Teams & Riders Chris Froome Discussion Thread.

[jmdirt]

Froome won this Tour on the short opening ITT:

After stage 1:

Froome
Bardet :39
Uran :51

After stage 18:

Froome
Bardet :23
Uran :29

Plus...

Stage 1 Valverde DNF.

Stage 9 Porte DNF.

Only 2 riders all season who have shown GC potential that could have rattled Froome other than Landa and Dumoulin.

I'll say it, Big Tom would win this Tour if he raced it in his Giro form.

Quintana would have won this Tour as well, had he turned up in his Giro form. Only just, but he'd have won it. He'd only need a Blockhaus stage to win this.

Froome, and Sky, got very lucky this time around. Sure, it's not over yet. But barring a misfortune, which I don't want, Sky and Froome executed a well thought out plan. He was on the ropes several times. A Valverde or Porte level shown earlier in the season would have knocked him out.

No way could Froome have prevented a strong Valverde gaining all those bonus seconds on the short sharp finishes. He'd have won all of them. Easily.

But the race is who turns up on the day. On that note, Kwiatkowski and Landa earned their keep big time...Sky were very solid and secure. Well done to them.

If we play enough ifs, I could win the TdF!

 

[TMP402]

Re: Re:

I want a post before 2011 Vuelta, not some retroactive stories that makes no sense.

Taxus claims he wrote about him in 2008, so we'll just have to wait for him...

 

[TMP402]

Re: Re:

i imagine this experiment will be put to bed now if he wins this year, once he has the tour/vuelta double in his pocket there is no way he risks coming in this undercooked again, if LRP was here i'd give him a 25% chance of success.

Was it just because he was under cooked ? Before the Tour he hadn't won a race, in the Dauphine he looked below his best. He should win this race unless Uran does the TT of his career but he's hardly been convincing. Last year wasn't regular Froome neither is this year and both times some people assume it's because he wants to win the Vuelta as well, or he has under trained which is very unlikely for someone with Froome's experience. Next year he will be riding for a record equaling Tour victory and he won't be thinking about the Vuelta but something tells me that Froome will find it no easier than this year.

I think the Froome of old is gone or seems to be. Of course he can win next year but he showed this year that he is beatable even with the best team. Porte and Valverde crashing out changed the dynamics of the race and Martin has also been riding injured and Quintana had done the Giro. None of those riders may have won this year but they would have made the race more aggressive and even though Froome has the TT advantage he has never looked more vulnerable in the mountains not since 2011 anyway. Froome hasn't made one attack stick in the mountains which is unusual for him. You can only win, and he will increase his margin in the TT you would think but it will be interesting to see how he goes in the Vuelta and the next Tour. The way he climbed in this race, the so called anti Froome course may have been a blessing. In his current form I don't think he would have wanted more MTFs.

Well, maybe it has been the best team in this Tour, but it's not Sky's most lethal team ever. Thomas crashed, Henao I haven't seen take a single pull all Tour, so I'd say Froome has really had six team-mates. Nieve has had good moments, Kwiatkowski has been outstanding for his capabilities, and Landa has been a good last man in the mountains. But it's not some super-galactic team. Replace Henao with a 2016-level Poels and remove Thomas' injury, then you'd be talking.

 

[Angliru]

Re:

ah, let finally taxus feel free about his often delusional admiration for froome, eventually big champions ought to have lots of fan exaggerrations surrounding them. froome is not at his best, but the question is more like does he still have the capacity to go back to his best, that is under big doubt imo. I'm not even completely sure he'll try to win the Vuelta this year. The Tour win obviously is taking an immense effort from him, a much bigger one than he expected at the end of last season imo.

I thought the belief for Froome's less than dominant performance was his concentrated effort to win both Tour and Vuelta this year. His season performance leading up to the Tour left the impression that he was focusing his energies on July and September.

 

[deValtos]

Re: Re:

I thought the belief for Froome's less than dominant performance was his concentrated effort to win both Tour and Vuelta this year. His season performance leading up to the Tour left the impression that he was focusing his energies on July and September.

That was the plan but I think Froome still expected himself to be better, especially after the Dauphine I think he was a little worried. We'll have to see at the Vuelta how it goes. It's also not easy to plan where your form comes, maybe Froome will peak at the vuelta by accident and be even stronger than he was here.

I think it's more that his legs are not as great this year but Froome might surprise even himself later.

 

[movingtarget]

Re: Re:

i imagine this experiment will be put to bed now if he wins this year, once he has the tour/vuelta double in his pocket there is no way he risks coming in this undercooked again, if LRP was here i'd give him a 25% chance of success.

