Maybe every pro rider should have his own automatically generated "There's no way ___________ is clean" thread. Or is interest of space only riders who have won or podiumed a race should be included. Or how about a thread for any rider who has been associated in any way with a particular manager, doctor, or other highly suspicious character. ("there's no way XXX is clean, he was in an airport at the same time as Dr. Ferrari")
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Or in the case of Cuddles - all of the above.
Or do you think we should be like the three monkeys - see no dopers, hear no dopers, and call no dopers? I wasn't aware that this was an uncritical cult where we weren't allowed to voice our suspicions about performances.
Perhaps you'd like to write to the admins and ask them to set a threshold before we are allowed to suggest someone is doping, cos you know I missed the meeting where you were appointed to police our opinions.
As I pointed out in the first post - for someone who who has been injured/not racing, Cuddles is in eyebrow raising form, as has his team. If you disagree and think he's clean then go for it. Explain to me why I am being just too damn cynical about him, his team and his management.
Or do you think we should be like the three monkeys - see no dopers, hear no dopers, and call no dopers? I wasn't aware that this was an uncritical cult where we weren't allowed to voice our suspicions about performances.
Perhaps you'd like to write to the admins and ask them to set a threshold before we are allowed to suggest someone is doping, cos you know I missed the meeting where you were appointed to police our opinions.
As I pointed out in the first post - for someone who who has been injured/not racing, Cuddles is in eyebrow raising form, as has his team. If you disagree and think he's clean then go for it. Explain to me why I am being just too damn cynical about him, his team and his management.
Can we talk about specific evidence regarding Evens instead of automatically assuming he wins, therefore he dopes? The latter is not a very productive manner of debating, as there's no possible discussion.
What do we have against Evens?
- Team association: inevitable when you're a 34-year-old but plausibly countered by the fact that he was an outsider at T-Mobile and, partially, at Lotto.
- Came close to winning the Tour twice, in 2007 and 2008. Incidentally, he only became an actual contender post-Puerto.
- Blank. Have we heard insider rumours about him? Who has he worked with (soigneurs, doctors)? Who's his manager?
What do we have against Evens?
- Team association: inevitable when you're a 34-year-old but plausibly countered by the fact that he was an outsider at T-Mobile and, partially, at Lotto.
- Came close to winning the Tour twice, in 2007 and 2008. Incidentally, he only became an actual contender post-Puerto.
- Blank. Have we heard insider rumours about him? Who has he worked with (soigneurs, doctors)? Who's his manager?
Team management - Och and Rihs - there was plenty from Landis about them and their attitude towards doping.
And there was an article a while back saying that Evans had been getting 'training plans' from Ferrari, which Evans confirmed.
Discussed previously http://forum.cyclingnews.com/showthread.php?p=94919
And I've read elsewhere that his manager is Dirty Tony Rominger.
And there was an article a while back saying that Evans had been getting 'training plans' from Ferrari, which Evans confirmed.
Discussed previously http://forum.cyclingnews.com/showthread.php?p=94919
And I've read elsewhere that his manager is Dirty Tony Rominger.
Yes if a rider is going well there is no way they are clean. If they are going badly then they are just no good. That's the way this forum operates.
Cadel has seldom put in suprisingly good performances over the years just as he has seldom put in suprisingly bad ones. He seems best suited to hilly stage races of up to one weeks duration with a time trial such as Tour of Romandie, which he has won before with a different team. Today's time trial, where he finished behind some noted TT specialists but ahead of most of his GC rivals is unremarkable in this context.
MJM we know you don't like Cadel, but you need to come up with some better justification before throwing out doping accusations about him.
Cadel has seldom put in suprisingly good performances over the years just as he has seldom put in suprisingly bad ones. He seems best suited to hilly stage races of up to one weeks duration with a time trial such as Tour of Romandie, which he has won before with a different team. Today's time trial, where he finished behind some noted TT specialists but ahead of most of his GC rivals is unremarkable in this context.
MJM we know you don't like Cadel, but you need to come up with some better justification before throwing out doping accusations about him.
We have had this one recently, so closed here and continue there.
Please read that other one too, many points raised here have long been addressed.
BTW, type Cadel (or any other name) in the search field, and press button. It's almost magic.... some riders actually have been talked about already.
http://forum.cyclingnews.com/showthread.php?t=12114
Please read that other one too, many points raised here have long been addressed.
BTW, type Cadel (or any other name) in the search field, and press button. It's almost magic.... some riders actually have been talked about already.
http://forum.cyclingnews.com/showthread.php?t=12114
To keep the micro-managers sweet. Time to revisit a thread from three months ago. 
