. Both sides are entitled to air their views, but it must be done politely and reasonably.

Ssuan

This. Unfortunately, too many people mistake a clever insult for a well made argument.

If someone won't listen to reason, there's no reason to continue talking with them.

 

[frenchfry]

i do wish they had published them in chronological order.. its really annoying having to read from the bottom of the page, upwards.

Just turn your screen upside down - works like a charm!

 

[Moose McKnuckles]

I haven't seen races like that much in the last 10 years.

If I did, I might feel otherwise... but right now the doping seems spread out enough that there are only ever 2-3 top guys per team.

10 guys juiced up racing against each other is pretty much the same as 10 guys clean racing against each other. It's 10 guys racing either way.

Did you not watch the TdF during the Lance years? Are you kidding me?
I mean, really. Look at what Chris Horner said about it. Watching a team arrive at the bottom of the last climb with 5-6 guys and everyone else has one? That was the Postal "train".

 

[Road Hazard]

All I can see from these emails is that Floyd needs to learn the value of period when writing. The emails are not really that crazy, but it makes me wonder what the Radioshack legal team have held back for further use.
Obviously Landis has nothing left to lose except what little self-respect he had left. For his sake he had better have some substantial evidence or the laughing will just get worse.

In the end, it doesn't really matter, does it? The Armstrong haters will still rant and rave and hate. The Armstrong followers will cry foul and demand Landis' head on a platter and the rest of us sit by and watch the car wreck happening right in fron of us. It's kinda sad, really.

Your probably right. If Landis had "fingered" anyone else, and approached it in the same way (float the idea, delay while waiting for offers) most people would probably call him out as an opportunist who is really no better and no more honest than any past or present doper.

But people's hatred for Armstrong (which I share to a great extent) are apparently driving people to view Landis as a white hat. Anyone pointing out the glaring sploches of black are called Livestrong interns who are "spinning." The enemy of my enemy is my friend I suppose.

Alright Armstrong haters, ignore the interns and go ahead and contribute to Landis's new donation fund as soon as he creates it, and buy the new book you know is coming out.

I for one will consider both of them tarnished and neither donate to Livestrong nor to the Landis Defense-Turned-Clean-Up-Cycling-Or-Get-Me-A-Job-Fund.

 

[janus1969]

...Landis Defense-Turned-Clean-Up-Cycling-Or-Get-Me-A-Job-Fund.

ROTFLMAO!

While I agree that the emails don't seem particularly damning, it does indicate that Floyd was willing to accept an either/or, which DOES indicate a quid pro quo in law...

 

[Roland Rat]

Oh Jesus wept.

To all you Livestong muppets (if there is in fact more than one person posting), why do you bother? Do you seriously think all of your spin is going to make the slightest bit of difference? This is an internet forum - do you seriously think this forum has the slightest influence on anything or anyone with any input into the investigaton? And do you seriously think you are going to change anyone's mind? Seriously, give it up!

 

[mr. tibbs]

Why is all of this posted on Livestrong? Every view makes Armstrong a little more $, and you can bet there are a lot of viewers. Thanks for the copypasta, guys, b/c I am definitely NOT going to that site.

 

[thehog]

Why is all of this posted on Livestrong? Every view makes Armstrong a little more $, and you can bet there are a lot of viewers. Thanks for the copypasta, guys, b/c I am definitely NOT going to that site.

There is some classic comments over there:

Here's a good one:

do not want to believe lance cheated nor do any of the cancer patients who support him and his foundation, but it is hard to think that he didn't when so many people around him did. Landis discription is detailed to even include Lances ex-wife. At the same time it ****es me off that Landis is doing this out of spite not the benefit of cycling. It is sad to me, and who knows really who telling the truth. Mcquaid is on a witch hunt for Lance so he will most likely support Landis's cause that is for sure.


Followed by:

Let it go. At some point, you have to accept objective evidence and get away from conspiracy theories. Have you ever thought hat the reason Lance wins is because he is both a physiologic freak AND meticulous beyond words? There's a reason why he used to be called "Millimeter Mike". Go curl up with "Every Second Counts"

 

[Roland Rat]

There is some classic comments over there:

Here's a good one:

[snip] Mcquaid is on a witch hunt for Lance so he will most likely support Landis's cause that is for sure.