Was it just because he was under cooked ? Before the Tour he hadn't won a race, in the Dauphine he looked below his best. He should win this race unless Uran does the TT of his career but he's hardly been convincing. Last year wasn't regular Froome neither is this year and both times some people assume it's because he wants to win the Vuelta as well, or he has under trained which is very unlikely for someone with Froome's experience. Next year he will be riding for a record equaling Tour victory and he won't be thinking about the Vuelta but something tells me that Froome will find it no easier than this year.

I think the Froome of old is gone or seems to be. Of course he can win next year but he showed this year that he is beatable even with the best team. Porte and Valverde crashing out changed the dynamics of the race and Martin has also been riding injured and Quintana had done the Giro. None of those riders may have won this year but they would have made the race more aggressive and even though Froome has the TT advantage he has never looked more vulnerable in the mountains not since 2011 anyway. Froome hasn't made one attack stick in the mountains which is unusual for him. You can only win, and he will increase his margin in the TT you would think but it will be interesting to see how he goes in the Vuelta and the next Tour. The way he climbed in this race, the so called anti Froome course may have been a blessing. In his current form I don't think he would have wanted more MTFs.

Well, maybe it has been the best team in this Tour, but it's not Sky's most lethal team ever. Thomas crashed, Henao I haven't seen take a single pull all Tour, so I'd say Froome has really had six team-mates. Nieve has had good moments, Kwiatkowski has been outstanding for his capabilities, and Landa has been a good last man in the mountains. But it's not some super-galactic team. Replace Henao with a 2016-level Poels and remove Thomas' injury, then you'd be talking.

Maybe but compared to Aru's team and Uran's team or even BMC ? AG2R did well, Movistar did nothing even Contador's team was weak except for Mollema and Pantano on one or two stages. Still Sky was the best team in the race, and Dan Martin had most of his team working for Kittel. Sunweb were probably the most cohesive team but they didn't have to worry about GC. What other team had a Kwia or a Landa ? Poels would have been there if not for his injury. Thomas was a loss but he can't seem to stop crashing. Henao was a passenger, maybe he was ill ? And next year the teams drop to 8 riders which some pundits think is a mistake. I suppose they are thinking of grand tours and illness and crashes. One team was down to three riders in this Tour.

 

[bigcog]

Perhaps he is fading with age, in which case I think will be very hard to win a 5th TDF. If he is trying to maintain form into the Vuelta this year and was building form at the start of this years TDF maybe he can win a 5th one particularly if next year he just concentrates on the TDF. Of course it also depends on the route for 2018. Maybe he thinks he can win 6

 

[miguelindurain111]

Winning Tour, Vuelta and Worlds ITT in the same year would be cool.

 

[silvergrenade]

Re:

Winning Tour, Vuelta and Worlds ITT in the same year would be cool.

Not cool(On this Forum)
The Froome Only Thread is around 1200 pages. If he does the double *and* wins the Worlds ITT...well, there will be carnage. :lol: :lol:

 

[Angliru]

Re: Re:

i imagine this experiment will be put to bed now if he wins this year, once he has the tour/vuelta double in his pocket there is no way he risks coming in this undercooked again, if LRP was here i'd give him a 25% chance of success.

Was it just because he was under cooked ? Before the Tour he hadn't won a race, in the Dauphine he looked below his best. He should win this race unless Uran does the TT of his career but he's hardly been convincing. Last year wasn't regular Froome neither is this year and both times some people assume it's because he wants to win the Vuelta as well, or he has under trained which is very unlikely for someone with Froome's experience. Next year he will be riding for a record equaling Tour victory and he won't be thinking about the Vuelta but something tells me that Froome will find it no easier than this year.

I think the Froome of old is gone or seems to be. Of course he can win next year but he showed this year that he is beatable even with the best team. Porte and Valverde crashing out changed the dynamics of the race and Martin has also been riding injured and Quintana had done the Giro. None of those riders may have won this year but they would have made the race more aggressive and even though Froome has the TT advantage he has never looked more vulnerable in the mountains not since 2011 anyway. Froome hasn't made one attack stick in the mountains which is unusual for him. You can only win, and he will increase his margin in the TT you would think but it will be interesting to see how he goes in the Vuelta and the next Tour. The way he climbed in this race, the so called anti Froome course may have been a blessing. In his current form I don't think he would have wanted more MTFs.