Cuddles and BMC having a very strong start to the season, looking like a team reborn compared to last year.
Cuddles despite injury and little racing has TA and Romandie under his belt easily beating dopers like Vino and Menchov.
BMC producing a super strong performance in RVV, Ballan partying like it's 2007-8.
Bet if it were Astana, Cack or Leotard riding there'd be a lot more flack flying.
Cuddles and BMC having a very strong start to the season, looking like a team reborn compared to last year.
Cuddles despite injury and little racing has TA and Romandie under his belt easily beating dopers like Vino and Menchov.
BMC producing a super strong performance in RVV, Ballan partying like it's 2007-8.
Bet if it were Astana, Cack or Leotard riding there'd be a lot more flack flying.
He's leading a one week long stage race against an aging Kazakh who is past his best and an Italian who is also past his best and can't time trial and a German who is really a specialist time triallist and not much else. No Contador, neither of the Schlecks or Gesink are competing. Basso below best, Menchov preparing for the Giro. No Kloden, Scarponi, Rodriguez or Leipheimer competing. Really, would Evans have to best at his best to win this race ?
I think the quality of the field is being overestimated and Evans underestimated. BMC are riding better this year but Evans is still their only rider winning anything. I don't think Evans would have to dope to win this race.
I think the quality of the field is being overestimated and Evans underestimated. BMC are riding better this year but Evans is still their only rider winning anything. I don't think Evans would have to dope to win this race.
movingtarget said:
I have no idea if Evans dopes although im generally in the 'to do well in GT GC's you have to dope group' but this race i agree with the comment above. Evans could win this one riding blind-folded with his hands cable tied behind his back
gotta love those riders that suffer some injury or get ill and come back stronger & win races...........................just saying
It shouldn't shock anyone if he was in fact doping. Doping is as ubiquitous as bartape and chainlube.
hfer07 said:
Not sure what you mean as it doesnt seem to apply to Cuddles.
He won the Fleche Wallone in 2010.
Got sick in Giro last year and finished 7th
Didnt come back stronger in TDF as was clearly tired and then suffered broken elbow. Didnt win anything the rest of the year.
In 2011 He won the Tirreno Adriatco, wasnt aware he was sick other than the elbow last July.
Crashed his bike and injured his leg and has then won the Romandie. He was strong before the injury and hasnt lost anything since.
Go Cuddles.
Hugh
hes clean atm. so whats your point?2beeDammed said:
or is it standard on this forum to accuse any recent race winner?
Mrs John Murphy said:
incorrect.
This was Michael Rogers, not Evans.
Rogers' admitted he was getting only training plans. Wonder which plan he bought, the 15% salary coaching fee, or a lesser price, cut fee plan.
There was an article on a German website circa 2006, it was a sports website, equivalent to ESPN, that linked Evans and Ferrari. It also might have been in a print edition of Suddeutsche Zeitung, but never online, so there is a contradiction, or ambiguity there. Or I may get the memory wrong, and the Suddeutsche piece may be apocryphal. They did have the best doping beat in sport after Ballester left l'Equipe when Amaury died and in came the wife and the son to change things.
My verdict would render "wrong" on the German website's mail, and they conflated Evans with Michael Rogers. Though a Dutch journo, Cyclingheroes, Rene Schuijlenburg reckoned circa Telekom time, Evans said in an interview with him he indeed was working with Ferrari. So this complicates the backgorund, and undermines evidence, it goes really fuzzy, and just becomes noise. Need a Wikileaks or Cyclingleaks of doping plans methinks.
is indeed. But if you want a line, ask Tomas Frei off the record about any team leader's encouragement on BMC cycling.
danjo007 said:
No point
I posted that back in Jan Basically if I was to rehash for you, I believe he is clean. I started this thread to find out what the opinions of others where.
Looks fresh doesn't he ? Evans is one GC rider who always looks like he has just raced over 200 kms or so. Some of the others look like they have not ridden at all. Even Tom Boonen said during the TDF a few years ago, that he had no doubts at all about Evans as a clean rider. He had no reason to say it as far as I could tell. That was just an honest opinion from a guy that has ridden in races with Evans for a long time. Evans may be eccentric and for a lot of people, hard to like but I would be surprised if he was ever implicated in anything illegal.
movingtarget said:
I remember Tommeke saying that too. If Evans is doping now and finally grabs the cache of wins he was cheated of in years past (which includes at least one Tour) I can't honestly say I'd begrudge him.
He's clearly a changed rider with a lot more confidence. I hope it's just the result of being a world champ. Whatever it is, I find myself liking the new Cuddles.
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