Wait, what? I must have missed that press release.

 

[Anonymous]

There is some classic comments over there:

Here's a good one:

do not want to believe lance cheated nor do any of the cancer patients who support him and his foundation, but it is hard to think that he didn't when so many people around him did. Landis discription is detailed to even include Lances ex-wife. At the same time it ****es me off that Landis is doing this out of spite not the benefit of cycling. It is sad to me, and who knows really who telling the truth. Mcquaid is on a witch hunt for Lance so he will most likely support Landis's cause that is for sure.


Followed by:

Let it go. At some point, you have to accept objective evidence and get away from conspiracy theories. Have you ever thought hat the reason Lance wins is because he is both a physiologic freak AND meticulous beyond words? There's a reason why he used to be called "Millimeter Mike". Go curl up with "Every Second Counts"

wow...they ARE actually getting confused eh? I did a Phd in philosophy a long time ago...and we would destroy essentially theological arguments like this all of the time in class for cheezits...but it all comes down to this: THEY NEED TO BELIEVE...sad and pathetic, but true...like they need to believe so and so who is having a baby on the cover of people is a ethical chick ect ect...fill your own things in here...it's like folks who have a child die...the only way to handle it is to say, god wanted her...same with armstrong and cancer and the media ***** shop via truth...he worked that thing, hard...he worked it hard...his Dad would be proud of him...

 

[Anonymous]

heres a good one

by Allycs on May 21, 2010 at 2:57 PM

Armstrong is THE most tested athlete in the history of professional sports.He was tested at the end of EVERY stage in each Tour de France that that he has ridden in since his comeback from cancer.Blood and urine......CLEAN

 

[I Watch Cycling In July]

Two Lance muppets have a face-to-face discussion.

Cheek to cheek discussion - talking out of their shared arsehole

Edit: woot! autowrangle changed

 

[Anonymous]

heres a good one

by Allycs on May 21, 2010 at 2:57 PM

Armstrong is THE most tested athlete in the history of professional sports.He was tested at the end of EVERY stage in each Tour de France that that he has ridden in since his comeback from cancer.Blood and urine......CLEAN

christ!...almost like the christ myth itself....perhaps someday the UCI will have his blood in vials buried in its wall vault for tourists...like some sorta weird fetish object...could be a moneymaker...fat Mcquail could do the tour for believers...very holy!

 

[trompe le monde]

heres a good one

by Allycs on May 21, 2010 at 2:57 PM

Armstrong is THE most tested athlete in the history of professional sports.He was tested at the end of EVERY stage in each Tour de France that that he has ridden in since his comeback from cancer.Blood and urine......CLEAN

I like how the capitalized words function. I think to myself, reading the sentence Lance is the most tested athlete....tested at every stage....clean etc and think, well, there may be facts that counter those claims. But after rereading it and noticing those words in all caps in their 12 point vortex of capitalized glory - oh and it is a vortex that will suck you in - I'm completely convinced by the Lance rhetoric. Nothing says conviction like a word in all caps.

Sorry dudes, I've joined the dark side.

CAPS LOCK PWNS LANDIS!!!1

 

[I Watch Cycling In July]

Of course this is the point.....People read press releases and rehash those talking points.....

You said it, Mrs JM said it, but since a lot of silliness is being written, I'm gonna say it again.

Media war 101.
Step 1: Issue strongly worded press release from lawyer
Step 2: Claim you have information that backs up your press release
Step 3: Wait for journalists to quote press release but not report whether the evidence claims have any merit
Step 4: Relax in the knowledge that most people will assume you have the evidence you say you have and not bother to actually read it.

Here's my favorite example of an excerpt from the Team RadioShack website:

------ Forwarded Message
From: "Brent W. Kay, M.D."
Date: Mon, 3 May 2010 17:58:16 -0500

I talked to Floyd and he really doesn't want to do it, he doesn't want anything so it's hard to know what to do.