Well, maybe it has been the best team in this Tour, but it's not Sky's most lethal team ever. Thomas crashed, Henao I haven't seen take a single pull all Tour, so I'd say Froome has really had six team-mates. Nieve has had good moments, Kwiatkowski has been outstanding for his capabilities, and Landa has been a good last man in the mountains. But it's not some super-galactic team. Replace Henao with a 2016-level Poels and remove Thomas' injury, then you'd be talking.

What does this say that a couple of their domestiques underperformed and one crashed out and they still had few problems controlling the race? It can't be said often enough the perks of having the depth of talent on one roster that Sky has and the burden it relieves from their protected rider.

 

[DNP-Old]

Re:

Winning Tour, Vuelta and Worlds ITT in the same year would be cool.

Froome has been pretty disappointing in one-day timetrials. Seems like a totally different discipline than just a timetrial in a stage race. Doubt he stands a chance against Dumoulin or even Roglic and Kiryienka.

 

[Angliru]

Re: Re:

I thought the belief for Froome's less than dominant performance was his concentrated effort to win both Tour and Vuelta this year. His season performance leading up to the Tour left the impression that he was focusing his energies on July and September.

That was the plan but I think Froome still expected himself to be better, especially after the Dauphine I think he was a little worried. We'll have to see at the Vuelta how it goes. It's also not easy to plan where your form comes, maybe Froome will peak at the vuelta by accident and be even stronger than he was here.

I think it's more that his legs are not as great this year but Froome might surprise even himself later.

I agree (the bolded text) It was uncharted waters for him this year, but he should have something left in the tank for the Vuelta. I know someone here questioned if he were going to go through with it and chase the Tour/Vuelta double after this semi-close call at the Tour, but I just don't see him passing it up.

 

[silvergrenade]

Re: Re:

Winning Tour, Vuelta and Worlds ITT in the same year would be cool.

Froome has been pretty disappointing in one-day timetrials. Seems like a totally different discipline than just a timetrial in a stage race. Doubt he stands a chance against Dumoulin or even Kiriyenka.

He's had a bronze in Olympics Twice. :surprised:

 

[miguelindurain111]

Re: Re:

Winning Tour, Vuelta and Worlds ITT in the same year would be cool.

Not cool(On this Forum)
The Froome Only Thread is around 1200 pages. If he does the double *and* wins the Worlds ITT...well, there will be carnage. :lol: :lol:

That would triple the pleasure getting from the triple and would be extra cool :lol:

 

[DNP-Old]

Re: Re:

Winning Tour, Vuelta and Worlds ITT in the same year would be cool.

Froome has been pretty disappointing in one-day timetrials. Seems like a totally different discipline than just a timetrial in a stage race. Doubt he stands a chance against Dumoulin or even Kiriyenka.

He's had a bronze in Olympics Twice. :surprised:

Says a lot when he finishes 3rd and it's considered 'disappointing'. He wins timetrials in stage races. He put nearly a minute on Castroviejo who was in the form of his life this past Vuelta. Stage racers aren't able to use their recovery in a one-day timetrial, so it's understandable.

 

[silvergrenade]

Re: Re:

Winning Tour, Vuelta and Worlds ITT in the same year would be cool.

Froome has been pretty disappointing in one-day timetrials. Seems like a totally different discipline than just a timetrial in a stage race. Doubt he stands a chance against Dumoulin or even Kiriyenka.

He's had a bronze in Olympics Twice. :surprised:

Says a lot when he finishes 3rd and it's considered disappointing. He wins timetrials in stage races. He put nearly a minute on Castroviejo who was in the form of his life this past Vuelta. Stage racers aren't able to use their recovery in a one-day timetrial.

Agree that he wont be the Number 1 TTist...
But Top 3 is amazing considering youre at GT weight while the TT specialists are really just preparing for these TTs. Nobody would consider that disappointing.

 

[DNP-Old]

Re: Re:

Winning Tour, Vuelta and Worlds ITT in the same year would be cool.

Froome has been pretty disappointing in one-day timetrials. Seems like a totally different discipline than just a timetrial in a stage race. Doubt he stands a chance against Dumoulin or even Kiriyenka.

He's had a bronze in Olympics Twice. :surprised:

Says a lot when he finishes 3rd and it's considered disappointing. He wins timetrials in stage races. He put nearly a minute on Castroviejo who was in the form of his life this past Vuelta. Stage racers aren't able to use their recovery in a one-day timetrial.

Agree that he wont be the Number 1 TTist...
But Top 3 is amazing considering youre at GT weight while the TT specialists are really just preparing for these TTs. Nobody would consider that disappointing.

That's the standard he has. Don't get me wrong, finishing 3rd is really good, but it isn't his usual.

 

[rick james]

Froome won this Tour on the short opening ITT:

After stage 1:

Froome
Bardet :39
Uran :51

After stage 18:

Froome
Bardet :23
Uran :29

Plus...

Stage 1 Valverde DNF.

Stage 9 Porte DNF.

Only 2 riders all season who have shown GC potential that could have rattled Froome other than Landa and Dumoulin.

I'll say it, Big Tom would win this Tour if he raced it in his Giro form.

Quintana would have won this Tour as well, had he turned up in his Giro form. Only just, but he'd have won it. He'd only need a Blockhaus stage to win this.

Froome, and Sky, got very lucky this time around. Sure, it's not over yet. But barring a misfortune, which I don't want, Sky and Froome executed a well thought out plan. He was on the ropes several times. A Valverde or Porte level shown earlier in the season would have knocked him out.

No way could Froome have prevented a strong Valverde gaining all those bonus seconds on the short sharp finishes. He'd have won all of them. Easily.

But the race is who turns up on the day. On that note, Kwiatkowski and Landa earned their keep big time...Sky were very solid and secure. Well done to them.

Lol, all i'm seeing is that sky and Froome are lucky to win...some are so bitter

 

[miguelindurain111]

Re: Re:

Winning Tour, Vuelta and Worlds ITT in the same year would be cool.

Froome has been pretty disappointing in one-day timetrials. Seems like a totally different discipline than just a timetrial in a stage race. Doubt he stands a chance against Dumoulin or even Kiriyenka.

He's had a bronze in Olympics Twice. :surprised:

Says a lot when he finishes 3rd and it's considered 'disappointing'. He wins timetrials in stage races. He put nearly a minute on Castroviejo who was in the form of his life this past Vuelta. Stage racers aren't able to use their recovery in a one-day timetrial, so it's understandable.

Wiggins 2012. And Froome lost only 20 secs to Martin.

 

[Angliru]

Perhaps he is fading with age, in which case I think will be very hard to win a 5th TDF. If he is trying to maintain form into the Vuelta this year and was building form at the start of this years TDF maybe he can win a 5th one particularly if next year he just concentrates on the TDF. Of course it also depends on the route for 2018. Maybe he thinks he can win 6

I recall reading him saying that he would like to win 7 Tours, which of course equals Armstrong's tally.

 

[rick james]

Perhaps he is fading with age, in which case I think will be very hard to win a 5th TDF. If he is trying to maintain form into the Vuelta this year and was building form at the start of this years TDF maybe he can win a 5th one particularly if next year he just concentrates on the TDF. Of course it also depends on the route for 2018. Maybe he thinks he can win 6

I recall reading him saying that he would like to win 7 Tours, which of course equals Armstrong's tally.

he won't, but i'd like him to get this one then look at the Giro and Vuleta, I think he will want 5 if he wins this year

 

[DNP-Old]

Re: Re:

Winning Tour, Vuelta and Worlds ITT in the same year would be cool.

Froome has been pretty disappointing in one-day timetrials. Seems like a totally different discipline than just a timetrial in a stage race. Doubt he stands a chance against Dumoulin or even Kiriyenka.

He's had a bronze in Olympics Twice. :surprised:

Says a lot when he finishes 3rd and it's considered 'disappointing'. He wins timetrials in stage races. He put nearly a minute on Castroviejo who was in the form of his life this past Vuelta. Stage racers aren't able to use their recovery in a one-day timetrial, so it's understandable.

Wiggins 2012.

Wiggins is in a class of his own and was already a very good time trialist back when Horner was considered young. I wouldn't even refer to Wiggins as a stage racer.

 

[dacooley]

porte would've won this race given the level of competition as it stands out. so would valverde. dimoulin and quintana in their 2017 giro fit would've demolished this field as well. I have a feeling all the 2015 grand tours winners could've comfortably taken this tour. in short froome is really incredibly lucky to have a chance to grab fourth tour win

 

[DNP-Old]

Going through his results, I see Froome finished 17th in Chrono des Nations just five years ago. 6:36 behind a certain Tony Martin. Pretty odd. Porte even managed to do worse at 8:00 minutes behind.

 

[silvergrenade]

Re:

Going through his results, I see Froome finished 17th in Chrono des Nations just five years ago. 6:36 behind a certain Tony Martin. Pretty odd. Porte even managed to do worse at 8:00 minutes behind.

Why is that odd?
Could be many reasons why they were bad..
Froome did both the Tour and the Vuelta in 2012...
For him the season finished at the Vuelta where he was already on his hands and knees.
Maybe he was getting paid to just show up...